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1958 Country Western


EP2

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Hello All,

I've been lurking for awhile and learning much from those who post here. Thank you!

I just got a 1958 Country Western, FON T7344, that has a bridge plate which is interesting. It appears to be original. I am hoping that some of you more familiar with this year and model can tell me if it is correct or just a mistake that got by. It looks to be positioned wrong, or cut poorly. Also a picture the guitar. You can see it has gone thru some "updates" over it's life. Hope to get these changes corrected and looking like it did over 50 years ago.

Thanks

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Yikes!! That looks like all of the above: mistake that got by, cut wrong and positioned poorly. It's hard to say if it is original. I see some chips on the back edge where it may have split and only ended up w/ a half of a plate but hard to say. Also would be hard to imagine it made it this long without more string ball damage under the top. I would get it checked out and leave the strings off until then. Good Luck with it, it looks like a worthy project.

Welcome to the forum.

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Yikes!! That looks like all of the above: mistake that got by, cut wrong and positioned poorly. It's hard to say if it is original. I see some chips on the back edge where it may have split and only ended up w/ a half of a plate but hard to say. Also would be hard to imagine it made it this long without more string ball damage under the top. I would get it checked out and leave the strings off until then. Good Luck with it, it looks like a worthy project.

Welcome to the forum.

 

Thanks for the opinion and the welcome aliasphobias.

It's an odd one alright. I thought folks might want to see this before it gets corrected. Looking at the guitar in it's present state reminds me of something I read here, or heard elsewhere. It was another guitar that was hard on the eyes but sounded good. They called it Susan Boyle.

Since the first pictures, the original tuners have been removed. 5 of the 6 work fine. The huge, white pickguard is gone and I have uncovered the beautiful MOP crown and logo on the head stock. Next up, bridge removal so the homemade burst can be dealt with. The final appearance of the finish will determine the direction I go. It's a fun project.

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That sounds like a good idea. I have started taking photos and will post the project as soon as it's gets further down the road. The bridge plate has me stumped. I got the bridge off with very little trouble then tried to remove the bridge plate. The plate is still in place. Since I just want to know how to do these things, I have been looking at a lot of information on the interweb. Some things make sense and others trigger my B.S. filter. I've got another guitar to take to my lutherie this week. Anything that's above my pay grade goes to a pro. I look forward to his impressions. One thought I had was to make a piece which would act as the other half of the plate, then use the nifty Stew-Mac tool for creating a divot and a replacement plug for the plate. Of course that would leave me with a big ole thumper plate, so removal and replacement still seems like the best way to go. If that makes sense.

I'm off to get replacement tuners. The originals have 5 good ones and 1 with a bent shaft. I haven't found a good way to bend it back without damaging the tuner, and a working one from the same era runs about twice as much as a new set of Klusons. We'll see how well the aging process's work with getting a 50 year old look.

Thanks for the suggestion and the interest.

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I am going to agree with somebpdy and say it looks like the bridge plate split. There is certainly some glue residue evident in a place where there should be no glue. Through the 1950s Gibson had a very elabortate inspection system with each part and guitar being inspected over 160 times. I have been playing "used" Gibsons since the 1960s and have never seen any kind of build screw up like that. But I guess anything is possible. As somebody attempted to slap a burst on the guitar maybe it sustained some kind of serious damage in its life.

 

Anyway, back to the bridge plate - I would have it repalced rather than attempt to repair it. At any rate, I would have the whole guitar thoroughly checked out by somebody who knows their way around them.

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zombywoof,

 

Thanks for the info. I didn't realize they went through so many inspections! Prior to your post, I had an opportunity to have my luthiere check it out. All is in sound shape, but the bridge plate had him wondering too. He came to the same conclusion. Either it split at some time, or was just a mistake.

 

I attempted to remove it with no luck...and no damage. It took him about 10 minutes and out it came about as clean as one could ask for. It looks like a mistake.

 

Also wanted to let you know that a post you had from last year regarding your 42 banner really inspired me to search out an older guitar. Yours is a beauty. I hope it is working well for you.

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My thanks EP2.

 

When Ted McCarty took over Gibson in the late 1940s he instituted a very elaborate inspection system. One of the first things that the new President of CMI (Gibson's parent company sionce 1944) did after taking over in 1965 and forcing McCarty out was to do away with it. Interviews with employees recalled guitars now leaving Kalamazoo that never would have been sent out when McCarty was calling the shots.

 

I am a big, big fan of the non-scallop braced Gibsons. Just real punchy and qwuick sounding instruments. If you like that sound, Bozeman produces nothing with a smilar bracing so you pretty much have to buy an original. My second favorite Gibson in some 50 years was a 1956 SJ. That guitar actually earned quite a local reputation as the one to beat to the point it would get challenged not only by just plain folks but by guys running vintage guitar stores. I had more offers to buy that SJ than I can recall. I only sold it after I decided to have the '42 restored and needed to raise the cash. For weeks though I literally had nightmares about selling that SJ. The only other time that ever happened with me was when I sold my 1958 Tele which I had owned for decades.

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  • 1 month later...
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thats a faulty placement for a bridge plate.. wierd.. the out side is refined as well.. getter cleaned up.. I bet it will sound really nice..get a luthier to re locate the plate.. keep the top safe.. the smaller the plate, the boomier it will be.

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I'm not so sure about the 'intensive inspection' at Gibson in the 1950s.

 

Here is a description of work done by Folkway Music's Mark Stutman on a mid-'50s Gibson acoustic, involving replacement of the original bridgeplate:

 

"The bridgeplate was replaced because Gibson mis-located the original too close to the soundhole. The result was that the bridge-pin holes did not pass through the plate, but rather, were located behind the bridgeplate, this resulting in the string’s ball ends anchoring on spruce instead of maple!"

 

So before buying into yet another 'legend from the great beyond', a little dose of reality suggests that this '58 may have suffered from the same inspector that the guitar described above did.

 

Fred

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Thanks for the interest and replies. After my luthier removed the plate it sure looks like a mistake that slipped by. I have made and installed a new plate, removed the homemade burst, and will be taking it to have a neck reset and a regret. Both are much needed.

Since I am doing this to get a better understanding of builds and repair work, I have to do what I can when life isn't getting in the way.

Another member suggested posting a run down of the work done. Pictures have been taken and once completed it's my goal to post all of that.

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Thanks for the interest and replies. After my luthier removed the plate it sure looks like a mistake that slipped by. I have made and installed a new plate, removed the homemade burst, and will be taking it to have a neck reset and a regret. Both are much needed.

Since I am doing this to get a better understanding of builds and repair work, I have to do what I can when life isn't getting in the way.

Another member suggested posting a run down of the work done. Pictures have been taken and once completed it's my goal to post all of that.

 

 

 

 

This is one case where a top re-finish will actually increase the value of the guitar, as well as making it much easier on the eyes. If the top has to be completely stripped to get rid of the 'burst, your luthier could put a tiny bit of vintage toner into the lacquer, and it will look like the 55-year-old guitar that it is. If the 'burst was applied over the original finish, he may be able to sand it back and do a light overspray, but you won't know how the top is until that nasty pickguard is pulled off.

 

These mid/late '50s SJN's (CW) are great guitars.

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