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As a response to all the "Gibson Bashing" going on


JuanCarlosVejar

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Just trying to keep the thread on track friend....if you want to derail it, have at it.

If you post on a thread and have that much of an issue with response control, it's your issue. Just be fully clear about your expectations and we'll try to oblige. Your idea of derailing a thread should, of course, set the standard by which we strive to abide.

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I am...or more to the point Truss rods IN the guitars...I'm not sure if you are or not...lol

We must all strive, above all else, to make sure that you are sure. We live to serve and exist only to be further instructed.

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I mean you actually get a free keychain and a set of Gibson branded strings when you buy one brand new. What else do you want? Am I missing something here?

 

Didn't even get those with my SJ. Or the 'This Machine Kills Fascists' card which came with the early Woody Guthrie models. :-({|=

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I don't mind being a walking Gibson billboard from time to time. I tend to wear this jacket to concerts:

 

jacket.jpg

 

And I love my six Gibsons (and my Martins. and the others).

That is a fine looking jacket, Nick! Love my guitars, too. Repairs, scars, blemishes, quirks, and the occasional relatively pristine example - all are very special, each in its own endearing way!

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That is a fine looking jacket, Nick! Love my guitars, too. Repairs, scars, blemishes, quirks, and the occasional relatively pristine example - all are very special, each in its own endearing way!

 

It's a nice jacket. I bought it a few years ago on fleabay from a country singer named Billy Yates out in California for about $75. The front isn't as impressive as the back, but it has a nice logo. Looks pretty good when you're between two great chick musicians...

 

dsc_0455heart_zps86144611.jpg

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I really don't recall much of anything lately that I'd call "Gibson bashing." A spot of glue, being pissed at customer service isn't really bashing someone/something. When I think of "Gibson bashing" I kind of always drift back to Ed Roman (I think that was his name) who owned a guitar store in Las Vegas (again....I think). He was a Gibson basher. Nothing I've read on this forum is even on the same planet. He was reknowned for his "Gibson bashing." And, I don't know if there was ever a Taylor he didn't like...lol..His store website was little more than an all-out assault on Gibsons.............I like Gibsons, like some Martins, and very few Taylors (nothing to do with quality....just not a good fit for me). All three make great instruments. Not perfect instruments. Great instruments. There are people who will complain when they get into Heaven. The streets of gold are too shiny. The angels are too smart. God is too powerful....Just play your guitars.

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I mean you actually get a free keychain and a set of Gibson branded strings when you buy one brand new. What else do you want? Am I missing something here? I've only purchased one new Martin in the last couple years and I didnt' even get that. Just some dumb "Care and Feeding of Your New Guitar" pamphlet and the endpin in a paper envelope. Never bought a Tayor, but maybe they give away a bunch a free crap with their guitars? Maybe look into those, but to be honest, aside from a Fender 52AVRI that came with a crappy cable, cheap strap, ashtray cover, 6-saddle bridge (in addition to the vintage style 3-saddle bridge that came on the guitar), parts to bring it to modern wiring specs (comes wired with vintage specs), and some stickers, I really don't know of any guitar company that comes with a gift certificate for free crap that most people wouldn't care about.

 

 

Lets not conflate the issues, I said I thought they should give you a gift certificate for a shirt or whatever you want that is just my thoughts, I like what they give you with a new guitar I did not complain about that. I was saying they do not offer much to buy in their souvenier or collectable lines and that I think they would sell more if they offered more. The other company's seem to do well in what they offer or they would not do it to the extent they do. I have a problem with the internet customer service, I recently purchased the Hummingbird and got nothing but the warranty so I sent them an email asking if they had discontinued the practice of giving the case candy with a new purchase. No response at all not even a kiss my *** type thing, that is just poor service. I had sent an email to them a few months back about picks and they sent the first response back with answer that did not answer my question the second email came back still not asnwering it. They were not reading the whole email so the third time I sent it I said please read the entire email, that time they did and answered my question again poor service. Again I am not trying to put them down because I love the guitars I am just saying they may be able to improve in some areas, but I am getting responses like I am crazy, it is just my opinion but I doubt I am the only person who feels like that. I have bought Taylors, Martins and Fenders and Gibsons so I am comparing by what I know and see on line. But when I have a question about a purchase of a hummingbird and get zero response??? Not Good no matter how trivial.

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Lets not conflate the issues, I said I thought they should give you a gift certificate for a shirt or whatever you want that is just my thoughts, I like what they give you with a new guitar I did not complain about that. I was saying they do not offer much to buy in their souvenier or collectable lines and that I think they would sell more if they offered more. The other company's seem to do well in what they offer or they would not do it to the extent they do. I have a problem with the internet customer service, I recently purchased the Hummingbird and got nothing but the warranty so I sent them an email asking if they had discontinued the practice of giving the case candy with a new purchase. No response at all not even a kiss my *** type thing, that is just poor service. I had sent an email to them a few months back about picks and they sent the first response back with answer that did not answer my question the second email came back still not asnwering it. They were not reading the whole email so the third time I sent it I said please read the entire email, that time they did and answered my question again poor service. Again I am not trying to put them down because I love the guitars I am just saying they may be able to improve in some areas, but I am getting responses like I am crazy, it is just my opinion but I doubt I am the only person who feels like that. I have bought Taylors, Martins and Fenders and Gibsons so I am comparing by what I know and see on line. But when I have a question about a purchase of a hummingbird and get zero response??? Not Good no matter how trivial.

 

Bummer. As mentioned previously int his thread, I had quite the opposite experience with their customer service. They responded and took care of my issue with both guitars and I had replacement parts sent free of charge on two separate occasions. I guess I'd be a bit turned off to the brand as well if they had not responded to my issues, or responded without reading my entire email. I had a similar experience where I had two separate packages of John Pearse strings covered in what looked like rust or black mold and went dead rather quickly. I sent them an email with pictures explaining the issue, and never got a reply. Problem solved and I just don't buy their products anymore. I'll stick with D'Addario strings.

 

I had a Martin 000-15M that I bought brand new about three years ago now. About a month or two ago I pulled it out of it's case (I don't play it often, maybe picking it up every moth or so) and it felt off. Action was sky high. relief was fine but there really want much more room left on the saddle to lower the action. Guitar was always kept cased, outside relative humidity always between 45%-55%, no extreme temps, etc. Took some measurements and I'll be damned, it met criteria for a neck reset! I got a hold of the local luthier who is the authorized Martin warranty repair guy. He looked at my guitar and agreed it needed a reset, but Martin refused to authorize it. Instead they said they would authorize a smaller bridge to be installed. Apparently Martin has been getting an increased number of claims for relatively new guitars (only a few years old) that needed resets and it was costing them a lot of money. They have since changed their warranty and they no longer will warranty neck resets (something they aren't telling people about, I wonder why?!) I guess they use a few different size bridges on the assembly line, and based on neck angle, etc. they choose the height of bridge to use. Apparently mine had the tallest bridge that they used, so it could be replaced with a smaller bridge that was still within Martin factory spec, would allow for the saddle to be lowered to my personal spec, and still have room to spare for future adjustments. The luthier apparently has had more than one unhappy Martin customer come to him and got this news as well, so he actually had me listen on speaker phone to his conversation with the Martin warranty department declining the claim for a neck reset and authorizing the new bridge. At first I was furious, and kind of still am. Long story short, I got the guitar back about two weeks ago. He actually shaved down the existing bridge to the spec of what the replacement bridge would have been, justifying it by saying there was no need to break the glue joint to put on a new bridge. He did an amazing job and there's no way you'd even know. The guy is a professional, as as mentioned, he's not just a tech, but a luthier who makes acoustic guitars and bouzoukis.

 

So what's my point? Well, since Martin has changed their warranty since I purchased the guitar because they were getting a flood of people bringing their guitars back for the same reason, and basically was because of a manufacturing error and nothing the customers did to cause it, and they wouldn't grandfather in anyone who bought their guitars before they instituted this change, I basically won't ever buy another Martin guitar. But they do make plenty of t-shirts, hoodies and other crap you can wear or drink out of, or whatever. I'd rather have a company that actually spends more time standing behind their products instead of producing apparel when they're a guitar company. Until Gibson proves me wrong or does me dirty, I'll stick with them.

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KC, Yes, in fact you did complain about what Gibson does give you. Because you said it was not enough. Additionally, some here have reported the case candy is lost or 'mis-appropriated' at the dealers.

Have you ever been to a Harley-Davidson dealer? More than half their showroom floor is dedicated to apparel, key chains, shot glasses, biker chips, etc.

Its all pricey, but then, so are their bikes.

You realize, of course, that if Gibson were to include a $40 gift certificate in each case, they'd have to up the price of the guitar.

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I may have a layered rosewood fretboard on my 2012 Les Paul 12 String. It bugs me a bit, but it is what it is and that was a very limited run anyway, I am glad to have it.

 

Very Commendable. Some here would be (have been) spewing vitriol. Layered bridges caused a run on pitchforks and torches.

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Very Commendable. Some here would be (have been) spewing vitriol. Layered bridges caused a run on pitchforks and torches.

 

My 2012 AJ's bridge is 3-pieces. No biggie to me. Guitar sounds ridiculously amazing. I've ditched several J45's because of it, including on of those new J45 Vintage models with the baked tops. Sounded like crap compared to the AJ, 3-piece bridge and all.

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My 2012 AJ's bridge is 3-pieces. No biggie to me. Guitar sounds ridiculously amazing. I've ditched several J45's because of it, including on of those new J45 Vintage models with the baked tops. Sounded like crap compared to the AJ, 3-piece bridge and all.

Sorry I was unclear. Actually they were laminated bridges - not layered. Due to a temporary shortage of rosewood. There never was consensus here on whether the change to the specs improved or detracted from the tone. Some viewed the temporary change a quirkiness that was just a part of the Gibson mystique. Others felt otherwise.

Maybe there's something quirky about your AJ that makes it one in a million, and looking for a J45 with the same quirk - may be too tough a row to hoe.

 

 

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KC, Yes, in fact you did complain about what Gibson does give you. Because you said it was not enough. Additionally, some here have reported the case candy is lost or 'mis-appropriated' at the dealers.

Have you ever been to a Harley-Davidson dealer? More than half their showroom floor is dedicated to apparel, key chains, shot glasses, biker chips, etc.

Its all pricey, but then, so are their bikes.

You realize, of course, that if Gibson were to include a $40 gift certificate in each case, they'd have to up the price of the guitar.

 

 

I think what I said or meant to say is that I would prefer to have a gift card, I like what they give you now but I really think for the money you spend on a really good guitar you should get more and that holds true with all the major company's not just Gibson. I also think it would be a way for them to help promote themselves. When you are spending two to three thousand dollars I don't care if it costs 40.00 more, but you know what they are gonna up the price when they feel the need for any reason. As far as the lost case candy I realized that I was going to have to take it up with the dealer and I did and got the strings, I could care less about the keychain, I already have three others but I felt I needed to ask Gibson about it to see if they had stopped doing that before I went back to the dealer although it may surprise you I am at least that smart. :rolleyes:

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I was at the namm show this year... At the martin booth as I was looking at the authentic series an older gentleman approaches me with the new 1919 000 30 in hand and aks "does this sound like a guitar you would pay over 10k for?" He then proceeds to strum and I answer "no".

 

He replies "Yeah me either" .While I was there I saw Laurence Juber,George Gruhn and countless other people.Martin is a company that only lives on it's name.The rosewood on their aunthentic models is almost alway underwhelming to look at and does not sound as great as they want you to believe.

 

Diana Ponzio a lady that works at martin was constantly getting pissed at people bumping into her while she was trying to do videos which should not happen.They should be mindful of the people that are there to have a go at the guitars.

 

Chris Martin and Fred Green are nice guys.But though I was at the booth for maybe 2 hours no one approached me to discuss the products or anything.And I have ordered one of their new limited edition ukues ...

 

I checked inside some some their guitars and you could see a drop or two in some of the guitars.

 

 

I went to see Don and the Montana display and I spent a great deal of time talking to him when ever a dealer would need to talk to him he would very politely "Hey J, Can you please excuse me for a few minutes" .Then out of nowhere another gibson staff member approached me (he saw I was a lefty) And he told me he is great friends with Jim Duncan (owner of Southpaw Guitars a lefty only store) and he oversaw everything that went to Jim .He told me a story about how he used to be Elliot Eastons guitar tech.And after the chat he hooked up a lefty goldtop les paul classic and a lefty les paul high performance in Ocean burst (Green) for me to try out and took pictures.

 

 

I played those guitars for a while looked for flaws in the build and could find none.As far as the acoustics I only saw a few extra drops of glue but nothing looked strange or out of place.

 

 

Don was a gent .I asked him about the possibility of getting 2 guitars done in lefty that was on the first day I was there .When Don saw me the next day he told me I got good news the guitar you want the most of the two you mentioned can be done in lefty.I gave him a big hug and said he could expect me to order in the coming months through my dealer of choice.Don was a one man show who talked to me about the products,About how the new HP line came about and about so many other things that I just left feeling much better

 

 

After I went and played the new Masterbilt Century line from Epiphone and Will Jones (Dr.Epiphone) approached me and said "You know I see you are having so much fun playing the new masterbilt line,I just want to let you know those are easily convertible to lefty and even the pickguards can be reversed"

 

I thanked him and told him the company had made a fantastic product

 

 

I would rather buy my guitars from people who care about me as a consumer and engage me than buy a guitar from a bunch of cold heartless people who try to live off their name and stare you off if you bump into their video ...

 

 

Mind you Martin had one lefty to try out which sounded very nice.

Don apologized for not having any lefty bozeman gems but I could care less ...We had a great chat and he knows I will be placing an order for one guitar this year

 

 

 

JC

 

 

I dont think Gibson cares about you or me or anyone else.. just like Martin.. They all build guitars to sell... all you have to do is Buy.. .. if you dont like the products , dont buy them.. so to me I dont care if Martin is Nice or Gibson is nice.. I pay my money for a quality product.. if they cannot meet that standard.. there are many other Highend Luthiers out there that can..

 

 

and case candy is just novelty.. crap that takes up space..

 

..

 

if you feel were bashing Gibson.. I think your wrong.. Most of what I ve read here have been concerns about product failures.. or lack of QC . some of its just stupid.. two drops of glue showing.. or fine swirls.. you should of looked prior to buying.. . thats what happens when production is ramped up to high speed.. people miss things. just like in any other manufacture..

 

for me its seeing guitars steadily climb in price.. and nothing improved..

 

btw.. I went through my phase of Gibsons in the early 90s.. from 1989 to about 1998.. 300 plus New Gibson Acoustics.. a quarter of those ,Brazilians.. I wont disclose what I have now.. But its enough.. Not including the vintage stuff.

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If you post on a thread and have that much of an issue with response control, it's your issue. Just be fully clear about your expectations and we'll try to oblige. Your idea of derailing a thread should, of course, set the standard by which we strive to abide.

I'll give you an E for effort, I really had not expected this site to have a troll problem.....you've cleared that misconception up quite nicely. If you find my comments lacking your approved standards don't read em.
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I'll give you an E for effort, I really had not expected this site to have a troll problem.....you've cleared that misconception up quite nicely. If you find my comments lacking your approved standards don't read em.

 

 

Allie, you've touched on a pet peeve of mine here. (This is #1 followed closely by 'trashing accountants).

Yesterday jvi wrote the same thing. Please help me understand how I can not read your thread if I don't like it.

Your logic is like Catch22 meets Back To The Future !

How can I know whether I will like your comment until I actually first READ IT ? Then, once I've read it - how do I follow your advice "...DON'Tread it" ?

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I have just read all four pages of this ridiculous thread and must respond. I recently bought a NEW, but shopworn , J-35. It didn't come with case candy, a $40 gift certificate, a pickguard, or even a case. I didn't buy it for all that crap. I bought it because it plays and sounds GREAT. I can easily find a case, a guard if I need one, but I certainly won't be whining because I didn't get my keychain or sticker. Are you really after swag or the guitar?

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Cool Story!

 

We have four Gibsons in the house but I have absolutely no brand loyalty. Too many guitars to love out there.

 

My impression though is most of the Gibson "bashing" centers not around sound or feel but around quality control or a perceived lack thereof. As I do not deal with new guitars I lack any first hand experience so do not have a clue if the criticism is warranted or not. I would expect though that the guitars at NAMM would all be cherry picked as the company wants to put its best face forward. So flaws you will not find.

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I'll give you an E for effort, I really had not expected this site to have a troll problem.....you've cleared that misconception up quite nicely. If you find my comments lacking your approved standards don't read em.

Wasn't aware that my standards were an issue. Seems you've inverted the concern - I'm not the person amending response expectations to my posts. The troll problem would be lots worse if we didn't deal with them case by case.

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Allie, you've touched on a pet peeve of mine here. (This is #1 followed closely by 'trashing accountants).

Yesterday jvi wrote the same thing. Please help me understand how I can not read your thread if I don't like it.

Your logic is like Catch22 meets Back To The Future !

How can I know whether I will like your comment until I actually first READ IT ? Then, once I've read it - how do I follow your advice "...DON'Tread it" ?

The boy's just confused. Control issues do that to people. We may have the occasional discord about accountants, but we've yet to lapse into incoherence😂

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