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ES335 set up specs

#1 User is offline   GibFen 

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 03:39 PM

I've got an ES335 and did a nice set up the other day.
It plays great and sounds great.

I'd like to see the actual Gibson set up specs to compare those to my set up and to use as a reference.
The action is now super low and I didn't think the guitar would handle it but it's great.
There is a very slight string buzz unplugged and only a very tiny amount coming through the amp at times, so I want to raise the action a touch.
The spec's would be a great help.

Man do I LOVE this guitar. The satin red finish looks great and the feel of the neck is smooth and fast.
I tried a number of ES's in satin and gloss and kept coming back to the satin cherry.
There is just something better about the tone to my ears with the satin finish.
Very happy to have found this particular ES335.

Thanks for the spec's if you can post them. :)
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#2 User is offline   SteveFord 

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 03:49 PM

You know, if you buff out that satin with a gentle, very wet application of DuPont No. 7 and then use Mother's Carnauba Paste Wax it really livens up the sound - or at least it did on my Satin 335. Gives it a bit of sheen, too.





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#3 User is offline   capmaster 

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 05:39 PM

Setup specs are ballpark recommendations providing a start point for personal adjustment. They are not really important, in particular when already having found one's own. If yours works for you, it is fine! [biggrin] [thumbup]
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#4 User is offline   rainfield 

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 11:04 PM

Hi Newbie,
You can just verify your issue here: http://www.gibson-ta...t-up-specs.html
In case you don't find, here what a nice guy posted in 2009:

"Hi I'm David the final inspector at Gibson Memphis. I can give you the factory spec
info. on our setups. You will need a mechanics rule to do this properly.
To check neck relief: fret the low E at the first and 15th fret (not 12th) reach to the
7th fret and tap string. There should be a small space between string and fret - no thicker than a piece of paper. Do the same with the high E.
ACTION:
fret low E at first fret and measure the distance from the bottom of the to the top
of the 15th fret. It should be 5/64" (cm. 0,1984). Do the same with the high E,
measurement should be 3/64" (cm.0,1190).
Now measure the string height at the nut; underside of the string to the top of the
fret. Low E and A should measure 2/64" (cm. 0,0793), D and G =1.5/64" (cm.0,0595) and B and high E = 1/64" (cm. 0,0396).
If string height at nut is correct, recheck string height at 12th fret with strings open. Measurement for low and high E's should be the same as measurement taken at the 15th.
PICKUPS:
Fret low E at 22nd fret and measure pickup height from underside of string to point
on pickup closest to string. Bridge pickup should be 3/64" (cm.0,1190), neck pickup
should be 4/32"(cm.0,31751).
Fret high E at 22nd fret, distance for both pickups should be 3/32" (cm.0.2381).
Play test: Play every string at every fret checking for buzzes. Bend High E string 1
and 1/2 steps, beginning at the sixth fret and ending at 22nd, checking for "choking"
and to make sure string stays in nut notch."
Good luck with your setup!
Mario
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#5 User is offline   GibFen 

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 11:29 PM

 capmaster, on 22 October 2014 - 05:39 PM, said:

Setup specs are ballpark recommendations providing a start point for personal adjustment. They are not really important, in particular when already having found one's own. If yours works for you, it is fine! [biggrin] [thumbup]


Yes I feel the same way. :)
I set up my guitars to my liking.
I just wanted to know what specs Gibson uses as a starting point.
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#6 User is offline   GibFen 

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 11:36 PM

 rainfield, on 22 October 2014 - 11:04 PM, said:

Hi Newbie,
You can just verify your issue here: http://www.gibson-ta...t-up-specs.html
In case you don't find, here what a nice guy posted in 2009:

"Hi I'm David the final inspector at Gibson Memphis. I can give you the factory spec
info. on our setups. You will need a mechanics rule to do this properly.
To check neck relief: fret the low E at the first and 15th fret (not 12th) reach to the
7th fret and tap string. There should be a small space between string and fret - no thicker than a piece of paper. Do the same with the high E.
ACTION:
fret low E at first fret and measure the distance from the bottom of the to the top
of the 15th fret. It should be 5/64" (cm. 0,1984). Do the same with the high E,
measurement should be 3/64" (cm.0,1190).
Now measure the string height at the nut; underside of the string to the top of the
fret. Low E and A should measure 2/64" (cm. 0,0793), D and G =1.5/64" (cm.0,0595) and B and high E = 1/64" (cm. 0,0396).
If string height at nut is correct, recheck string height at 12th fret with strings open. Measurement for low and high E's should be the same as measurement taken at the 15th.
PICKUPS:
Fret low E at 22nd fret and measure pickup height from underside of string to point
on pickup closest to string. Bridge pickup should be 3/64" (cm.0,1190), neck pickup
should be 4/32"(cm.0,31751).
Fret high E at 22nd fret, distance for both pickups should be 3/32" (cm.0.2381).
Play test: Play every string at every fret checking for buzzes. Bend High E string 1
and 1/2 steps, beginning at the sixth fret and ending at 22nd, checking for "choking"
and to make sure string stays in nut notch."
Good luck with your setup!
Mario



Thanks!
Much appreciated.

Just from playing and set up I can tell I'm going to have to adjust the nut slots, in particular the B and G strings.
It needs just a touch more depth. Chords sound in tune, but if I put just a wee bit more pressure on those strings on a D or A minor chord it's a bit out of tune.
I'm going to have to borrow a nut file from my buddies music store and tweek it a bit.

I'm really impressed with how great Gibson built this particular ES335. I've set the action so low I didn't think it would work, but it's working great.
The fret job on this ES is excellent.

Thanks again. :)


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#7 User is offline   GibFen 

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 11:46 PM

 SteveFord, on 22 October 2014 - 03:49 PM, said:

You know, if you buff out that satin with a gentle, very wet application of DuPont No. 7 and then use Mother's Carnauba Paste Wax it really livens up the sound - or at least it did on my Satin 335. Gives it a bit of sheen, too.




That's interesting.
Cosmetically I like the satin and don't really want to shine it up.
But if it improves the tone that may something I may eventually try.

For now I love the tone. It's a lot brighter than I thought it would be through my rig.
This ES is nearly as bright as my Strat!
And the electronics are fantastic and very responsive, which is great as I can dial the treble range up or down nicely.

When you say "livens up...", can you give an idea of what that means?
Is the tone brighter?
Is there more damping tightening up the notes?

Did you wax the neck too?
I really like how smooth it feels. It's similar to how my '91 American Strat was when new. After a few years of playing that neck has taken on a nice natural sheen and more fluid feel.
Did the wax improve the neck fee? I don't want any tackiness, and that's why I prefer the satin neck over the gloss. Gloss necks feel smooth but depending on weather conditions humidity can make it feel sticky.

Thanks for the great info. :)


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#8 User is offline   rainfield 

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Posted 23 October 2014 - 12:38 AM

 GibFen, on 22 October 2014 - 11:36 PM, said:

Thanks!
Much appreciated.

Just from playing and set up I can tell I'm going to have to adjust the nut slots, in particular the B and G strings.
It needs just a touch more depth. Chords sound in tune, but if I put just a wee bit more pressure on those strings on a D or A minor chord it's a bit out of tune.
I'm going to have to borrow a nut file from my buddies music store and tweek it a bit.

I'm really impressed with how great Gibson built this particular ES335. I've set the action so low I didn't think it would work, but it's working great.
The fret job on this ES is excellent.

Thanks again. :)

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#9 User is offline   rainfield 

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Posted 23 October 2014 - 12:45 AM

It's ok. Anyway, every good and skilled luthier would sure check the nut
and very often it needs to be touched. No real good action can be achieved
without a less or more work on the nut slots.It's very delicate thing!
My compliments for your good ES335. I have to say mine is so fine too!
Enjoy her!
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#10 User is offline   SteveFord 

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Posted 23 October 2014 - 03:40 AM

What buffing the satin finish out did was to make the whole instrument ring or project more like an acoustic instrument. I was a little surprised by the outcome but that's what it did.
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#11 User is offline   capmaster 

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Posted 23 October 2014 - 06:29 AM

 rainfield, on 22 October 2014 - 11:04 PM, said:

Hi Newbie,
You can just verify your issue here: http://www.gibson-ta...t-up-specs.html
In case you don't find, here what a nice guy posted in 2009:

"Hi I'm David the final inspector at Gibson Memphis. I can give you the factory spec
info. on our setups. You will need a mechanics rule to do this properly.
To check neck relief: fret the low E at the first and 15th fret (not 12th) reach to the
7th fret and tap string. There should be a small space between string and fret - no thicker than a piece of paper. Do the same with the high E.
ACTION:
fret low E at first fret and measure the distance from the bottom of the to the top
of the 15th fret. It should be 5/64" (cm. 0,1984). Do the same with the high E,
measurement should be 3/64" (cm.0,1190).
Now measure the string height at the nut; underside of the string to the top of the
fret. Low E and A should measure 2/64" (cm. 0,0793), D and G =1.5/64" (cm.0,0595) and B and high E = 1/64" (cm. 0,0396).
If string height at nut is correct, recheck string height at 12th fret with strings open. Measurement for low and high E's should be the same as measurement taken at the 15th.
PICKUPS:
Fret low E at 22nd fret and measure pickup height from underside of string to point
on pickup closest to string. Bridge pickup should be 3/64" (cm.0,1190), neck pickup
should be 4/32"(cm.0,31751).
Fret high E at 22nd fret, distance for both pickups should be 3/32" (cm.0.2381).
Play test: Play every string at every fret checking for buzzes. Bend High E string 1
and 1/2 steps, beginning at the sixth fret and ending at 22nd, checking for "choking"
and to make sure string stays in nut notch."
Good luck with your setup!
Mario

Reading the pickup height values, I had one thought in an instant: They would work nicely for flatwounds. These produce mainly fundamentals. This property calls for bringing them closer to the bridge pickup since it is "seeing" a rather low fundamental amplitude. Plain strings will behave the same as in roundwound sets.

Furthermore, I sometimes pick over the bridge pickup, too. My poor technique calls for at least 2.5 mm or 0.1" string clearance there. [rolleyes]

The average piece of paper is 80 g/m² (approx. 0.26 oz/ft²) weight here and measures exactly 0.10 mm or circa 0.004" thickness. This would be sufficient for a flatwound E6th but call for a rather stiff action of the E1st, let alone a roundwound E6th. On my guitars you would find typically scarcely 0.2 mm or 0.008" for the E1st while the E6th slightly "bends" upwards on the frets and thus reads slightly over 0.25 mm or 0.01".

There is another point often overlooked and therefore driving players into despair. It is about buzz of roundwounds between fret and nut propagating through the string into the vibrating length. Admittedly it is much more critical on basses but it may foul up tone on guitars, too. Strings must be able to freely vibrate between fret and nut, too, and muting them there won't be of help. As well as the vibration is "wandering" to the "other side" under the fretting finger, it will do that under a muting finger, too. Stiffer action won't help, the only cure is more neck relief as I experienced over the decades. This problem is practically non-existent with flatwounds.

Some necks and fingerboards call for some hundredth of a millimeter more relief, others allow for less. I just try to get out the best of them all. [biggrin]
DVCVNT VOLENTEM FATA NOLENTEM TRAHVNT
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#12 User is offline   budglo 

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Posted 23 October 2014 - 02:05 PM

I have 2 335s and I set them up just a touch higher than my LP . My LP can go to 2-3/64ths no problem, but if I try to get the 335s than low I have buzzing on the frets past the 12th fret.
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