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A country song, or is it?


Lars68

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I have been writing a few songs recently, and when writing a new one a few days ago, I set out to try to do a few things differently. My songs have mostly tended to be minor key, mumbling, depressive, no chorus kind of songs. So for this one I set out to write a country song, with an obvious chorus, and also try to use my voice some more by singing louder and going for some higher than usual notes.

 

Well, because it is me, there are still two minor chords in there and the lyrics are not exactly upbeat. But in a country song jobs and love have to be lost, right?

 

Below is a practice run. Would you consider this a country song?

 

https://soundcloud.com/lars1968/sweetheart-caroline-2

 

The guitar playing is kind of simple and repetitive, and I'll work on making it more interesting. The singing is off here and there, but improving (or?). I think I might pull this one off with more practice. Please let me know what you think.

 

Lars

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Hey Lars, I liked it!

 

Goes to show you that you don't need to only use minor chords to create a very touching story. :)

 

Maybe a little more folk-y than country to me, but anyway that's not important.

 

There are dozens of songs with this kind of story, boy meets girl, they have a kid, get old...and I really enjoyed your version of that story. I really wanted to hear where it would go right when it started. This is the mark of a captivating story in my book. I liked the meoldoy as well. Verse...chorus... all that stuff. Nice going, and I'm sure you'll be showing us your newer versions, right?

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Hey Lars, I liked it!

 

Goes to show you that you don't need to only use minor chords to create a very touching story. :)

 

Maybe a little more folk-y than country to me, but anyway that's not important.

 

There are dozens of songs with this kind of story, boy meets girl, they have a kid, get old...and I really enjoyed your version of that story. I really wanted to hear where it would go right when it started. This is the mark of a captivating story in my book. I liked the meoldoy as well. Verse...chorus... all that stuff. Nice going, and I'm sure you'll be showing us your newer versions, right?

 

Avery, yes this is most likely only the first version in a never ending string of trial and error to get it right [biggrin]

I always move forward a little faster from the forum feedback. It helps me focus my efforts.

 

Glad you liked the lyrics. I thought they very sligthly on the cheesy side myself [biggrin] The song could do with some of your wonderful travis picking. Maybe one day, I'll have to give it a try. So many things to learn, so little time. [mellow]

 

Lars

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Hey LARS... I like Avery's take...

 

This might be improved by being less somber?

 

Nice though!

 

Thanks, Sal. Do you mean less somber, as in faster pace and more volume in the singing? You know, this was loud for being me, but I try to learn... [smile]

 

Lars

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I'd call it folk, but with a few twangs here and there it can be a bit country. The two genres share a lot of attributes and often cross each others borders effortlessly. John Denver and Cash, along with several others did that all the time. Country singers often sing folk songs and folksingers often sing country songs. Don't worry what some might pigeon-hole it in. Make your songs your own and do them your way. I like the story. It's about "folks," so that definitely pushed it in the folk direction...lol....Keep writing and playing. [thumbup] It's also good to see you not be so dependent on minor chords.

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Lars,

I think it needs some interest... I hear the verse and the chorus, and the temp and pattern is the same throughout. I think you can really beef it up with a bridge, or something to break it up a little.

Also, this is a story about about a boy and a girl, who has no care in the world and no cause to feel blue, but yet these lyrics contrast with the music.

I think it's great that you are focusing on writing your own stuff, and not covers. I need to do more of that. But when you write, be thinking always what's the story you want to tell? Set it up... You are telling a story.

I have my own challenges with this, so I am not an expert. But if you want to "listen to how it's done", listen to Sinatra singing Bobby Mercer's one for my baby, at the sands.

 

Finally, never ever have trepidation posting... Good or bad. Have courage and own it. It's how you are getting better.... And you are... I think we all are.

Cool?

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Lars, I think there is a good song in there.Sometimes the fact that you waver on pitch obscures the quality of the songwriting a little.It's a well written song.

The "Caroline the road goes on" is a bit repetitive and not so strong lyrically.Maybe vary that a bit.

Anyway just an opinion - keep it up.

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Just want to add to the great advice given, that I did notice a couple pitch issues too, but I am confident you'll get them ironed out. You have really, really improved in that area, and will always get there in the end after applying yourself. [thumbup]

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Thanks guys. It is this kind of advice that makes me post works in progress, even though I'm kind of embaressed by the quality of my stuff sometimes. I've decided not to care too much about that. I know I have been able to come up with passable quality by sticking with the songs and not giving up on them too early.

 

I appreciate all advice given, and will use it to improve the song. I hear the pitch issues, but think I can work them out with practice. That is the way my songs tend to develop. I can't seem to sing them at first. I tend to write them in my head and learn to sing them afterwards

 

I'll be back... [biggrin]

 

Lars

 

By the way, how noticeable is it that English is my second language? Accent, phrasing etc??

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Lars, I think your English is very good. You often use bigger and more expressive words than many who speak English as their main/native language. For myself, I often use a lot of slang words, especially when writing and because their part of my daily vocabulary. Someone like yourself, who is learning the language, is likely more conscious of precise pronunciation and the use of more formal words. You use the language clearly and intelligently. You're also more capable at translating from one language to another than I could be.

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Been paying attention to all advice give above. I have a version I think is greatly improved. I tried to play more rythmic, changed the lyrics in the chorus (which was weak, just as pointed out), and I brought the tempo down in the third verse and changed chords. Most importantly, I think my singing is muck closer to pitch wich of course makes a world of difference.

 

https://soundcloud.com/lars1968/sweetheart-caroline-1

 

Do you think my changes are for the better? Please give an honest opinion.

 

Lars

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Lars I can tell you changed it around quite a bit for the better. Your pitch seems to match it better. I still believe it has the folk tune going on with it.

 

 

Thank you! With the changes, it turned into quite a nice little tune. I kind of like it myself, if I may say so [biggrin]

 

I think the song, with added changes, is actually much better than my playing and singing. So in the end, I might be holding my own song back, but as Neil Young often says " that's okey too".

 

And if it wants to be a folk song, instead of a country song, well that's okey too.

 

Lars

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Lars, I really like this song, I find it very pleasing, kudos!

 

I do like the new bridge you added in. Very nice, it's a really nice addition to break up the monotony of only verse and chorus.

 

I also like at 1:45 "had faded into rust". Maybe this is just me, but I like the way you deliver that lyric, with a little vocal "swagger," don't know why, but that one stood out to me.

 

Do you think you might be able to bring back the higher singing you did for "They courted for a year". I thought that sounded really good, on pitch, and you toned it all down here. I like it the most when you push yourself. I know these are the moments when we all can fall on our faces, so to speak, but when we hit the notes we're going for they sound great, and they sounded fine in the previous versions.

 

A couple pitch issues, to my ears at least, specifically in the "Caroline, Caroline" parts of the chorus. 2:03, 2:59, 3:05. Just on the first time you say Caroline, specifically on the "ine", I think it is a little flat, or at least according to how I envision the melody. Maybe this is all in my head.

 

The melody of this song really reminds me of a cartoon I watched as a kid where Art Garfunkel made a guest appearance as a singing moose. If you want me to post it, I will. :lol:

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Avery, first of all, a big thanks for taking the time to listen so carefully and then posting such detailed feedback. This is a wonderful help for me!

 

The high pitch part that I toned down, definetely belongs in the song. I believe it is a high c-note, and it is the note I'm hearing when singing in my head. I hit it right on the first try on the previous version, but when reworking the song and trying to sort out other issues, I kept missing and couldn't do it the necessary three times for the song. My singing capablities are like a lottery, but I'm not giving up and will keep trying until that note and the other misses are sorted out.

 

Yes, pleast post the cartoon link of the Art-moose. That could be hilarious, and perhaps I can "borrow" one or two things. [biggrin]

 

Lars

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Different tempo, but the melody is kind of similar?

 

 

Avery, first of all, a big thanks for taking the time to listen so carefully and then posting such detailed feedback. This is a wonderful help for me!

 

The high pitch part that I toned down, definetely belongs in the song. I believe it is a high c-note, and it is the note I'm hearing when singing in my head. I hit it right on the first try on the previous version, but when reworking the song and trying to sort out other issues, I kept missing and couldn't do it the necessary three times for the song. My singing capablities are like a lottery, but I'm not giving up and will keep trying until that note and the other misses are sorted out.

 

Yes, pleast post the cartoon link of the Art-moose. That could be hilarious, and perhaps I can "borrow" one or two things. [biggrin]

 

Lars

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Well, the only difference as far as I can tell between my song and the one in the link is that Art Garfunkel is a marginally better singer, and that is only if I have a bad day and he is on top of his game [biggrin]

 

Joking aside, there are similarities, for sure. Who would have guessed that I "stole" my song from a cartoon. I hope I don't get sued when my song hits the charts... [scared]

 

Lars

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Lars, I really admire your dedication to writing original material, and this is a good story that is worth telling .... but in all honesty, it really doesnt do it justice because the vocals let it down.

 

What I hear is that the vocals are just far too pitchy Lars, the timing is not consistent and you sing too much from your throat, lacking resonance and warmth in your voice. All these areas need to be worked on made tidier to give the song what it deserves, and no doubt expresses the sentiment you are trying to communicate to the audience.

 

Im being honest and hard on you because i know you will work on it and appreciate the feedback, as i have in the past, and believe me ive gotten some strong feedback from the board here, but have took in on, applied and its starting to get traction.

 

I said it before and i will repeat it, I really encourage you to do a vocal course or get vocal lessons. Singing is like playing guitar, you need to have a basic, solid foundation that you can rely on and right now you dont have that, its just too thin and vulnerable ... like melting, spring ice on a Swedish lake.

 

Please take it in good spirit, the song has a lot of potential but to give it justice it also needs richer, more soulful vocals. Main thing to focus on is try to learn how to sing more through your chest voice to give more bass resoance, you actually did that more on Var Stad, listen to yourself there and think what you did to get more warmth and resonance in your voice.

 

I look forward to the next version Lars.

 

cheers,

EA

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EA, I hear what you are saying, and I take it all in good spirit. I am very aware of the shortcomings of the vocals.

 

As you might know, I now play regularly with my neighbor. She's the lovely lady who plays organ and accordion on some of my songs. I have talked to her about the issues you and others point out, and she has kindly agreed to help me with my singing. So with her help, I hope to get better.

 

On the positive side, I at least hear the major pitch issues now. About six months ago, I was clueless. Even though I realize the singing is poor, I have kept posting songs with poor performances here. I get so much valuable input on the songs overall, not just the singing, which I would not get otherwise. So, I have decided to swallow my pride and keep going.

 

The truth hurts a little, but I need it, and that's why the songs are here. So no problem with the feedback EA, absolutely not.

 

Lars

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Just wanted to say, that you're gonna get there with the pitch issues. (interestingly, I wonder if version 1 had the fewest pitch issues, but without the lovely bridge you added). Anyway, to my ears you are pretty strong in the verses, a bit off during several moments in the choruses, but it's simply a matter of polishing off the few rough spots. Anyway, keep singing with as much power and volume in your next version. I think people have a tendency to try to sing softly to correct pitch issues, but that is not a relevant fix and it takes away from the power of the original.

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Just wanted to say, that you're gonna get there with the pitch issues. (interestingly, I wonder if version 1 had the fewest pitch issues, but without the lovely bridge you added). Anyway, to my ears you are pretty strong in the verses, a bit off during several moments in the choruses, but it's simply a matter of polishing off the few rough spots. Anyway, keep singing with as much power and volume in your next version. I think people have a tendency to try to sing softly to correct pitch issues, but that is not a relevant fix and it takes away from the power of the original.

 

I will try to sing with the power from the first version, but with the added changes from the second.

 

Another thing, I am very puzzled by my own strengths and shortcomings. Some of my songs have turned out quite nice once the singing is on pitch, and I tend to write them without much effort. They are by no stretch of the imagination any masterpieces. How can I write them when I can't even sing them.. [biggrin]

 

Lars

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I will try to sing with the power from the first version, but with the added changes from the second.

 

Another thing, I am very puzzled by my own strengths and shortcomings. Some of my songs have turned out quite nice once the singing is on pitch, and I tend to write them without much effort. They are by no stretch of the imagination any masterpieces. How can I write them when I can't even sing them.. [biggrin]

 

Lars

 

Yes, that is a puzzling conundrum, right? YOU come up with a melody, but then I or someone else says you are singing a bit "off the melody". Then how there was a melody to begin with. Anyway, onward and upward, looking forward to the next version. :rolleyes:

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Yes, that is a puzzling conundrum, right? YOU come up with a melody, but then I or someone else says you are singing a bit "off the melody". Then how there was a melody to begin with. Anyway, onward and upward, looking forward to the next version. :rolleyes:

 

That is funny and an observation that hasn't crossed my mind before.

 

Seriously though, I know by some kind of instinct, I guess, what melody I want. Whenever I play a new song for my piano playing neighbor, she will often say "I'm not quite sure where you want the melody to go on this part". I will then try to sing it, and most of the time fail miserably in finding what I want. She will then instead play versions of the part on the piano, and I can the immediately tell her when it is "correct".

 

By the way, I simply love this hobby. Music and guitars are soul savers!!

 

Lars

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