Which pots should I get?

[JKHillSG]

Hi All,

 

I have a 2011 Gibson SG Standard and I finally decided I wanted to upgrade my SG to become a ToneMonster. I'm not saying it sounds bad, but I think it hasn't reached its fullest potential. I already have plans on switching out the stock 490R/498T pickups. With all the research that I've done online, I heard many stories of people successfully changing the stock 300k volume pots to 500k to improve the tone drastically. The problem is I'm a complete noob when it comes to this stuff and I also live overseas so getting professional help is very difficult. My original plan was to order pots online--I have a US shipping address--then either replace them myself or have a pro do it.

 

The questions I wanted to ask all of you were:

• What's the difference between linear and logarithmic pots?
• What pots should I get? This is for the volume controls. Brand and model/type would be nice. I'd also like to buy them from a fairly large and reputable website (e.g. Amazon, Sweetwater, Musiciansfriend, Sam Ash, zZ Sounds etc.)
• Do I need to get two different types of pots for the rhythm and treble pickups?
• Will I need to replace anything else? I understand that modern Gibsons come with a motherboard like wiring layout.
• Do you suggest/recommend anything else? Not just potwise but anything.

Please forgive me for my ignorance and I'll be looking forward to your answers. Thanks!

[JKHillSG]

Hi again. Sorry, I have a follow-up question. Should I get a long shaft pot or a short shaft pot for my SG?

[kidblast]

I think the short ones, but you may want to all Gibson and confirm and I know somewone will chime in and know. Where the pots go through the body on an SG, it is not to thick.

 

 

Short shaft pots will only work for hardware mounted on a pick guard or control plate, (eg: strat, or tele)

 

you will need long shafts, and you will need to adjust the shaft nuts so that the knobs will look right once you install them.

[Rabs]

I use CTS pots.. they are great

 

Heres an explanation that I think pretty much cover it all

 

http://www.axesrus.co.uk/Medium-Shaft-CTS-Pots-p/ctslog59.htm

CTS pots have been found on most high end guitars over the years, and for the most part, are still seen to this day.

 

The main aspect of all CTS pots is that they’re made in the exact same way as they always have been, so if you’re looking for that vintage tone, these should do the trick. This tried and tested design, with very few mechanical components has created an absolute classic guitar part – the simple, rugged design has means that CTS pots offer unrivalled reliability, with many of the original examples still going strong after nearly 60 years.

 

From a player’s perspective, your average CTS pots will have a much firmer action thanks to the old fashioned design which utilises non-degrading grease under the wiper blade – this ultimately means that a CTS pot will take the occasional accident knock and not spin off under its own weight.

 

Shaft style

The shaft is the protruding, rotating part of the pot which will eventually be covered by a knob.

 

In a move away from the modular designs you normally see with electronic components, CTS developed 2 styles of “shaft” on their pots. This has a direct influence on which knobs can accommodate which pots.

 

The first model CTS employed used a solid shaft – fairly easy to spot, it is literally a solid lump of brass of polished zinc, with a smooth outer edge and a diameter of about 6.3mm or ¼”. These most commonly turn up on guitars with set screw mountings on the knobs. Normally, you’ll find the suitable knob will have a grub screw to hold it in place against the solid shaft.

 

A later model has come to be known as a “split shaft” – again, it’s all in the name – it will either be a knurled (toothed) edged piece of brass or zinc, with a large split down the middle and a diameter of 5.9mm. These turn up almost exclusively on guitars with push on knobs – it’s very common to see the suitable knobs have no visible means of fixing, but an internal knurling that will mesh with the toothed edge of the shaft.

 

Taper - Logarithmic or Linear?

Taper is simply a technical term for how a pot moves from 1-10, or from 0-100%, depending on how you think of it. Different tapers have different roles within the guitar, and in most cases, they’re interchangeable to give varying results.

 

Linear pots give a true representation of the output, (so 1 on the dial is 10% of the output, 5 is 50% and 10 is 100%). For this reason you’ll find them used all over the place, (rightly or wrongly) doing a variety of jobs,

 

Logarithmic pots are a little bit more specialised. They offer very narrow control range. Electrically speaking, by running though 1 – 6 on the dial, you cover 0% - 15% on the output, then tracking from 6 – 10 covers a much larger range from 15% - 100%.

 

Probably the easiest way to explain the whys and what for’s, is to break down the pots into real life situations you’ll find in your guitar.

 

Volume control

 

Linear

As a volume control, you’ll mostly find linear pots on Import guitars. In this case, a true representation of output lends itself really well to bedroom playing. It’s purely aimed at a target market looking to keep the guitar quiet and controllable, hitting low volumes during practise. They also turn up fairly often on bass guitars with 2 pickups, but no switching – giving the player a fairly easy to follow blending system.

 

Logarithmic

 

You’ll mostly find logarithmic pots on higher end instruments acting as the volume – in these cases the guitar is obviously targeted at gigging musicians. The guitars never going to be played quiet for extended periods so a log pot actually gives a nice “sweep” at the top end which lends itself to moving through different volumes whilst playing (moving from 10 to 8 on the dial will pretty much half the volume). This gives a great effect when used in combination with true amp overdrive.

 

Relation to our hearing

Obviously if you play on 10 constantly, it’s not going to make much difference; the arguments only really start when you’re changing volume.

 

The main point to take into consideration is that the human ear works on a logarithmic scale. So whilst moving through volumes during playing, it pays to try to match the way the ear works. The problems start when you consider that our hearing is far superior to anything electrical, so the “curve” of a log pots output never really matches up perfectly, so although the sweep feels more natural, it’s still not perfect. Speaking personally, I try not to think of the curve as matching our hearing, instead I think of it as a “sensitive” control that allows better control at high volumes through less movement.

 

The pitfalls

The downfall of this “theory” is that it flags up the log pots main cause of concern. Most of the numbers on the dial (1-6) only give access to a very low output. This leads us back to the way the ear works – you can hear a pin drop just as well as you can hear a jet engine, the ear should be able to pick out the lower volume sound the same way it picks the higher volume, and your brain should tell you it’s quieter.

 

Unfortunately, it’s not that clear cut, and this isn’t a perfect world, and although some people can either live with this feature (even use it to their advantage), others find the lower volume settings next to useless and the sudden drop off (usually between 6 and 7) quite annoying (some describe it as acting as a kill switch – basically muting the guitar)

 

So linear volume?

On the back of this – the linear pot seems the natural solution, but as with most things, it just isn’t that simple. Although the linear pot is great for low volume playing, and it’s easy to see where you are etc – they sweep in a way that isn’t conducive to human hearing. It sounds like its jumps from one setting to the next, and the ear finds it rather unnatural.

 

But not all is lost

Fortunately, “sweeping” from low volume to high volume still sounds perfectly fine on a log pot, but moving around at low volumes is still something that’s never been quite perfected as yet. Luckily, it’s not something most of us do.

 

In Conclusion

In closing on the volume topic – if you like making use of volume control whilst playing, then logarithmic control is probably your best bet thanks to the more natural curve of the output, but if you’re looking for a straight forward control solution at set volumes, where dial position represents the output, then linear pots are a great solution.

 

Tone

The tone pot on most guitars is a fairly neglected control nowadays sadly. The tone of any given pickup at anything less than 9 seems somewhat muddy and woolly, so more often than not the tone pot is stuck on 10 and left there.

 

In our experience, most complaints with pots come purely from the control that the stock tone pot is offering to the player.

 

The reason seems to be that most tone pots (contrary to popular belief oddly) in any production guitar will in fact be a Logarithmic taper. This will make it behave exactly the same as the volume control (at least to our ears).

 

As we discovered earlier, a Log pot will have most of its control at the higher end of its sweep – which works absolutely fine for volume control – however, with a tone control, when you’re making a “selection” – it leaves a little to be desired, purely because each setting is not equal to the ear.

 

Some people are absolutely fine with this setup, and will use the tone pot to make minute tweaks in the higher numbers.

 

An alternative would be to use a linear taper pot rather than the standard Log version – this will give you much more accurate control over the tone of your pickups.

 

Resistance

Potentiometers, in the most basic of terms, are variable resistors – and whilst not strictly true – if you think that when they are resisting at 100% they are letting nothing through, and when they are not resisting anything, they are letting everything through – you know about as much as most people will ever need to.

 

 

250K or 500K?

As a very quick rule of thumb, its 250ks for single coils and 500ks for anything that’s either noise cancelling or humbucking.

 

The logic behind it is no great secret – as any pickup gets hotter (which will be caused by a rise in impedance and inductance) it also becomes darker (warmth and darkness are two sides of the same coin in reality, but how we perceive it is a matter of personal taste – one man’s mud is another man's hot!)

 

Because humbuckers are, in essence, 2 single coils, wired in series, they are normally hotter, so to keep them balanced, need brightening up just a little bit to make them appealing to the ear.

 

What happens when you mix?

When you’re running a Humbucker in the same guitar as a Single Coil, you normally will only have access to one master volume unfortunately. This is probably the most important pot in the circuit when it comes to the resistance, so you’ll normally find that it’s a compromise when it comes to which value to pick.

 

Within the industry, you’ll find preference is always given to the Humbucker and a 500k pot will be used, but in home builds and modifications, its completely down to you player.

 

When testing, we’ve found that 250k will suit a single coil perfectly, so it’s ideal for single coils and lipsticks giving that beautiful, chiming, chirpy, soulful twang that you typically associate with single coil guitars. Humbuckers became very “warm” with a lot of the definition lacking in the top end.

 

With a 500k pot, the humbuckers absolutely shined, it was bright, spanky, clear, with a nice definition in the bottom end as well as the top, which gave the impression of a depth in the tone.. Single coils by comparison sounded very shrill, with a very weak bottom end. Not without its charm, but certainly not that USA 50s and 60s rock tone, much closer to the 70s and 80s metal and rock tones.

[Robbie1299]

So, I'm going with linear pots for the volume and tone for my Schecter S1+ (24.75" Gibson scale). I'm putting in a Seymour Duncan SH-2 Jazz in the neck and an SH-4JB (or a Rickenbacher HB-1) in the bridge position. I'm a fan of the Sonic Youth and Fugazi sounds. Any thoughts on the pickups would be welcome (I also have an American Performer Jazzmaster), but I digress. I'm hear to ask about pots.

If I'm using 500k pots, does that mean for volume AND tone?

So, I'm going with linear pots for the volume and tone for my Schecter S1+ (24.75" Gibson scale). I'm putting in a Seymour Duncan SH-2 Jazz in the neck and an SH-4JB (or a Rickenbacher HB-1) in the bridge position. I'm a fan of the Sonic Youth and Fugazi sounds. Any thoughts on the pickups would be welcome (I also have an American Performer Jazzmaster), but I digress. I'm hear to ask about pots.

If I'm using 500k pots, does that mean for volume AND tone?

 

 

[Bjorn218]

• What's the difference between linear and logarithmic pots?

Explanation: https://www.jameco.com/Jameco/workshop/circuitnotes/Potentiometers-audio-taper-vs-linear.html

• What pots should I get? This is for the volume controls. Brand and model/type would be nice. I'd also like to buy them from a fairly large and reputable website (e.g. Amazon, Sweetwater, Musiciansfriend, Sam Ash, zZ Sounds etc.)

A good quality brand  which for guitars built in the US means CTS or Bourns  because they use imperial measurements for the physical dimensions of the pot  both are exceptional  true to spec  I personally use Bourns low friction line, which means nothing more than they are chosen because they take less force to move them from off to on (great for doing those chimey swelling note tricks and quick on and off stuff), but they don’t cost any more than others, just are set aside from a manufacturing run where they aren’t built to perfect specs  meaning they are in a manufacturing standpoint off lesser quality, but real world no different still last years  

• Do I need to get two different types of pots for the rhythm and treble pickups?

Not unless that’s what you want to do a set of 500K across the board will do you fine  

• Will I need to replace anything else? I understand that modern Gibsons come with a motherboard like wiring layout.

if you’re pulling the pcb, just enough hookup wire to rewire the circuit  you’ll need a tone cap as well. Any low voltage non electrolytic capacitor in a value from .015uf to .033uf will work.  The higher this number, the more treble gets shunt to ground when rolling off the tone control.  Any cap will do and they are so inexpensive that rolling them(trying out different values/brands/type of capacitor) can be a fun adventure.  A couple good brands are the orange polyester caps known as orange drops that brand was Sprague who also make the 192P “Pacer” caps (I use this type .015uf/200v I had value around), Mallory 150, Cornell Dublier(Illinois Capacitors) MPW, any Vishay metal film or ceramic capacitor, these are all sub $2/per brand and types. Go up from there and Sozo is a good brand, Auratone from France are real good but the cost vs what you actually hear is debatable (these run $10/per, solos are around $5 iirc).  I will say one thing to hopefully make a point after the above, DO NOT think a lot of dosh for some secret capacitor is what you must do.  I use premium type caps because I also work on tube guitar amps for a portion of my income, so I have them always on hand. Otherwise, a $.03 no name ceramic capacitor from radio shack sounds no different than a $12 Auratone in a guitar circuit if they are wired to a switch in your guitar and you can switch between the two to test them   If you play with you’re tone full on, it is electrically removed from the circuit anyway.  I didn’t tell you the above to make you buy expensive capacitors for your guitar at all, you just asked the question, so passing along info.  If you do decide to go that route and I would suggest starting with either the current orange drops, nos 192P, or Cornell mpw.  Only because they are vastly upgraded quality compared to any Vishay which makes 95% of consumer use componants and still cost you less than $5 for one of each   Again if you take that route for fun, make sure to purchase from a reputable company such as Mouser, Digikey, Newark, stay away from eBay you will get ripped off  and do not buy anyone’s Bumble Bee tone caps unless you know exactly what to look for.  There was a company who made repops and advertised they were specially made   When they came in, someone paid the $99 took it apart and found out it was just a $1 cap dipped in epoxy made to look like the real deal  cough cough.  

• Do you suggest/recommend anything else? Not just potwise but anything.

Your selector switch and jack. If you’re going to replace stuff. Make sure you replace these with genuine Switchcraft branded parts. The jack will run $3.99 and the switch $31.99 from switchcraft.  Don’t buy the switch from anyone else unless you can hold the package in your hand and see the name switch craft on it, and only then if you can score it for less than $30. For your SG, the 90 degree switch is the one to get. It’s the same one I use on my V and I just replaced mine (third in 12 years) last week.  Oh wait. Pure Tone makes good jacks. They are twice the price of a switchcraft and so far I’m in the fence about them. That was installed last week. My negative towards them is that the wiring diagram they offer is garbage, and because of the way they are built, making sure the solder lug for the tip and sleeve is a little hard to see.  Especially when you’re sent a stereo jack what you ordered mono.  
 

I hope this might help some.  Not trying to be arrogant or a know it all.  I was once where you are at and I wish I had someone more experienced offer free advice to me. I would have saved a whole lot of money over the past 38 years. So when I can, I try to pay it back to newer players.  Wait til you are confident enough to do these types of things on your own and lay out a few bills for decent equipment and supplies.  You’ll be obsessing over solder size, Teflon vs pvc coated hookup wire, liquid vs paste flux, whether or not you should break out the iron or your rework rig to swap the burnt capacitors on a pedal because the rework kit takes longer to set up yet will do the job perfect first time and the iron will be faster but might not get the part on the pad right the first 5 times.  While pots caps and guitar wiring gets to where you try to do a bragging worthy wiring job that looks almost military spec.