2017 J45 Lifting Pickguard

[DIRESTRATS]

Hi

 

Long time forum lurker and I cannot remember the last time I posted.

 

Purchased only two Gibson acoustics over the last few years...many Martins, Matons as well.

 

First was a Hummingbird PRO from Wildwood. Had it shipped to Australia and upon opening the case, the pickguard was already lifting. Got a new pickguard sent by Wildwood and took the old guard off, applied naptha ,and applied the new guard. All good for about 6 months and then it started lifting again....still like this today. Its the rigid plastic pickguard.

 

Found a 2017 J45 Standard with the Gel pickguard last month. Fantastic Guitar in every way and I thought as the pickguard material has changed to a Gel type pickguard, that maybe Gibson used this material as it tended to curl less than previous more rigid plastic pickguard.

 

Pickguard has been perfect since purchase, however a month after purchase its now starting to lift !

 

 

I am a gear hound and have had almost every Acoustic brand around...never have I experienced this with any other brand. My Martins which are also nitro have never experienced this.

 

The guitar is in a constant 45-55% humidity environment in around 25 degrees C. It has never been taken outside and the pickguard was perfectly attached when purchased.

 

My question is- Why is this problem only particular to Gibson with thicker pickgaurds ? My J160E does not have any problems with the thinner pickguard.

 

-Is it a formulation of the nitro preventing longterm adhesion (gassinig off etc)

-Is it the thickness of the pickguard promoting a curling effect? ..Gibson guards have been historically thick and I know they are more or less bound to this type of design.

-Combination of the above ?

 

This problem is so common and has never really been solved it seems.

 

My reason for the question is I am going to replace the guard with a thinner J45 PVC red tortoise type guard ( like on my J160E), however I would like to understand what is causing this..need to know if the new thinner PVC guard I am going to apply will do the same thing in the future ? I done see the sense in getting a replacement guard from Gibson if the problem lies in the thickness and the type of pickguard material...it will only happen again ?

 

I am also sure many of you have had no problems with the thicker guards..so it may be tough to explain why this happens on a consistent basis.

 

If anyone has an answers or opinions I would love to know.

[Mafy31]

Well you bought it brand new ? I guess since it is a 2017 model.

Then if it bothers you, just give a call to Gibson and they will have it replaced for you. You can send the guitar back to them for it.

Just did this with my hummingbird a while ago and they did a very nice job.

 

What is causing this is that the way it is glued it somewhat "light", to avoid issues like top cracks, so the top has to be kinda free to move on humidity changes. It is very common on Gibsons, though i'm wondering if it happens with thin guards, or if it happens with other nitro brands like Martins too...

[DIRESTRATS]

Thanks for that...I am in Australia so cannot send it back...however I probably can get a replacement from the Australian Dealer, however I don't see the point if its going to happen again.

 

Maybe they are glued to light for the curling potential they have compared to the thinner guards.

 

I would love to buy a SJ200 as my next guitar, but I am hesitant based on this, not to mention that you cannot replace a SJ200 pickguard with a thinner guard to help avoid the problem in the future ( as easily compared to a J45)

[Mafy31]

Thanks for that...I am in Australia so cannot send it back...however I probably can get a replacement from the Australian Dealer, however I don't see the point if its going to happen again.

 

Maybe they are glued to light for the curling potential they have compared to the thinner guards.

 

I would love to buy a SJ200 as my next guitar, but I am hesitant based on this, not to mention that you cannot replace a SJ200 pickguard with a thinner guard to help avoid the problem in the future ( as easily compared to a J45)

 

If you are the original owner (looks like it, 2017 model) Gibson also proposes you usually to send a new pickguard to have it replaced by your local Luthier (they might also suggest authorized repair luthiers in your area).

Just give em a call or send an email.

 

If you feel concerned about thickness, for your next axe you could check vintage models... but i believe their pickguard also curve like the others.

You can also simply buy double tape to repair it yourself, there's some available from Stewmac for example to preserve nitro finish :

http://www.stewmac.com/Materials_and_Supplies/Glues_and_Adhesives/Tapes_and_Adhesives/3M_Double-stick_Tape.html

[fortyearspickn]

I've never had much luck with double sided tape. If the p/g is lifting, it might work (if you put a book on top for a day or so to let it bond).

But if the p/g is curling - i doubt the double sided tape will uncurl it to the point it'll hold it down. I would look into getting a thinner p/g.

Possibly Gibson/Bozeman will send you a replacement that is not a 'flubber guard' but that is one of the thin, transparent, tiger striped p/gs they use on other J45s.

I've not hear of those curling. G'Luck.

[OldCowboy]

Has there EVER been a pickguard that didn't come with a built-in issue? That's partly rhetorical, but if such a thing exists I'd like to know😐

[blindboygrunt]

Baffles me how men stood on the moon , built the pyramids ....

 

Now we Can't get a pickguard to stick

[kidblast]

Baffles me how men stood on the moon , built the pyramids ....

 

Now we Can't get a pickguard to stick

 

 

Stu you must have missed the news.

 

the manned mission to the moon was a hoax, and space aliens built the pyramids

 

it was all on the internet and in the national enquirer, so it has to all be true!!

 

LOL!

[rct]

Baffles me how men stood on the moon , built the pyramids ....

 

Now we Can't get a pickguard to stick

 

All those moon missions did was mess up the weather. They didn't really go anywhere.

 

rct

[sbpark]

I had a 2017 J45 where the "flubber" pickguard lifted almost immediately. I contact Gibson about it, and asked if they could send a replacement, but th enow-flubber guard they sued in the Vintage and True Vintage models, and I'd even pay of rit, but they said they couldn't, and instead sent me another flubber.

[kidblast]

All those moon missions did was mess up the weather. They didn't really go anywhere.

 

rct

 

 

well thank God they left nothing on the moon,, God only knows what some federal clean up program would cost us... say... does the EPA take care of the moon too??

[kidblast]

I had a 2017 J45 where the "flubber" pickguard lifted almost immediately. I contact Gibson about it, and asked if they could send a replacement, but th enow-flubber guard they sued in the Vintage and True Vintage models, and I'd even pay of rit, but they said they couldn't, and instead sent me another flubber.

 

One year in, and my SJ200's PG doesn't seem to be lifting... Could it be a condition where humidity or lack of,, is causing, or attributing it?

 

I do keep the guitar cased when I'm not using it and in the cold weather months, I use humidifiers in the case (really dry in Central Mass in the late fall thru early spring).

[sbpark]

One year in, and my SJ200's PG doesn't seem to be lifting... Could it be a condition where humidity or lack of,, is causing, or attributing it?

 

I do keep the guitar cased when I'm not using it and in the cold weather months, I use humidifiers in the case (really dry in Central Mass in the late fall thru early spring).

 

Your SJ200 pickguard is a different material than what they are using on the 2016-2017 J45 pickguards. They call it the "flubber" guard because it's like a thick, rubbery type thing. I just think the adhesive they used on these guards combined with the material it's made out of is a bad combination that's prone to peel on the edges and didnt seem to adhere properly on many of the,

[DIRESTRATS]

Hi

 

Humidity has always been 45-55% which is generally not a problem for all my guitars. My Martins and Guilds with thin guards on Nitro Lacquer finishes have also never had problems.

 

The guitars are always cased.

 

As suggested previously, it may just be the case of thick guards ( which tend to curl) combined with lower tack adhesive...hence the high failure rate as this problem seems to be pretty common.

 

Went to the store in Sydney yesterday where I purchased it from and they just unboxed a whole new lot of Gibson Acoustics. A Hummingbird standard and two hummingbird pros both had lifting pickguard lifting at the lower sharp point end of the guard..so even the Non Flubber type guards seem to be also having this problem.

 

The J45 Custom with the thinner firestripe guards seemed to be OK.

[Mafy31]

Hi

 

Humidity has always been 45-55% which is generally not a problem for all my guitars. My Martins and Guilds with thin guards on Nitro Lacquer finishes have also never had problems.

 

The guitars are always cased.

 

Same here, in France and i control humidity in my room, almost never get out with the axe, have 2-ways humidifyer from d'Addario in case and in soundhole... always around 50% and still the new guard had lifted.

I believe there is some design issue with this flubber, as it tends to peel; bubbles form between the 2 layers of the pickguard in addition to geting separated from the top on the edges.

 

Went to the store in Sydney yesterday where I purchased it from and they just unboxed a whole new lot of Gibson Acoustics. A Hummingbird standard and two hummingbird pros both had lifting pickguard lifting at the lower sharp point end of the guard..so even the Non Flubber type guards seem to be also having this problem.

 

 

Standard Hummy is flubber.

 

However i have often noticed thin pickguards curling up on second hands gibsons available in local shops.

[Victory Pete]

Hi

 

Long time forum lurker and I cannot remember the last time I posted.

 

Purchased only two Gibson acoustics over the last few years...many Martins, Matons as well.

 

First was a Hummingbird PRO from Wildwood. Had it shipped to Australia and upon opening the case, the pickguard was already lifting. Got a new pickguard sent by Wildwood and took the old guard off, applied naptha ,and applied the new guard. All good for about 6 months and then it started lifting again....still like this today. Its the rigid plastic pickguard.

 

Found a 2017 J45 Standard with the Gel pickguard last month. Fantastic Guitar in every way and I thought as the pickguard material has changed to a Gel type pickguard, that maybe Gibson used this material as it tended to curl less than previous more rigid plastic pickguard.

 

Pickguard has been perfect since purchase, however a month after purchase its now starting to lift !

 

 

I am a gear hound and have had almost every Acoustic brand around...never have I experienced this with any other brand. My Martins which are also nitro have never experienced this.

 

The guitar is in a constant 45-55% humidity environment in around 25 degrees C. It has never been taken outside and the pickguard was perfectly attached when purchased.

 

My question is- Why is this problem only particular to Gibson with thicker pickgaurds ? My J160E does not have any problems with the thinner pickguard.

 

-Is it a formulation of the nitro preventing longterm adhesion (gassinig off etc)

-Is it the thickness of the pickguard promoting a curling effect? ..Gibson guards have been historically thick and I know they are more or less bound to this type of design.

-Combination of the above ?

 

This problem is so common and has never really been solved it seems.

 

My reason for the question is I am going to replace the guard with a thinner J45 PVC red tortoise type guard ( like on my J160E), however I would like to understand what is causing this..need to know if the new thinner PVC guard I am going to apply will do the same thing in the future ? I done see the sense in getting a replacement guard from Gibson if the problem lies in the thickness and the type of pickguard material...it will only happen again ?

 

I am also sure many of you have had no problems with the thicker guards..so it may be tough to explain why this happens on a consistent basis.

 

If anyone has an answers or opinions I would love to know.

 

 

I had similar problems. After many e-mails I was told Gibson uses a secret Nitrocellulose Lacquer made by Sherwin Williams that allows them to buff guitars after only 4 days. Not only does this cause the pickguard problems but the finish in general suffers as they do not seem to do any level sanding and many surface imperfections can be seen close up. Traditional lacquer requires 3 weeks to cure and after level sanding and buffing will give fantastic results as is evident with Martin's finishes.

[DIRESTRATS]

Thanks for that....that makes sense as to maybe why the problem is particular to Gibson.

 

Gassing off of the young Lacquer maybe the then cause then of the lifting on the factory applied pickguard.

 

 

Has anyone had re-lifting after applying a second pickguard.... ( with good quality 3M adhesive) that's also what I am interested in as I don't mind changing/replacing it once...but not repeatedly.

[Victory Pete]

Thanks for that....that makes sense as to maybe why the problem is particular to Gibson.

 

Gassing off of the young Lacquer maybe the then cause then of the lifting on the factory applied pickguard.

 

 

Has anyone had re-lifting after applying a second pickguard.... ( with good quality 3M adhesive) that's also what I am interested in as I don't mind changing/replacing it once...but not repeatedly.

 

Gibson sent me a replacement pickguard and it has not lifted yet. When I pulled up the pickguard their was pitting in the lacquer, clear evidence of some kind of chemical reaction.

[Mafy31]

Thanks for that....that makes sense as to maybe why the problem is particular to Gibson.

 

Gassing off of the young Lacquer maybe the then cause then of the lifting on the factory applied pickguard.

 

 

Has anyone had re-lifting after applying a second pickguard.... ( with good quality 3M adhesive) that's also what I am interested in as I don't mind changing/replacing it once...but not repeatedly.

 

Mine has been replaced by Gibson, no problem since. Will update if it does separate again from the table, hope not :)