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All in one amps system


awel

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Hi again,

 

it should be questions/answers Thursday :)

Sorry post a lot today but I getting your experiences on several subjects.

 

I am thinking of moving from all valves/ tubes amplifiers with too many pedal effects on the floor to all in one amp system (line 6, Eleven rack, Fractal AXE FX (if I have the money of course :)), Hughes and Kettner Switchblade, or even Mac software like Irig/Amplitubes ...

 

I like the look of my Marshall head with the cabinet but now I am gigging more often and I thinking of something more simple and easy to carry.

 

For sure I am a tubes amps lover, but to be honest, I have more and more the feeling that people that came to see the show, come to see the show and are not really concerned by the 'is it a real tubes amps tone that he is using?'

So I think it is only because it bother me a bit be classified as 'not using a real amp guy'.

 

Does someone here using such a configuration and is it easy to accept the change(I mean to accept the fact playing on something else than classic gears)?

 

Modelisation has made huge progress and to be honest by exemple I have a friend that has the Axe FX, and even for Blues tone, it is difficult to say that it is modelisation.

 

If you're using or have used that kind of gear, please give you thoughts.

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I have a Kemper profiling amp and love it. Its easy to use, the layout is just like any other amp,you would use. The sounds once profiled are so good that side by side with the real tube amp you cannot tell the difference in sound. I hihgly recommend this product.

 

[thumbup]

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I have a Kemper profiling amp and love it. Its easy to use, the layout is just like any other amp,you would use. The sounds once profiled are so good that side by side with the real tube amp you cannot tell the difference in sound. I hihgly recommend this product.

 

[thumbup]

 

Thanks Drog

I have heard about the Kemper, I will definitively give it a try. [thumbup]

Does the Kemper has onboard effects and how are you using it? do you plug it directly in a PA or do you use a power amp and a cabinet?

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Yes it has onboard effects, you can set them pre or post, there is also a send/return should you want to use others as well. I run mine through a Line6 L2 FRFR speaker as my monitor and run another separate signal to front of house. I have my main volume set to only change my monitor level, so as to not affect the FOH feed. Another thing I do is set the input level for each guitar and save these for recall, then I Don't need to make different amps for different guitars.

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Yes it has onboard effects, you can set them pre or post, there is also a send/return should you want to use others as well. I run mine through a Line6 L2 FRFR speaker as my monitor and run another separate signal to front of house. I have my main volume set to only change my monitor level, so as to not affect the FOH feed. Another thing I do is set the input level for each guitar and save these for recall, then I Don't need to make different amps for different guitars.

 

Thanks, now tricky question :)

 

Does anyone ever said your sound was 'not natural' or that kind of stuff? I am playing in Classic Rock band so I am afraid to have to face that kind of comment

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Thanks, now tricky question :)

 

Does anyone ever said your sound was 'not natural' or that kind of stuff? I am playing in Classic Rock band so I am afraid to have to face that kind of comment

Nope, in fact I have guys asking what amp I running. Most are stunned when they find out its not a tube amp.

 

Let me add that I was/ am a tube amp lover, I Had tried several other replacements over the years (POD, VOX TONE LAB, LINE6 amp, Digitech GSP 1101, Roland GR55) and this is the first unit that sounds like a tube amp and can replace myntube amps. Its that good.

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Nope, in fact I have guys asking what amp I running. Most are stunned when they find out its not a tube amp.

 

Let me add that I was/ am a tube amp lover, I Had tried several other replacements over the years (POD, VOX TONE LAB, LINE6 amp, Digitech GSP 1101, Roland GR55) and this is the first unit that sounds like a tube amp and can replace myntube amps. Its that good.

 

Surprisingly, the most convincing to me solid-state amp with tube simulation was a cheap Johnson modelling amp, I have found in the basement rehearsal room of our company's Gothenburg headquarters.

 

Cheers... Bence

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Sorry Awel, can't help. I'm the original Analog Man.

 

lol

yes me too, but now I have gigs more often and most of the time it is not possible to park your car in front of the place where you're gonna play :( it's hell to put everything in place and the worst part is after the show.

 

I didn't say I will move and I am only try to find user's experience from this forum.

 

I love my Marshall, and specially the tone I have found with a Maxon OD808 and the MXR Carbon Copy (so as you may see, I am analog as well) but thing is as lead guitar I have to use the Marshall pedalboard as well in order to activate the Master Volume 2; that means I have the amp head, a 2X12 cabinet, 3 guitars, the pedaltrain + a Morpheus DropTune, my Wha and the marshall pedalboard.

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lol

yes me too, but now I have gigs more often and most of the time it is not possible to park your car in front of the place where you're gonna play :( it's hell to put everything in place and the worst part is after the show.

 

I didn't say I will move and I am only try to find user's experience from this forum.

 

I love my Marshall, and specially the tone I have found with a Maxon OD808 and the MXR Carbon Copy (so as you may see, I am analog as well) but thing is as lead guitar I have to use the Marshall pedalboard as well in order to activate the Master Volume 2; that means I have the amp head, a 2X12 cabinet, 3 guitars, the pedaltrain + a Morpheus DropTune, my Wha and the marshall pedalboard.

 

Well, you can profile your very own Marshall just how you like it. You can also model it with the OD808 and it will model that sound as well with the Kemper.

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Q: Is it possible to get an modeling amp and have it sound as good as a real tube amp?

A: no.

 

Q: Can an audience tell the difference?

A: Yes. They have ears too.

 

Q: Is the audience going to know if it's tube or fake digital sounds, analyze my rig and judge me as genuine?

A: No. They are gonna like what you are layin' down or they won't. They aren't gonna ask themselves why. They won't even ask why you are good if they think you are, or why you suck if you do.

 

IF you choose to go the modeling route, there are lots of folks that do and like it. There are also lots and lots of players that use the "real deal" rigs but sound not so good because they don't know how to use them. And to tell the truth, if YOU want to get good at getting a good sound and learning about what sounds good and what doesn't, that takes a lot of experience and a lot of work, just like how to play a song or guitar and have it sound good.

 

In my experience, guys that use modeling and effects and such never sound as good to me as the guys using real amps. Audience looses interest sooner, the sound grates on people after a shorter time. Sounds more "plasticky" as opposed to the sound of "talent". But that's me anylizing.

 

Q: Can I get a better sound out of real amps without all the huffing gear around?

A: Oh yea, baby.

 

If you REALLY want REAL tube sound and tone, chances are pretty good that your Marshall cab and head is WAY too big for the spaces you are playing. They can't be turned up to get what they have to offer. Therefore, you HAVE to have pedals to get distortion and that is likely what your "sound" is.

 

Try some good, QUALITY tube amps that you can actually turn up to the point of getting power tube distortion. Don't expect the Fender reissues or any reissue to sound good just because it has tubes. Or ANY tube amp for that matter. Just because it is tube don't make it good. LOTS of crappy tube amps out there.

 

There are LOTS of amps out there and lots of sounds. Let your ears decide and play them yourself, it's the only way. You generally get what you pay for. Don't balk at spending a couple grand. You easily spend that on a guitar, but the BEST quality in an amp can be had for no more than 3k. Think about it- the BEST.

 

20 watts should easily keep up with an un-miked drummer or a drummer barely miked. Go shopping.

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Q: Is it possible to get an modeling amp and have it sound as good as a real tube amp?

A: no.

 

Q: Can an audience tell the difference?

A: Yes. They have ears too.

 

Q: Is the audience going to know if it's tube or fake digital sounds, analyze my rig and judge me as genuine?

A: No. They are gonna like what you are layin' down or they won't. They aren't gonna ask themselves why. They won't even ask why you are good if they think you are, or why you suck if you do.

 

IF you choose to go the modeling route, there are lots of folks that do and like it. There are also lots and lots of players that use the "real deal" rigs but sound not so good because they don't know how to use them. And to tell the truth, if YOU want to get good at getting a good sound and learning about what sounds good and what doesn't, that takes a lot of experience and a lot of work, just like how to play a song or guitar and have it sound good.

 

In my experience, guys that use modeling and effects and such never sound as good to me as the guys using real amps. Audience looses interest sooner, the sound grates on people after a shorter time. Sounds more "plasticky" as opposed to the sound of "talent". But that's me anylizing.

 

Q: Can I get a better sound out of real amps without all the huffing gear around?

A: Oh yea, baby.

 

If you REALLY want REAL tube sound and tone, chances are pretty good that your Marshall cab and head is WAY too big for the spaces you are playing. They can't be turned up to get what they have to offer. Therefore, you HAVE to have pedals to get distortion and that is likely what your "sound" is.

 

Try some good, QUALITY tube amps that you can actually turn up to the point of getting power tube distortion. Don't expect the Fender reissues or any reissue to sound good just because it has tubes. Or ANY tube amp for that matter. Just because it is tube don't make it good. LOTS of crappy tube amps out there.

 

There are LOTS of amps out there and lots of sounds. Let your ears decide and play them yourself, it's the only way. You generally get what you pay for. Don't balk at spending a couple grand. You easily spend that on a guitar, but the BEST quality in an amp can be had for no more than 3k. Think about it- the BEST.

 

20 watts should easily keep up with an un-miked drummer or a drummer barely miked. Go shopping.

 

Hi Stein,

 

Thank you for your opinion.

Let me just clarify some points.

'If you REALLY want REAL tube sound and tone, chances are pretty good that your Marshall cab and head is WAY too big for the spaces you are playing. They can't be turned up to get what they have to offer. Therefore, you HAVE to have pedals to get distortion and that is likely what your "sound" is.'

 

Except about the place it takes and the weight it has, I never complained about my Marshall, I could not agree with your point about volume regarding spaces.

I know it was the case for the old Marshall (and any old amps anyway) that you have to play them loud to get the sound but since Marshall and others have Master Volume, there is no issue anymore, Master volume on my JVM-410 is always at 4, whatever I played in a small café (not taken by mic in the PA)or in a big festival (taken by a mic in the PA) and I am happy about the sound I add the Maxon only because I like the personality it adds to my base sound.

 

I couldn't agree with you either when you said that you need high priced amps to get a good sound, this of course depends of personal taste but honestly, I have seen a guy playing a Boss GT-10 directly into the PA with an Ibanez JEM guitars, he was alone on stage playing Classic Rock tunes, from Deep Purple, to Dire Straits, through Jimi Hendrix ... believe it or not, this guy had the best tone I've never heard, I couldn't believe he was not plugged into some very expensive Preamp, effects, and power amp. whatever he played, he got the right tone.

 

But like I said thank you for your answer :) I am collecting people opinions and I am not sure I am ready to cross the line to modelisation but I am getting older, and thank Lord, I am playing more and more often live, so until I get 2 roadies and my bank account allows me to take on the road the 7 very heavy and expensive amps of Joe Bonamassa, I am trying to make my life on the road a bit easier :)

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Haven't had a chance to go thru all the replies. I'm sure there's a bunch of different opinions. [thumbup]

 

I like my Line 6 Spider. I love my Flextone! If you read the manual (which most people don't) and don't know how to use it... You won't ever, get out of it, what it can do. Right now, my amp/setup of choice... a 1995 Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier running thru a 1968 Marshall Basketweave cab with 4x12 Greenbacks (emulated of course by a single 12" Celestion designed/made), sitting in my living room. Last night, I was playing thru a 1960 Fender Champ, thru it's 1x8" speaker (emulated of course). [flapper]

 

Are they perfect? The Champ, is pretty damn spot on, I'll tell you. They do a good job emulating the specific amps. The cabinets, are a bit different story. They're trying to recreate some classic stuff, mic'd under perfect conditions... that's where emulation stands, or should I say... sticks out, imo.

 

The 1x8", 2x10" and 4x12" (Marshall) cabs, sound sweet, to my ear. 2x12" sounds like crap, so far... and it sounds good bypassed/emulation, direct into the single 12".

 

Old amps (from the 90s - Line 6's first responses to putting their true POD abilities/emulation in an amp)... but when I saw one in great shape with the FB (wish I had long board), for $199 I snapped it up.

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Some replies reminds me the movie 'Crossroads', not the one with Britney Spears :), the one with Ralph Macchio (yes yes the Karate Kid guy!) in which a young guy is doing his way on the road with an old bluesman to find back the unrecorded Robert Johnson's last song.

 

This guy start the trip with an old beaten folk guitar, and the bluesman told him that Muddy Waters invented electric guitar!

 

It's the same here, even if I am some kind of purist, I love my tube amp, and all these analog effects, I think it is perhaps a time to grow up and take advantage of the technology and start using it.

 

But I am like most of you and to cross the line is a bit difficult :)

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Some replies reminds me the movie 'Crossroads', not the one with Britney Spears :), the one with Ralph Macchio (yes yes the Karate Kid guy!) in which a young guy is doing his way on the road with an old bluesman to find back the unrecorded Robert Johnson's last song.

 

This guy start the trip with an old beaten folk guitar, and the bluesman told him that Muddy Waters invented electric guitar!

 

It's the same here, even if I am some kind of purist, I love my tube amp, and all these analog effects, I think it is perhaps a time to grow up and take advantage of the technology and start using it.

 

But I am like most of you and to cross the line is a bit difficult :)

 

Blasphemy to a guitar players ears. [scared][biggrin]

 

I have a collection of tube and solid state amps. If I had to play a gig tomorrow I would use my Roland VG7. Folks can think what they like but I guarantee you that if I made a recording of the 2 solid state and two tube amps that are in this room with me right now no one could tell which was which.

 

The best move for convenience would be to get a Line6 POD HD and a good stereo power amp. Slap them both in a black tolex 2x12 combo cabinet. Slap a Marshall logo on it and watch everyone marvel at your amazing tube tone. [thumbup]

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Blasphemy to a guitar players ears. [scared][biggrin]

 

I have a collection of tube and solid state amps. If I had to play a gig tomorrow I would use my Roland VG7. Folks can think what they like but I guarantee you that if I made a recording of the 2 solid state and two tube amps that are in this room with me right now no one could tell which was which.

 

The best move for convenience would be to get a Line6 POD HD and a good stereo power amp. Slap them both in a black tolex 2x12 combo cabinet. Slap a Marshall logo on it and watch everyone marvel at your amazing tube tone. [thumbup]

 

[biggrin] I think exactly the same :)

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My son's been gigging with a Line 6 HD 500 and the matching DT 25 for a couple years to great fan and peer fare but can no longer take the risk of having another unit failure so he's going analog. My Line 6 Alchemist is also a wonderful sounding amp but is always in the shop. Made in China.....figures.

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To the few that do not believe you can get a tube sound from a profiling amp, let me assure you that you are wrong. I too was skeptical until I actually had my Kemper and profiled my very own tube amps ( you can see in my signature the amps I have). The Kemper captures the sound exactly and you cannot tell the difference between the two amps. The only difference is the playing feel of natural compression you get from a real tube amp while playing, it is very slight difference at that. Sound wise, its bang on to the original. The only way you guys will believe what it can do, is to profile an amp for yourself, then you too will be amazed.

 

The future is now!

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Blasphemy to a guitar players ears. [scared][biggrin]

 

I have a collection of tube and solid state amps. If I had to play a gig tomorrow I would use my Roland VG7. Folks can think what they like but I guarantee you that if I made a recording of the 2 solid state and two tube amps that are in this room with me right now no one could tell which was which.

 

The best move for convenience would be to get a Line6 POD HD and a good stereo power amp. Slap them both in a black tolex 2x12 combo cabinet. Slap a Marshall logo on it and watch everyone marvel at your amazing tube tone. [thumbup]

You really should look at that Roland solid stat amp in the clip I posted earlier, it sounds awesome, I could be very tempted by one of those.

 

Ian

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My son's been gigging with a Line 6 HD 500 and the matching DT 25 for a couple years to great fan and peer fare but can no longer take the risk of having another unit failure so he's going analog. My Line 6 Alchemist is also a wonderful sounding amp but is always in the shop. Made in China.....figures.

 

You should ALWAYS have a backup for live playing, ALWAYS. It does not matter what gear you use.

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Well, I should be selling my big tube amps because functionally nowadays, they're end tables at the house - and never leave the house. The big Fender head and cab are '65 (I played with the guy who bought them new when he bought them), the bigger combo is early '70s bought new.

 

A cupla points I can see here is that one difficulty - and it's been mine - is getting all kinds of power to play in a small venue. Yeah, my big "whomper" has a master volume, but still... did I really need 120 watts playing through two 12-inch speakers?

 

Secondly... I don't think I really can speak to SS tube emulation of various stomp boxes because, other than a volume pedal, I never used anything along those lines regardless what I was playing. And that's some 50 years of electric and later AE playing, including in rock, country, blues and variations of the above. I did use a Fender Leslie for 4-5 years in saloons, but not as folks use most stomp boxes.

 

Tubes aren't as reliable as SS should be (note I said "should be"), but I think that's less of a problem today than when I started out and there weren't grounds on any of the plugs one might find in most venues in the mid '60s. Bouncing tube amps around isn't all that neat a deal, either. On the other hand, other than a few blown fuses and pressing tubes into sockets after an especially bumpy road to a gig, I never had a problem that screwed up a gig by the amp not working.

 

Frankly my main reason for liking my little SS amps is that they're light for an old guy to carry, and I don't use or need the stomp boxes for what I've been doing the past 10 years. A little country, a little rock, a lotta cowboy AE and a batch of my own solo fingerstyle arrangements of standards that are kinda "elevator music" and work well with about anything.

 

But I recognize a lotta folks hope for "more." Link Wray sliced up his amp's speaker to get a more raw sound some 55years ago. Each to his or her own.

 

I really don't think any amp rig is "perfect" for everything which is why ... <grin> so many of us under up with more than one through the years, although such as the old Fender DR and Twins never go outa style. I've only used a big Marshall combo once on stage and it was sweet, sweet to run with an archtop at even relatively low volumes in a 500-seat theater.

 

So I'd suggest studying and playing your guitar through stuff. Some day... yeah, I think we're likely to have plain amps powered by our smartphones or pads...

 

m

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