Roach Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I think this is the right place to post this? Advanced apologies if it is not. I have concluded that i need a real amp. There is a dsl100h marshal head WITH 4/12 cab brand new at GC. I played guitar long time but have little skill. Development is slow. (have habit of playing rather than practising). I do not feel that i am ready even to join others and i do not need the full volume of this half stack, but it is $899. correction: the head is $899, the cab brings it to $1299 http://www.guitarcenter.com/Marshall/DSL100H-and-MX412A-4x12-100W-All-Tube-Half-Stack-1367851258957.gc?pfm=item_page.rr2 Is there something low quality about this as compared to the other more expensive heads. They say you get what you pay for, right? What might be missing that brings this head down to such a low price? Also at what point does one decide if their skill level is worthy of owning such an item? I am poor, but i happened to get a chunk of money today, that really has more mature responsible uses, but i need something with better tone than the cheap solid state amps i been using that are trying to emulate real amps. so i guess that is several questions. Sorry its all slurred like that im on my way out the door to pick up this money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10K-DB Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 You didnt mention if you played thru it yet,,if you have,,what do you think? price is ok,,although I got rid of my 5150 EVH head+ 4-12 cabs years ago,,too much to haul after you get done w/a gig @ 1:30 in the morning,,and have to unload it by yourself when you get home. These days I enjoy the 100wtt Fender 2-12 Champion 100,,it has great built in effects,,great sounding special design speakers,,in a cabnet thats easy to haul by your self,,and its LOUD as you may ever need in most clubs. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Price seems OK. Where do you live...apartment, house, house in the country, etc. 100 watt Marshall 1/2 stack, at it's "sweet spot" is blisteringly loud! (I know, I own a TSL 100 1/2 Stack...and it mostly sits quietly in the room, looking great, but not making a sound!) A "real amp" is one you'll use, constantly, and love the sound of, regardless of wattage! In an apartment situation, a 5 watt tube amp, with a great speaker, will annoy your neighbors, no end...unless it has a headphone jack, etc. I understand the "want" of something "grand," but the reality of actual "need," may be something different. You have to ask yourself, realistically, "why" you're actually interested in such a large, LOUD, and Heavy amp, for "bedroom" or "man cave" playing. If you just really WANT one, and have the coin to buy it...Go For It! But, you won't be able to use it, to it full potential in most "working musician's" venues, these days! IF you can even find a venue, anymore, that allows "Live" music! Too many (at least in this area) have gone to Karaoke, and/or Internet Juke Box DJ's. as opposed to "Live" bands. I DO (still) play out, a bit, in bars and small clubs, and use either a Marshall AVT-20 (20 watt SS, with tube pre-amp, and 10" speaker), or Fender Blues Jr (15 watt, all tube amp, with 12" speaker) They are both, plenty loud, for those venues...often "too loud," for the venue patron's and owner's ears! I have other amps, at various higher wattage. They rarely get used, anymore, as all are "too loud," for folks, these days. The point is (finally), a good tube, hybrid, or even solid state amp, can be your "Real" amp! You truly don't need 100 watt 1/2 stack! If you're set on a "tube" amp, try some much smaller amps! There are a LOT of great amps, these days. Take some time, and play through a BUNCH of them...find the one that sounds the best, won't break the bank, and is more than adequate, for your current, AND future needs! There are some, with variable wattage circuits, to allow you to tailor the output, to your need(s). Good Luck, and good hunting (which is 1/2 the fun, anyway..IMHO)! CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megafrog Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 I have a DSL100h and the corresponding 4x12 cab. My recommendation is if you are going to get one of these, get it re-tubed almost immediately. The stock tubes don't provide much clarity when you are using any sort of gain. Another note is you have to crank this on the clean channel to get any reasonable volume for playing a small venue. The gain channel on this gets very loud and the high gain gets a bit louder (and less decipherable). In theory this should be a big step up from the DSL40C but the DSL40C sounds vastly superior in my opinion. Another thought for you is to shop around for the amp head (as well as the cab). I got my amp head new from Alto Music on sale for $589 and the cab on sale from Sam Ash shipped for $349. To answer your question on if this is low quality or not, the answer is very. This has low quality components (hence my suggestion to re-tube immediately) and the cab has the lowest end Celestions you could imagine, made specifically for this cab. The cab's handles are very flimsy plastic. If you are going to get the amp head, I would personally go for a used 1960 Marshall Cab that has real Celestions in it. That will improve the sound tremendously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 My amp buying formula (pat pend.) A = the price you can buy it for B = what people are asking for them second-hand/used C = B x 0.5 = what people get for them if they want a reasonably quick sale D = A - C = what you lose if it doesn't do what you hoped it would Then, if D is acceptable to you to risk in exchange for what you hope it might do for you, go for it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad1 Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 My amp buying formula (pat pend.) A = the price you can buy it for B = what people are asking for them second-hand/used C = B x 0.5 = what people get for them if they want a reasonably quick sale D = A - C = what you lose if it doesn't do what you hoped it would Then, if D is acceptable to you to risk in exchange for what you hope it might do for you, go for it! I like that formula of yours! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfpup Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 You really have to consider venue as well. Where do you play? 100 watts = stadiums 25 watts = clubs 10 watts = small clubs and rehearsals 5 watts = living room 1 watt = bedroom Tube amps are loud. Also, surprisingly, 100 watts is not twice as loud as 50 watts. 100 watts is only about 3db louder than 50 watts and about 6db louder than 25 watts. It's an equation many players forget. Also any small amp can be miked to play a large venue, but a 100 watt Marshall in a bedroom never works out well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 I like that formula of yours! Wish I'd worked it out about 5 amps earlier though! Also, surprisingly, 100 watts is not twice as loud as 50 watts. 100 watts is only about 3db louder than 50 watts and about 6db louder than 25 watts. It's an equation many players forget. Gives those 25's or 30's in the quadbox a nice kicking when pushed though eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfpup Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 Gives those 25's or 30's in the quadbox a nice kicking when pushed though eh? Giddyup! Nothing like it. Given the right room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megafrog Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 My amp buying formula (pat pend.) A = the price you can buy it for B = what people are asking for them second-hand/used C = B x 0.5 = what people get for them if they want a reasonably quick sale D = A - C = what you lose if it doesn't do what you hoped it would Then, if D is acceptable to you to risk in exchange for what you hope it might do for you, go for it! That is a great formula! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Gibson Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 Fender has got some great tube amps,but I'm not gonna tell you what to buy. I bought a lot of amps before I got my 68 twin. I'm pretty happy with it. Works great for a pedal head like me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
american cheez Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 if you aren't playing in a big place, like others have said, don't buy a big amp. if you're just rockin the garage with a buddy on drums, 15w/2/12 is plenty. if you're rockin the house, playing along to mp3s, 1w-5w/1x12 max. do you want a sweet tube amp without breaking the bank? you need to check out these guys http://www.vhtamp.com especially if you like marshall sound. if you can find a better hand wired tube amp for less than this, buy it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 Its too big. 15w combo will do yer (30w tops). If you want it to look bigger, try some empty boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookieman15061 Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 Keep practicing on your solid state amp. Good players sound good on anything. If you're poor like you say you are then yes the chunk can go to more important things. Just my opinion though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searcy Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 If you're practicing at home there's nothing better than a good solid state amp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roach Posted February 12, 2017 Author Share Posted February 12, 2017 You didnt mention if you played thru it yet,,if you have,,what do you think? price is ok,,although I got rid of my 5150 EVH head+ 4-12 cabs years ago,,too much to haul after you get done w/a gig @ 1:30 in the morning,,and have to unload it by yourself when you get home. These days I enjoy the 100wtt Fender 2-12 Champion 100,,it has great built in effects,,great sounding special design speakers,,in a cabnet thats easy to haul by your self,,and its LOUD as you may ever need in most clubs. Just a thought. yes i have played through it, but not with my own guitar,good point about hauling it. Thanks all for good answers, i thought the dsl100h and 4/12 sounded beautiful even at low volume, but i understand that is not where it sounds best. Also i was not using my own guitar which of course i would have to do before i committed to it. Oh and the reason i was looking at this in the first place was not for its size or wattage or look, but for the tone. I love that sound from marshall tube amps and cabs especially going in with a les paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roach Posted February 12, 2017 Author Share Posted February 12, 2017 If you're practicing at home there's nothing better than a good solid state amp. i must disagree there searcy. playing through this half stack is a tremendous amount of more fun than playing through my solid state amps. no matter where i play it at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 100 watts = stadiums 25 watts = clubs 10 watts = small clubs and rehearsals 5 watts = living room 1 watt = bedroom Also any small amp can be miked to play a large venue, but a 100 watt Marshall in a bedroom never works out well. This. A Marshall 100w half-stack is WAY too loud for your current (and probably future) needs. What about something like a Vox AC15 VR? http://www.gear4musi...ozgPRoC_a7w_wcB ...and if you really insist on more wattage then the similar AC30 isn't that much more money; https://www.gak.co.u...XjnjxoClvrw_wcB Pip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searcy Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 i must disagree there searcy. playing through this half stack is a tremendous amount of more fun than playing through my solid state amps. no matter where i play it at. You can get a solid state half stack. Personally I like 2x12 twin style combos best. I prefer solid state as they are a lot more easy to control at low volumes than tube amps that usually loose all their magic when not cranked up some impolite level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 ...I like 2x12 twin style combos best. I prefer solid state as they are a lot more easy to control at low volumes than tube amps that usually loose all their magic when not cranked up some impolite level... I got a 60 watt Fender Deville in The Man Cave and it is way to much. That is why I got a 15 watt Fender Blues Jr. for the front room and it is still loud as f-uck. The Vox pairing I posted are both hybrid valve/SS designs - as is the case with my Music Man 2x12. I can't find any fault the hybrid concept in any way. FWIW; my MM is rated at 65w. The only occasion I've had it to 10 on both channel & master was when playing a 700-seater hall and it was plenty loud enough and that was me going into the lower-power channel 2. Pip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 of course theres always 'old school' if you have a big enough bedroom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 If that picture is not photo shopped it is damn funny. It came from here My link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roach Posted February 12, 2017 Author Share Posted February 12, 2017 If that picture is not photo shopped it is damn funny. i think van halen did this fake wall of speaker cabs. some good advice everyone has given me some things to think on. I will hold off and continue playing through my line 6 spyder IV 15 for now. Some of you pointed out some obvious logical things, like desire vs need. My emotions and desire was clouding my head a bit. It has helped me to keep realistic about the whole thing, so i appreciate all the replies. When i finally can justify a purchase like that with my ability, a 2/12 tube combo or even the dsl40c is probably the next step up. One of my friends stumbled on a 1950 gibson tube amp with 8" speaker, little tiny thing with an incredible sound. At the same time he found an old firebird. He got it at a pawnshop from an owner that didnt know what he had. The luck of some fools i tell ya SO back to the possibility of losing control and throwing my money into music and bad choices... maybe ill go run out like a fool and get my 3rd les paul! ...or an explorer.... hmmm nope better not Hey those are hard to find no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 If that picture is not photo shopped it is damn funny. It came from here... I thought there was something not quite as I remembered it from the first snap and, voila, the one I had seen before was this one from the link in m-e's post; Funny as this is I don't have the slightest problem with it. Bands (in this case 'Immortal') are paid to put on a show. If the music is good and loud enough and the audience is happy then 'the Show' is a success. Who cares that the 'Stratocaster' smashed to bits at the end of every Blackmore performance of the '70s and '80s was a POS fake? It was a piece of 'Theatre' (which Blackmore detested, BTW). Last thing on the subject of Volume Requirements; When I was about 20-y-o I went to a performance of L.V.Beet's Violin Concerto at Edinburgh's Usher Hall. For the cadenza / solo there's this guy playing a small (c. 14" long sound-box) acoustic un-amplified instrument in a 2,200 seater hall. We could hear every note with absolute clarity and with a volume which easily filled the space. Just a thought... Pip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searcy Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 I'm a child of the 80's. I thought it was common knowledge that all those walls of amps and cabinets were mostly for show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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