Fender USA Vintage 58 Tele

[Marshall Paul]

if you'd buy one that's gigged to buggery then fair call, but I read as though this one was brand spanking new - as in from USA factory (via QC) to warehouse to store to customer.

 

if it were a $2300 chainsaw or air compressor or whatever tool and brand new but you couldn't use it without fixing it first, well I'd be p!ssed if that were the manufacturer and retailers response, and the buyer may not be aware even how to go about fixing it. (mind you I'm a wimp about such matters though )

 

 

LOL! Thanks mate

 

Was going to reply but I don't think I need to now Spot on...

[NHTom]

This guy didn't pay extra for damage. He paid for a flawless reissue.

 

 

Oh, I understand........and he has every right to be upset about it. I would be. Just making my point on part of why it seems that QC has gone out the window in recent years.

 

NHTom

[saturn]

This thread is a great under-card to Mayweather/Pacquiao

[Marshall Paul]

prefer the dobermans come in and throw a padlock on? maybe hand out red cards?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lol

[4Hayden]

I wasn't talking to you, since you mentioned it. Who is "we"? You talking for you or somebody else?

 

 

So you can't conceive of the idea that someone out 3 and 4 nights a week for years with a halfa dozen Fenders might be quite used to re-aligning the neck? That beating on them takes its toll? Or do you just assume everyone has exactly the same experience as you?

 

 

 

Did you read all the words?

 

 

 

I have stickers on my cases that have been to more gigs than you it sounds like. It's a tool, you use it, put it down, get the other one for the next song. Nobody wants to watch you coo over it and slather it with finger ease and wipe it down, they want to hear music, made by the tools of music.

 

 

 

So you'd be in South Carolina and ready to get it on and yer 6 year old Tele neck is a tad off because it's been a rough three months you'd "send it back"? Let me know how that works out for you.

 

 

 

Again, did you read all the words? If so, it should be easy for you to point out where exactly I said I was happy with it.

 

 

 

Big Tips: Either stop taking yourself so seriously or stop reading my posts. Doing both things would probably help you live longer in less hate.

 

rct

Thanks for clearing that up rct

 

4H

[rct]

Thanks for clearing that up rct

 

4H

 

Well, I mighta been a little TOO tongue in cheek with the first response.

 

But seriously, shifting the neck on Fenders has always been, at times, needed. Maybe a lot less today, and you certainly shouldn't pay for a fancy reissue and have it arrive like that picture Seemed to show, because really, not a great picture with two different angles like that it is hard to see. It would be better for a full look up the guitar from the bridge. It shouldn't have gone out like that, and the dealer should not have tried to sell it like that.

 

"sloppy neck pockets" on Fenders became the phrase of the day in the early HCGF days, they were under every bed the way people were squawking about them. And back then there were tonnes of people saying the same thing I said.

 

"fret sprout" was the one for Gibsons. In my life I've put a file on maybe a dozen individual frets on quite a few Gibsons, it was never something I ever thought about or was a deal breaker but man, you'da thought people were bleeding to death at the Mars from razor sharp Gibsons back then.

 

But hey, if peoples knickers get bunched up their cracks that's too bad. If their experience is different from mine that is good. Shifting necks and sharp frets don't make, in my opinion, any guitar a POS. I don't know what people do if their tires get low, or god forbid they have to air them up the second week they have the new car. Do they send it back???

 

rct

[4Hayden]

Well, I mighta been a little TOO tongue in cheek with the first response.

 

But seriously, shifting the neck on Fenders has always been, at times, needed. Maybe a lot less today, and you certainly shouldn't pay for a fancy reissue and have it arrive like that picture Seemed to show, because really, not a great picture with two different angles like that it is hard to see. It would be better for a full look up the guitar from the bridge. It shouldn't have gone out like that, and the dealer should not have tried to sell it like that.

 

"sloppy neck pockets" on Fenders became the phrase of the day in the early HCGF days, they were under every bed the way people were squawking about them. And back then there were tonnes of people saying the same thing I said.

 

"fret sprout" was the one for Gibsons. In my life I've put a file on maybe a dozen individual frets on quite a few Gibsons, it was never something I ever thought about or was a deal breaker but man, you'da thought people were bleeding to death at the Mars from razor sharp Gibsons back then.

 

But hey, if peoples knickers get bunched up their cracks that's too bad. If their experience is different from mine that is good. Shifting necks and sharp frets don't make, in my opinion, any guitar a POS. I don't know what people do if their tires get low, or god forbid they have to air them up the second week they have the new car. Do they send it back???

 

rct

I'm one of those that sets up "my" guitar the way I want it before i ever hit a lick/riff,

checking frets,necks,tuners and even the nut is part of buying a new guitar.I guess some play them straight out of the box.

Here are my two:

Select American strat:

60th Anniversary telecaster American:

 

4H

[Searcy]

I don't know what people do if their tires get low, or god forbid they have to air them up the second week they have the new car. Do they send it back???

 

rct

 

If I paid top dollar for a brand new car and it was delivered by the dealer with flat tires, yes, I would send it back.

[Marshall Paul]

Oh, I understand........and he has every right to be upset about it. I would be. Just making my point on part of why it seems that QC has gone out the window in recent years.

 

NHTom

 

 

What else could it be Tom? Ok, a worker on a late Friday afternoon has a slip up and something gets through. But it's QC's job after that part of the process (and periodically through the process) to make sure it doesn't get past end manufacturing and through to distributing. But I'm begining to think that maybe QC isn't the problem. Maybe the manufacturers have let their tolerances out so far that the problem is right there instead. QC knows this, checks evrything is still within these (sloppy) tolerances, and lets them through to the distributer. The new owner recieves it, sees, feels, and hears the problems, and goes WTF? I'm begining to think more and more along this line.

[NHTom]

What else could it be Tom? Ok, a worker on a late Friday afternoon has a slip up and something gets through. But it's QC's job after that part of the process (and periodically through the process) to make sure it doesn't get past end manufacturing and through to distributing. But I'm begining to think that maybe QC isn't the problem. Maybe the manufacturers have let their tolerances out so far that the problem is right there instead. QC knows this, checks evrything is still within these (sloppy) tolerances, and lets them through to the distributer. The new owner recieves it, sees, feels, and hears the problems, and goes WTF? I'm begining to think more and more along this line.

 

 

I think you might be on to something with the "sloppy QC tolerances" thing.

 

If only half of the "loose" ones get returned, then the factory only has to deal with half.....if they all got stopped at QC, then they have to deal with all of them.........cheaper in the long run for the factory.

 

They probably figure between novices who won't know better, do it yourselfers who will just quietly fix it, and shops who will fix it without getting the factory involved, it's worth the gamble.

 

NHTom

[capmaster]

... Maybe the manufacturers have let their tolerances out so far that the problem is right there instead. ...

Not just maybe, that's a fact. They call it "Quality Management", invented to gain maximum profit. It's about marketing goods produced at lowest cost level as if they matched the at all obtainable quality level. ISO certification systems support this perspective. The different levels are referred to the tolerance benchmarks the examinees are setting themselves!

 

It's a real existing horror that the dreaded "Quality Management" attitude is also applied within the pharmaceutical industry. One of the largest international pharma groups from Switzerland installed an infernally cunning internal concealment system to undermine pharmaceutical laws. These rules sidestep the conscience of the responsible persons by keeping vital informations secrets. They pretend to do so for data security although international regulations call for transparency. As you may imagine easily, problems within medicines usually remain hidden even to the experienced eye, so the risks are unforeseeable without laboratory examination by the customer. The top managemant knows that this will never happen.

[flyingfrets]

You can't fault Fender for Guitar Guitar's sales policy, and shame on the buyer for not doing due diligence...

 

Actually, yeah I can and I kinda do. I've been in situations where a retailer tried to leave me holding the bag after the sale and the manufacturer forced them to rectify the problem at risk of losing their "franchise." Anything could've happened to that guitar after it left the factory, but I'd be hard pressed to believe that Fender wants something like that to reflect negatively on them. For their part, surely Guitar Guitar can't regard this as $129 entry level guitar. At the going rate for this guitar, the consumer has a right to expect that things be "just so." And NO, I don't consider string changes or set ups in that category...but the guitar should have been playable and only needing minor tweaks if anything at all.

 

About a year ago, I spent roughly half the price of this Tele on an acoustic. Don't even remember what it was because I only had it a few hours. Bought at GC and had to compete over a volume war in the Acoustic Room. Liked the way it played, but could NOT hear that 2 of the frets (14 & 15) were high. Took it back and asked them to fix it. They wanted to charge me $160 for a complete fret level - on a BRAND NEW guitar! I told them "No way. The guitar is new and shouldn't have been sold with this issue." Then they started with the "Well, in that price range...yada yada yada." $700 isn't the same as dropping $3800 on a Martin, but it's not chump change either. I told 'em "F_ck it. Gimme my money back." The weren't happy, but they did it. The guitar was back on the wall before I left.

 

The catch is, I could've fixed the high frets myself in about 45 minutes including restringing. Point is, I didn't feel like it. I wasn't shopping for a project guitar. And I still believe given that it was brand spanking new, the repair shouldn't have been my responsibility to begin with.

 

OTOH, if I had been shopping for a used project guitar and came across the Tele in question, I would've discreetly done as rct suggested...tried shifting the neck. If I'd felt it was repairable and within my skill set, I'd have been all over it - for $600 tops. Not the going retail rate. The seller would've known there was an issue, even if they didn't know what it was. And if I'm being honest, I wouldn't feel any particular obligation to tell him. If I'm buying, what I'm doing with it (regardless how simple) is my business.

 

But that's it in a nutshell. I make the differentiation and distinction based on whether the instrument is new or used, the price & ultimately what kind of effort I'm willing to put into it. And given that the Tele was new at full retail, I would've expected it to be playable out of the box. Fender AND Guitar Guitar most definitely could have done much better by this customer.