drew365 Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 FWIW; my '07 Standard Faded, which is chambered, weighs 7# 5oz. I don't consider it a failure of a guitar by any means. Yes it's a bit bright, but luckily it has tone knobs, as my amp does, and they work if you twist them. I wouldn't buy an LP that was over 10#. I'm thinking about a new Traditional and I will bring a luggage scale with me when I get serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 I agree with everything you say. P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoundMaster Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 Original post deleted by author. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 I doubt that. The scales might have been bad or improperly reset, and the timbers used for these guitars were poorly dried. Tolerances in density of one particular wood species are pretty large but not that extreme. There also are very few woods which exceed the density of water, like e. g. ebony, palisander (Brazilian pockwood), or American pockwood (aka Guaiacum or lignum vitae, lat. wood of life). Variance in the weight of 2 seemingly identical pieces of mahogany can be as much as 400%. This is because mahogany is capable of bringing huge amounts if minerals up from the ground. If the minerals are there, they're absorbed, if not..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Variance in the weight of 2 seemingly identical pieces of mahogany can be as much as 400%. This is because mahogany is capable of bringing huge amounts if minerals up from the ground. If the minerals are there, they're absorbed, if not..... Seemingly identical pieces of wood may vary strongly in weight due to the previous history of the related pieces. 400% can surely be achieved with drastically different improper treatments for longer periods. Sorry, but I wasn't able to verify the mineral point. All of my research resulted in the following: Mineral content of dried wood is around 1% in total. No rooted plant would survive large deviations in mineral content of the water surrounding the roots. It seems very unlikely to me that any piece of wood, properly handled after harvest, could show differences in mineral mass able to cause four times the density in the end. Wood may contain up to 60% humidity and is used for construction after drying out to typically 8...16% free humidity, i. e. physically absorbed water, with the chemically absorbed water left. The latter may be different e. g. for baked maple which is chemically altered intentionally. Besides humidity, significant variations in density mainly result from varying lignin contents and compositions. Maritime plants are a different story, but I think this is not the topic here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drew365 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 All of these percentages made me think of something I read online recently: That 78% of quoted percentages are made up on the spot for effect! If it's online, you know it's 100% true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Sorry, but I wasn't able to verify the mineral point. All of my research resulted in the following: Mineral content of dried wood is around 1% in total. No rooted plant would survive large deviations in mineral content of the water surrounding the roots. It seems very unlikely to me that any piece of wood, properly handled after harvest, could show differences in mineral mass able to cause four times the density in the ... No need to apologise, just do better research... j/k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JazzGtr Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 Maybe it's just me, but the heavier the guitar, the better it sounds. Anything approaching 10 lbs just hurts after the first set. But most of guitar players are just out of shape and needs to work out a lot more. Try 10-20 push-ups per day before playing that LP. It will make a huge different in your LP playing and your sex life too. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valtyr Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 My Shred Les Paul Studio is chambered. I have to say it's the most well balanced Gibson I have ever owned and the tone is somewhat different from my previous Les Pauls (not in a bad way either). I don't mind heavy guitars but they do seem to require a good strap to stay comfortable. That said, I love my 4.5 lb Parker Fly too. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 No need to apologise, just do better research... j/k Does it mean I also should use data sources with inferior reliability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Does it mean I also should use data sources with inferior reliability? Absotively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacealf Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 What I read was that long ago they cut down trees on the side of hills, so it have more mineral content, but it did not have that much. Why the weight then I do not know I guess. If you read about tree plantations then the trees grown on a plantation supposedly have more mineral in them then the earlier trees years ago had. Look up the various differences of mahogany and other trees like spruce and all of that instead of just guitar talk probably. It's the density, or is that destiny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted June 13, 2014 Share Posted June 13, 2014 ... It's the density, or is that destiny. Absolutely brilliant! [lol] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creeksideguitar Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 Who knew from the 80's on Gibson started cutting holes in our Les Pauls! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 I think when the preponderance of Les Pauls weigh between 8-9 lbs its really subjective and basically preference. I always thought the mineral content was predicated on the area of origin? For example the mineral lines are prevalent on eastern rock maple no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 ... I always thought the mineral content was predicated on the area of origin? For example the mineral lines are prevalent on eastern rock maple no? I'm rather unsure about that. To my guess, the predictability depends more on mineral composition and thus visibility. One of my LP tops has obvious brown mineral streaks which probably would mean iron. Since it's a flame top, it is likely to be Eastern Maple as you suggested. However, lots of minerals are white or light grey and would be less apparent. None of my other maple tops has visible streaks, so there either are none, or they are invisible. There also might be some under the surface and therefore beyond visibility regardless of colour. Furthermore, I don't know how mineral streaks would look on a flatsawn quilt top. I can't find any on the single one of mine. To my knowledge, this is probably of Western Maple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 I'm rather unsure about that. To my guess, the predictability depends more on mineral composition and thus visibility. One of my LP tops has obvious brown mineral streaks which probably would mean iron. Since it's a flame top, it is likely to be Eastern Maple as you suggested. However, lots of minerals are white or light grey and would be less apparent. None of my other maple tops has visible streaks, so there either are none, or they are invisible. There also might be some under the surface and therefore beyond visibility regardless of colour. Furthermore, I don't know how mineral streaks would look on a flatsawn quilt top. I can't find any on the single one of mine. To my knowledge, this is probably of Western Maple. I hear you, I think there are knowns as we suggest. Its also true with wood weight. Think about Ash and its southern and northern difference. The southern Ash without a doubt is lighter in weight where the Strats or Teles made out of northern ash weigh as much as a LP. I hear that almost all Quilt comes from the west-USA. I know Gibson used all eastern rock maple from the on-set, but I really think it was plentiful then and just an easy move for the purchasing dept in Kalamazoo. The mahogany as the story goes differs in weight by age. The new grown is heavier as I hear and it would seem to me the non weight relieved receive lighter wood to maintain the 8-9 lb goal be it they are two piece. Thus the lighter solid pieces for the historics. So the Standards are still one piece but I believe made from the slightly heavier one-piece bodies. Same with the SGs as the solid body of mahogany differs in the 6-7-1/2lb range. I don't know I may be off track but for sure there is a great deal of attention paid to the wood selection and weight. What I can't tell is a difference in tone between the swiss cheese and non weight relieved. I hear a slight difference with the chambered but to me most of that is electronics and pick-ups where they really differ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 I hear you, I think there are knowns as we suggest. Its also true with wood weight. Think about Ash and its southern and northern difference. The southern Ash without a doubt is lighter in weight where the Strats or Teles made out of northern ash weigh as much as a LP. I hear that almost all Quilt comes from the west-USA. I know Gibson used all eastern rock maple from the on-set, but I really think it was plentiful then and just an easy move for the purchasing dept in Kalamazoo. The mahogany as the story goes differs in weight by age. The new grown is heavier as I hear and it would seem to me the non weight relieved receive lighter wood to maintain the 8-9 lb goal be it they are two piece. Thus the lighter solid pieces for the historics. So the Standards are still one piece but I believe made from the slightly heavier one-piece bodies. Same with the SGs as the solid body of mahogany differs in the 6-7-1/2lb range. I don't know I may be off track but for sure there is a great deal of attention paid to the wood selection and weight. What I can't tell is a difference in tone between the swiss cheese and non weight relieved. I hear a slight difference with the chambered but to me most of that is electronics and pick-ups where they really differ. I believe curley maple is flamed if cut one way and quilted if cut the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted November 17, 2014 Share Posted November 17, 2014 I believe curley maple is flamed if cut one way and quilted if cut the other. This article missing references or sources says quilt is an end grain figure visible on flatsawn Western Big Leaf maple: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quilt_maple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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