Tough room for the great strummer Hummingbird in quilt when Mr 200 shows up

[62burst]

As my search for a HB Quilt with a more sedate 'burst continues into month 7, I'm still trying to get my head around how red most Hummingbird Quilts are. This Fly Music comparo shows the guitar in more natural light, but it also shows the distinction between two great strummers. Not terribly noticeable in the picking parts, but in the chords, the SJ-200 gives a most grand sound. An almost spooky overtone is captured by the '200 @ t = 2:52; when playing a bit that sounds ironically like the theme from The Exorcist, Tubular Bells (comparo playing starts @ 1:58):

 

[kelly campbell]

i would take either one...that is two really nice guitars. Thanks for posting the comparison and keep us posted on your search.

[livemusic]

The SJ200 sounds fab!

[MorrisrownSal]

What an outstanding comparison! Have to say, the SJ sounds more tight or focused. And that Bird has some throat gargle in it. I dig. Nod to bird.

[scriv58]

I prefer the hummungbird in the clip

[E-minor7]

2 more than nice ones.

I would have a hard time choosing, , , if it wasn't for the visual aesthetics. The quilt is far too pang-coloured and almost looks like a toy.

If the model continues, it must be a matter of time before they dampen it down - I mean, a short scaled maple dread is a serious idea.

Why work against that.

 

The 200 for some reason actually sounds rather bad at 2:52. Apart from that it's a grand and gorgeous organ to approach.

I have a lot of respect and admiration for the Super Jumbos, but it is as if their sonic identity is a bit vague for me.

I hear and recognize them - but to these ears they somehow don't come across as significantly as the co-legends.

A bit as if their majestic design can't quite be matched by their voice.

Would be sad to live in a world without them though, , , they more or less are the kings, , , or should we say queens of acoustic guitars

(not so familiar with gender & guitars here) - and perhaps have that certain vulnerable bi-thing generally connected with royalty.

[62burst]

Definite agreement here about the toy-like look of the ultra cherry red HB Quilt, and how Gibson could make it easier to warm up to with a more traditional burst, or maybe approximate how the faded Iced Tea bursts from the ’60’s now look- I’d probably have one already.

 

The audio anomaly at 2:52- not sure if this was heard in the room when recorded, or was added by some interaction with the recording equipment, but it’s reminiscent of the strange effect we were discussing on the forum some time back, first thinking it to be a wolf tone.

 

Interesting how you mention not easily seeing their sonic identity- the super jumbos have never been affordable, so not likely to be the instruments favored by singer-songwriters/folk players. . . when one comes out of the case, it’s a special occasion (hopefully- it would be strange to have this as the day-in, day-out guitar).

[E-minor7]

Interesting how you mention not easily seeing their sonic identity-

It's just me and a limitation I have there - the sound of a 200 isn't called forward in my imagination as easily as fx a Bird, a Dove or a 45.

I used to be in burning love with the Jumbo as a teenager. So much that I bought a yellow-burst Ibanez copy while still living with my parents.

It was strong stuff to get it home and it dominated my room. Remember the sales-guy drove me in his private car so it must have been just after closing time.

The guitar sounded rather good (loud was important then), but didn't have much Gibson-flavor. Well not even Gibsons had at the time. .

Later sold it to the guitar-ace of our clique and 15 years on it went up in smoke. He too went much too soon, heaven bless his soul. .

 

Definite agreement here about the toy-like look of the ultra cherry red HB Quilt, and how Gibson could make it easier to warm up to with a more traditional burst, or maybe approximate how the faded Iced Tea bursts from the '60's now look- I'd probably have one already.

For me there are 3 factors which must be kept in balance.

The player - the instrument and the music.

Martins have that withdrawn look, which is so cool.

There is tremendous power in the mix between the purist look and the quality'n'versatility of these acoustics.

Gibsons are more flamboyant and after many years behind the D-35, it's simply good fun and entertainment to swing G's.

For looks - for feel and of course for sound. .

But the new short quilts take things one maybe 2 hues too far. It's like trying to handle a piece of the sun. So a cup of ice-tea would be great.

 

Could be my limitation again.

[OldCowboy]

2 more than nice ones.

I would have a hard time choosing, , , if it wasn't for the visual aesthetics. The quilt is far too pang-coloured and almost looks like a toy.

If the model continues, it must be a matter of time before they dampen it down - I mean, a short scaled maple dread is a serious idea.

Why work against that.

 

The 200 for some reason actually sounds rather bad at 2:52. Apart from that it's a grand and gorgeous organ to approach.

I have have a lot of respect and admiration for the Super Jumbos, but it is as if their sonic identity is a bit vague for me.

I hear and recognize them - but to these ears they somehow don't come across as significantly as the co-legends.

A bit as if their majestic design can't quite be matched by their voice.

Would be sad to live in a world without them though, , , they more or less are the kings, , , or should we say queens of acoustic guitars

(not so familiar with gender a guitars here) - and perhaps have that certain vulnerable bi-thing generally connected with royalty.

I stand firm in my conviction that all acoustic guitars are inherently female!

[E-minor7]

I stand firm in my conviction that all acoustic guitars are inherently female!

If you feel it, that's what you feel ^ Feel free

 

 

 

[Murph]

My 1933 Gibson A-00 (mandolin) has a "ghostly" overtone from time to time.

 

It was once owned by Scotty Stoneman, and I always attributed it to him.

 

That recording is fascinating, and I must say I prefer the look AND sound of the Jumbo, however I prefer a short scale and tone is somewhat adjustable with attack. and I tend to attack pretty hard.

 

The Bird looks so red I couldn't buy it.

 

But I still want one.

 

Just not red.

 

Thanks for that !

[OldCowboy]

If you feel it, that's what you feel ^ Feel free

😁😂😅👍

[EuroAussie]

Im quite familiar with that clip as i studied it intently while i was searchd from a European version of the HB Quilt.

 

They both sounded really good in the clip, the J-200 was more grand, almost piano sounding when picked indfividually, the Bird was warmer, mellower but with more clarity than a standard HB.

 

When I played the quilt in Australia I actually did not mind the bright red, it didnt come across so full as on the video.

 

This is an impossible guitar to find anywhere, and frankly in the end Im glad I found the Dove as it filled that need for a maple dread. I sort of retired the HB TV from gigging, and now i just play it at home with non coated strings and it puts a smile on my face.

 

But if I had to choose between those two, Id probsbly go for the J-200, just offers a bit more variety and punch then the quilt HB.

[fortyearspickn]

Another "Ginger or MaryAnn" conundrum!

First swore I wouldn't listen. Then, swore I wouldn't try to sort the pepper from the fly specks. Finally, swore I wouldn't comment....

Theses models are certainly different in tone. But I didn't think I'd have a favorite sound: knowing they're both 'different' doesn't translate to me to mean one is 'better' .

When I saw the setup - the background of the store - I didn't expect a decent comparison. But I was pleasantly surprised and thought it was very well managed: Volume kept consistent - demonstrator didn't show off and shred riffs until our ears bled. Finally, with all those pre-convictions destroyed - I was surprised to hear a difference that translated to a preference! To my ears, at 3.:40 the H'Bird takes it all.

As far as the visual ... obviously, it's purely a matter of taste.

Conventional Wisdom - the J45 with its burst, and the natural Martin are the most recognized colorations. Safe bets. But many here love the H'Bird unique range or reds it is known for - from Cherry to Tobacco to Honey.

Some here, I'm guessing, have Fenders that are turquoise. I saw one on a website yesterday that was pink, and another that was pumpkin/melon. So I have no problem with a cherry stain. I think 20 years from now - it will look better - aged and faded, and be more 'desirable' than the SJ200's standard coloration.

So - I pick MaryAnn.

[zombywoof]

I have never cared for any cherry burst. But the brown bursts just look wrong on an HB. So I have always preferred the natural top HBs.

[Jinder]

when one comes out of the case, it’s a special occasion (hopefully- it would be strange to have this as the day-in, day-out guitar).

 

I tend to reach for my SJ200 first, then my Hummingbird and Dove, for general writing/recording/gigging duty. It seems decadent to take the SJ200 all over the place but it’s just such a great all rounder and beautiful piece ☺️

[62burst]

Im quite familiar with that clip as i studied it intently while i was searchd from a European version of the HB Quilt.

 

They both sounded really good in the clip, the J-200 was more grand, almost piano sounding when picked indfividually, the Bird was warmer, mellower but with more clarity than a standard HB.

 

I sort of retired the HB TV from gigging, and now i just play it at home with non coated strings and it puts a smile on my face.

The scale length of the super jumbo, and the body shape and size must play a considerable role in that grand sound. And yes, the 'Bird in mahogany is just a comfortable place to be. Good to see you checking in from time to time- guess all the maple & 'Bird talk flushed you out.

[62burst]

Another "Ginger or MaryAnn" conundrum!

. . . knowing they're both 'different' doesn't translate to me to mean one is 'better' .

When I saw the setup - the background of the store - I didn't expect a decent comparison. But I was pleasantly surprised and thought it was very well managed: Volume kept consistent - demonstrator didn't show off and shred riffs until our ears bled. Finally, with all those pre-convictions destroyed - I was surprised to hear a difference that translated to a preference! To my ears, at 3.:40 the H'Bird takes it all.

Fly Music has other well produced, and beautifully shot & edited tests; the short clips seem to work better for sound memory. One thing- the differences may be more apparent if the strings weren't so new, where the sound of the fresh strings is a dominant part of the sound (esp on the 'bird).

 

Some here, I'm guessing, have Fenders that are turquoise. I saw one on a website yesterday that was pink, and another that was pumpkin/melon. So I have no problem with a cherry stain. I think 20 years from now - it will look better - aged and faded, and be more 'desirable' than the SJ200's standard coloration.

So - I pick MaryAnn.

For some reason, the wild colors always seem to work better on solid body electrics, especially Fenders, when cars and guitars were more closely tied to cruisin' and surf music. And on a 1958 Les Paul.

[62burst]

I have never cared for any cherry burst. But the brown bursts just look wrong on an HB. So I have always preferred the natural top HBs.

A natural top maple would be a fine thing to come across. Remember when Gibson was accepting custom orders? Surely, a burst such as this quilt at Dave's Guitars would be most acceptable- without the bling-laden shell collection, and the $5k + price tag:

 

 

[62burst]

I tend to reach for my SJ200 first, then my Hummingbird and Dove, for general writing/recording/gigging duty. It seems decadent to take the SJ200 all over the place but it’s just such a great all rounder and beautiful piece ☺️

SJ-200 first? Do you eat the cherry on top of the ice cream sundae first, too? ; ).

You make a good point- if you have a beauty such as that, don't hide it away. . . but switch gears (guitars) often!

 

also- what was the guitar you were playing when you'd shared that vid of a new almost-released tune at a small setting?

[Jinder]

SJ-200 first? Do you eat the cherry on top of the ice cream sundae first, too? ; ).

You make a good point- if you have a beauty such as that, don't hide it away. . . but switch gears (guitars) often!

 

also- what was the guitar you were playing when you'd shared that vid of a new almost-released tune at a small setting?

 

Ah the house gig video! That was my SJ200, it’s unusually pale in that video due to the lighting, in reality it’s darkening all the time and looks like honey with a dash of milk added. The flame on the back and sides is sensational, it makes me want to go swimming in it!

[zombywoof]

I am not much for abalone fired bling either.

 

Of the four Gibsons in the house, the one I turn to the least is the J-200. Has nothing to do with the guitar not sounding good. But it does not work well with how I approach a guitar. I am not a strummer. I play only with my fingers and tend to pinch strings. I think I am happier with a guitar that is a little less well balanced.

 

I have had Hummingbirds in the house for a test drive. But they were all 1960s guitars and were rejected for, if nothing else, the skinny neck carve. I have not gotten my hands on enough Bozeman-made versions to really get to know them. My education is definitely lacking.

[livemusic]

What does 'quilt' mean?

[EuroAussie]

The scale length of the super jumbo, and the body shape and size must play a considerable role in that grand sound. And yes, the 'Bird in mahogany is just a comfortable place to be. Good to see you checking in from time to time- guess all the maple & 'Bird talk flushed you out.

 

The SJ-200's are real hit n' miss, much like Hummingbirds.

At their best they have a grand, full tone, but many are also quiet as a mouse and lacking projection. When I was at Rudy's I played a brazilian rosewood SJ-200, Ren Fergson designed, and it was dead as a a door nail. Quiet as a mouse, little projection. I also played a rosewood SJ-200 custom back here in Prague few year ago, which was thunderous, off the chart.

 

I think Ive only played one modern Hummingbird which was not a TV / Vintage that I would want to own, most were disappointing.

[scriv58]

What does 'quilt' mean?

 

From the Collings site:

 

Understanding Figure: Curl, Flame and Quilt

Figured wood is a beautiful sight to behold, and you don’t

have to be a guitar enthusiast to appreciate its striking, three-

dimensional visual effect. At Taylor, we showcase it most

prominently on our maple 600 Series and Koa Series guitars,

but it occasionally occurs in other woods, such as the curly

mahogany used on our 500 Series LTDs. While “figure” is the

broader descriptive term, we often qualify figured woods through

more specific types of visual patterns, referring to it as flamed,

curly and quilted. Here are some distinctions:

“Curly” and “flamed” are essentially the same. Curl or flame

appears like an unbroken band; other terms used to describe

it are “fiddleback” and “tiger-striped.” The effect is the result of

a tree’s fibers growing in more of a back-and-forth, zig-zag way

instead of growing straight.

When a straight board is cut from such a tree, the wood

fibers are essentially severed across the grain. This highlights

the undulation visually due to the way the light reflects off the

different directions of the grain, creating an iridescent effect.

Sonically you won’t hear much difference, although one could

make the argument that it will be a little looser and therefore a

little warmer because it’s a slightly less stiff piece of wood. But

really, the difference is negligible.

“Quilt” is essentially considered the same occurrence as

curl, but it tends to look less like a rolling, linear wave, as Andy

Powers explains.

“The growth is more irregular, appearing like undulating,

boiling, rolling liquid, and there are more limitations in terms of

where and how it appears,” he says.

“That’s partly because it is

only visible in a flatsawn cut; when a quilt-figured piece of wood

is quartersawn, the figure appears as wide bands of flame.

Also,

it is often more present in slightly less dense specimens of a

particular species.

These last two characteristics usually mean

that a quilted piece of wood has the potential to sound slightly

warmer and low-frequency-biased than a non-quilted piece of the same wood.