Victory Pete Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I have a Les Paul 12 string Gold Top. What do you suppose the wood looks like under the finish. I am considering stripping and going with a transparent amber finish to match the back. I would hate to strip the Gold only to find an ugly duckling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 When taking a look at this one: http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/Les-Paul/Gibson-Custom/Harrison-Clapton-1957-Les-Paul-Standard-Lucy.aspx you will see that it can be an accidentally looking multipart top. The following guitar shows a two-piece, center-seamed, but in no way bookmatched maple top: http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/Les-Paul/Gibson-Custom/Collectors-Choice-10-Tom-Scholz-1968-Les-Paul.aspx It seems unpredictable to me what you may find after stripping it bare. There probably will be "no-grade" timbers I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 When taking a look at this one: http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/Les-Paul/Gibson-Custom/Harrison-Clapton-1957-Les-Paul-Standard-Lucy.aspx you will see that it can be an accidentally looking multipart top. The following guitar shows a two-piece, center-seamed, but in no way bookmatched maple top: http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/Les-Paul/Gibson-Custom/Collectors-Choice-10-Tom-Scholz-1968-Les-Paul.aspx It seems unpredictable to me what you may find after stripping it bare. There probably will be "no-grade" timbers I think. Yes I think it may be like playing Russian Roulette, so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Yes I think it may be like playing Russian Roulette, so to speak. Agree on principal, but your chances to survive are waaaay bigger. ;) It also is up to you which way to go after the surprise, transparent, translucent or opaque. There could result an interesting, unique Victory Pete Translucy! Why leave such actions to George Harrison, Eric Clapton and Lucy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Your glass is half full apparently, thanks for the support! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Your glass is half full apparently, thanks for the support! You're welcome. I just drank up my glass of my grapefruit juice but will fill it again after typing this reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted January 26, 2014 Share Posted January 26, 2014 My glass is "half-empty"! Think I will top it off. I think that you are 'flirting with disaster'.....but ...."carry on" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norlinhoarderman Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I had a 70 gold top deluxe that I bought from some one who thought it would look better black..so back long ago he sanded it down to paint it. it had nice flame on all three pieces of the top so he left it natural. The tops grains didn't match well so that could be why it was originally sprayed gold instead of cherry burst. Who knows whats under the finishes but I would never take off a finish to find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Well here goes! I can see a center seam ghost image though the lacquer, so at least I think I will get a centered 2 piece anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Well here goes! I can see a center seam ghost image though the lacquer, so at least I think I will get a centered 2 piece anyway. I also guess this is very likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 So I am under way. I have determined that the stripper will melt the plastic binding so I am working from the center out. I will stop just before I get to the binding and scrape and sand by hand. I do have a 2 piece center jointed non book matched maple top. I am not sure if there are other seams until I get to the edge but I don't think it will. The maple looks good. It is slow going. There is something interesting here. The top clear coat came up in sheets, but the gold coat does not, it does not soften so easy and have to be scraped. This tells me that the gold coat is not nitro. I have done an experiment, I flooded the pickup cavity with lacquer thinner. As I suspected the nitro came right up but the gold coat did not. I bet it is poly of some kind. I added 5 new photos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yo Pete, I could have gone all day or week without seeing those pics ....Oh well, at leat its not 'vintage'......Good Luck! I look forward (ugh) to seeing the end results..... I guess that you are only stripping the top?....or does the color of the rest of it bother you also? ....I know!....its your guitar and you will do as you please. Got it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yo Pete, I could have gone all day or week without seeing those pics ....Oh well, at leat its not 'vintage'......Good Luck! I look forward (ugh) to seeing the end results..... I guess that you are only stripping the top?....or does the color of the rest of it bother you also? ....I know!....its your guitar and you will do as you please. Got it It is simple really, you can "Unsubscribe" from this thread. Your comment is not qualified for an "At least" response. This situation is an "At most" situation, the wood is going to look awesome. I am only stripping the obnoxious gold off the top, the back is a nice stained mahogany and the neck is plain maple which will darken with age I hope. What "bothers" me is your arrogant response, like I need your approval or something. As far as "Vintage", I don't subscribe to all that pretentious nonsense about old guitars being some holy grail entity, they are old musical instruments with some history, and that is all. One of my earlier refinishing jobs was to strip and refinish a 1966 Fender Precision for the owner who had it new since he was 16. We changed all hardware to gold, new pick guard, installed a BadAss bridge, and active pickups that required me to rout in a battery compartment. Some joker told me if I was a "reputable" guitar shop I would refuse to do such work. What I refuse to do is not accommodate my customers. The owner absolutely loves his improved Precision bass to this day. PS: I am applying "stripper" to the guitar, not "smasher". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yo Pete, apparently, I struck a nerve! There are all levels of Gibson guitar afficianados on this Forum. And yes, YOU could have just as easily let my comment pass as I could have 'not' let your 'horror picture show'' roll across my screen. #1 -you did not initially say that you were doing this at a customers 'bequest' #2-there are 'whores for money' in many professions #3-I would care less what you do, if it was not posted on a public Forum(but since it is, I will voice my opinion) if I feel like it. Thats about all. I 'thought' that I was softening my comment some. Perhaps not? Good luck with your 'venture' sign me.......Joker and...the category is "restoration" NOT "re-invention" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yo Pete, apparently, I struck a nerve! There are all levels of Gibson guitar afficianados on this Forum. And yes, YOU could have just as easily let my comment pass as I could have 'not' let your 'horror picture show'' roll across my screen. #1 -you did not initially say that you were doing this at a customers 'bequest' #2-there are 'whores for money' in many professions #3-I would care less what you do, if it was not posted on a public Forum(but since it is, I will voice my opinion) if I feel like it. Thats about all. I 'thought' that I was softening my comment some. Perhaps not? Good luck with your 'venture' sign me.......Joker and...the category is "restoration" NOT "re-invention" The "nerve" you struck is your own "nervy attitude". I am used to internet "know-it-alls" by now, they seem to lurk on many forums. Whether I am doing this refinish per a customer's "bequest" or not is none of your business. Your "whores for money" comment just really shows what kind of belligerent person you are, thanks for enlightening us. Public forum or not, your responses are continually inappropriately rude and low-class. My "venture" like all others will end up a success. And lastly the category is "Gibson Repair and Restoration" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Just great Pete! I think you have got me "pegged and pigeon-holed".....the 'one-dimensional' dude that I am. I assume that I cannot count on you in collaberating in any future Gibson Repairs and Restorations, eh? My loss, your gain.... ...and 'meh'.... with 3485 posts on this Forum alone......I have encountered a few of your 'types' as well.... Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Just great Pete! I think you have got me "pegged and pigeon-holed".....the 'one-dimensional' dude that I am. I assume that I cannot count on you in collaberating in any future Gibson Repairs and Restorations, eh? My loss, your gain.... ...and 'meh'.... with 3485 posts on this Forum alone......I have encountered a few of your 'types' as well.... Rod It is usually the ones with the extremely high post count(especially the ones who brag about it)who are the problem, and my "type" being just a guy who minds his own business and likes to share his thoughts, beliefs, and ideas with other thoughtful people who share my interests. Please refrain from commenting on any of my threads again. Your posts are a waste of everyone's time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Glad you found a nice maple top under the opaque finish. So I think there may result a great looking plain or just not bookmatched figured top? I am curious what finish you will go with later. Just thinking about the gold top finish consistence compared to the clear coat. I remember I read somewhere many, many years ago that they changed composition for the gold top layer. The vintage gold top pigment became greenish as soon as sweat came through to it due to clear coat wear or checking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 Glad you found a nice maple top under the opaque finish. So I think there may result a great looking plain or just not bookmatched figured top? I am curious what finish you will go with later. Just thinking about the gold top finish consistence compared to the clear coat. I remember I read somewhere many, many years ago that they changed composition for the gold top layer. The vintage gold top pigment became greenish as soon as sweat came through to it due to clear coat wear or checking. I am very glad I found what I was hoping for, if the maple wasn't good I was going to go with a solid cherry. But now that I like what I see I am going for a transparent amber to match my LP Classic in Cinnaburst. Gibson changed the gold flakes 7 years ago. For decades they used Crescent Bronze's #256 gold flakes. It has bronze in it which has copper so that is the greening you see when a player wears through to the gold. They switched to a secret "mica" formula they will not disclose. They sent me a sample but it was too coppery looking compared to what is on mine. Gibson says the factories samples vary. They also said that they never will touch up a gold top. I now know why. I found the clear nitro top layer peels off easily without any stripper used. I am using a small chisel to peel it off in dry sheets. I think I will only use the stripper to get the gold layer off, which I bet is poly based. It seems whatever they are using for the gold coat that the nitro doesn't adhere well to it. This is another reason I am glad I am stripping the gold off. I made a binding sander out of some dowels to sand just the binding, it works well. I cant post pictures here anymore, my allotted photo space is used up. I will add photos to my facebook page if you want to see the current progress. Thanks for your encouragement and support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 You're welcome, Pete. In my opinion, it is a good thing to shed a light on a hidden maple beauty. Just asked the colour question since you wrote in post # 1 you'd want to go with amber to match the back. When viewing the pics from here, the back looks coated undyed to me. Since you are referring to another guitar now, I am curious to see them both pictured... Good luck for the progress of your work - I cross my fingers for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 You're welcome, Pete. In my opinion, it is a good thing to shed a light on a hidden maple beauty. Just asked the colour question since you wrote in post # 1 you'd want to go with amber to match the back. When viewing the pics from here, the back looks coated undyed to me. Since you are referring to another guitar now, I am curious to see them both pictured... Good luck for the progress of your work - I cross my fingers for you. The back of the mahogany may be natural, the back of the maple neck definitely is. Here is my LP Classic, I don't think I am going to do the dark edges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 BTW, how do I set it so I see the newest post first? I have to scroll through all these recent new posts to see the newest one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 BTW, how do I set it so I see the newest post first? I have to scroll through all these recent new posts to see the newest one. Clicking on date and time of last entry shown in the far right column will open the related topic there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 The back of the mahogany may be natural, the back of the maple neck definitely is. Here is my LP Classic, I don't think I am going to do the dark edges. I share the opinion that a certain degree of translucency along the edges looks better. All of my Les Paul guitars allow for viewing the entire maple top - I like it this way, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Pete Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 I have been scraping the binding with a small chisel. It seems the factory left the binding a bit higher than the maple. Has anyone seen this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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