timfitz63 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Tried searching this forum for information but came up empty. I'm the new owner of a vintage (1973) Les Paul Deluxe Goldtop. The guitar is very clean and well-kept for its age, as well as all-original, but seems to be suffering from a few signs of age. I noticed that there appears to have been a foam pad installed between the pick guard and the top of the guitar, right next to the pickup; I presume this was a factory-installed pad to provide support to the pick guard? As the foam is now 40+ years old, it's begun to deteriorate. I would like to replace it with a correct part so the pick guard continues to be properly supported, but haven't any information on a proper replacement part. I'd appreciate any information/guidance on finding a replacement piece of padding (proper dimensions/thickness; Gibson part number, if still offered; etc.) and some pointers on cleaning up that area (in particular, the guitar top) of the old foam so I can install the replacement without damage to the top's finish. Also, was this padding installed directly to the pick guard or the guitar top? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Would like to see pics. Sounds like a nice guitar. I don,t believe that the foam would be original equiptment.. The pickguard should be fine normally with the bracket alone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timfitz63 Posted August 29, 2014 Author Share Posted August 29, 2014 Would like to see pics. Sounds like a nice guitar... Thanks. I've attached some photos of what I'm describing. Some general shots of the guitar can be found in my introductory thread. The guitar is very clean, but does show expected signs of age and wear from use. Not a museum piece, but definitely well-kept by the previous owner. ... I don,t believe that the foam would be original equiptment.. The pickguard should be fine normally with the bracket alone... Was kind-of wondering if that wasn't the case myself. If it's not supposed to be there, I'd just prefer to remove it -- obviously without damage to the finish on the top or the pickup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR56 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Agree with Rod that it wouldn't have been original to the guitar. I'm not a repairman, and there may be an easy way to remove it all safely, but I would be concerned about some of the the gold paint coming off with it if it were removed. Also, goldtops have a history of being somewhat fragile finishes, relatively speaking. I would probably just remove as much of the deteriorated foam as I could, down to the layer of adhesive (without getting all the way down to the finish) and put a new piece of supporting material (foam or soft rubber, perhaps) right on top of it. For one thing, a pickguard support is really a pretty good idea. It makes a guard all the more stable, and can help relieve a lot of pressure on the screw mounts and bracket for players that apply a lot of pressure on the guard when they play. Also, because this will be hidden by a pickguard, you can just get back to playing it and not worrying about damaging the finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timfitz63 Posted August 30, 2014 Author Share Posted August 30, 2014 Agree with Rod that it wouldn't have been original to the guitar... ... For one thing, a pickguard support is really a pretty good idea. It makes a guard all the more stable, and can help relieve a lot of pressure on the screw mounts and bracket for players that apply a lot of pressure on the guard when they play... That was what I was afraid of: someone added it, albeit with apparent good intentions. It begs the question, though: why didn't they stick it on the pick guard itself, rather than the finished top of the guitar...? ... I'm not a repairman, and there may be an easy way to remove it all safely, but I would be concerned about some of the the gold paint coming off with it if it were removed. Also, goldtops have a history of being somewhat fragile finishes, relatively speaking. I would probably just remove as much of the deteriorated foam as I could, down to the layer of adhesive (without getting all the way down to the finish) and put a new piece of supporting material (foam or soft rubber, perhaps) right on top of it... this will be hidden by a pickguard, you can just get back to playing it and not worrying about damaging the finish. That may be all that I can do; the foam is crumbling, as is typical of sponge-like foam that's getting on the high side of 40. So getting most of it off (down to the last layer before the adhesive) shouldn't be a problem; it's already falling off to at least that point. Rubbing alcohol is usually pretty good at removing adhesive residue, but if the adhesive has 'reacted' with the finish, I may be creating a bigger problem by attempting to remove the residue. I guess I'll have to look at it more closely, and see if anyone else chimes in with some answers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR56 Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 I think you're using good judgement. Another thought. If the adhesive is still soft/pliable/malleable, I would try carefully rubbing it off just with my thumb or finger. Depending on the type of adhesive, this could turn out to be very easy, or very difficult, but it might be worth a try. Even if it's slightly hard and dry, a combination of heat and pressure from your fingers (and natural oils in the skin) might loosen it up safely, without resorting to chemicals. You might even try scraping at it very gently (parallel with the top, not a "gouging" action) with a fingernail or thin/hard plastic, to see if it loosens at all with minor force. Just a thought. Sometimes a lot of patience is needed to do something like this. If it looked like it was beginning to work, you could pause and examine the finish where you removed the material, using a magnifying glass, before proceeding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timfitz63 Posted August 30, 2014 Author Share Posted August 30, 2014 I think you're using good judgement. Another thought. If the adhesive is still soft/pliable/malleable, I would try carefully rubbing it off just with my thumb or finger. Depending on the type of adhesive, this could turn out to be very easy, or very difficult, but it might be worth a try. Even if it's slightly hard and dry, a combination of heat and pressure from your fingers (and natural oils in the skin) might loosen it up safely, without resorting to chemicals. You might even try scraping at it very gently (parallel with the top, not a "gouging" action) with a fingernail or thin/hard plastic, to see if it loosens at all with minor force. Just a thought. Sometimes a lot of patience is needed to do something like this. If it looked like it was beginning to work, you could pause and examine the finish where you removed the material, using a magnifying glass, before proceeding. Good suggestions, Jim! Thanks! I'll try that first. An online search conducted by the manager of the guitar shop where I bought the guitar about cleaning guitar tops of sticky residue (like from stickers) produced three guitar-related sites (this one, this one, and this one) that suggested a product called naphtha or some form of it (i.e., lighter/starter fluid); the former site also suggested WD-40, which I've used in other applications to remove gummy residue -- but I'm not sure I will in this case... Another site suggested products like Goo-Gone and UnDo, which I'm a little more reluctant to try before the naphtha-based products suggested on the guitar sites. So there's at least some who have blazed this trail before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimR56 Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 Good suggestions, Jim! Thanks! I'll try that first. An online search conducted by the manager of the guitar shop where I bought the guitar about cleaning guitar tops of sticky residue (like from stickers) produced three guitar-related sites (this one, this one, and this one) that suggested a product called naphtha or some form of it (i.e., lighter/starter fluid); the former site also suggested WD-40, which I've used in other applications to remove gummy residue -- but I'm not sure I will in this case... Another site suggested products like Goo-Gone and UnDo, which I'm a little more reluctant to try before the naphtha-based products suggested on the guitar sites. So there's at least some who have blazed this trail before. Yeah, I know that naphtha has been popular for many years for its versatility in working with various materials. I love Goo Gone for removing stubborn adhesives. The main concern I have with using any of these things is that it could leech into the finish through even a small crack. The paint used on goldtops is relatively volatile and unstable (not sure if they had changed the formula by the 70's, but I've seen many 50's guitars where the stuff starts to turn green just from sweat getting into cracks in the finish). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timfitz63 Posted August 30, 2014 Author Share Posted August 30, 2014 Yeah, I know that naphtha has been popular for many years for its versatility in working with various materials. I love Goo Gone for removing stubborn adhesives. The main concern I have with using any of these things is that it could leech into the finish through even a small crack. The paint used on goldtops is relatively volatile and unstable (not sure if they had changed the formula by the 70's, but I've seen many 50's guitars where the stuff starts to turn green just from sweat getting into cracks in the finish). Yeah, I've seen many 'Greentops' too. Well, I'll try rubbing with my fingers first, and resort to something like naphtha if that doesn't work, or there's only some light residue remaining. The finish on my top doesn't have any cracks or crazing, so I'm not too concerned about something leeching down below the finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timfitz63 Posted September 12, 2014 Author Share Posted September 12, 2014 Well, just to follow up on the progress here. I tried rubbing off the foam and adhesive using just my finger; the foam came off easily (it was barely hanging on to begin with), but the adhesive wasn't budging. The only recommended product I had handy was Goo-Gone, so I tried that -- and it seemed to work pretty well at removing the residual adhesive without harming or discoloring the finish. Unfortunately, the adhesive had already done that for me; after decades of contact, the adhesive had already pitted the finish... I appreciate the help; I guess the only thing to do is mask the blemish by keeping the pick guard on the guitar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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