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J-45 True Vintage Top Bracing

#1 User is offline   mking 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 08:04 AM

Can anyone confirm whether or not my 2007,J-45TV has the Advanced Jumbo bracing on the top? Thank you.
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#2 User is offline   ThemisSal 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 09:08 AM

I suppose a definitive answer from the experts here (not me), you might need some mirror shots of your bracing.

I can tell you I had a 2007 J45 TV with a sitka top (not adi). It was one of the first TVs... and it did have advanced bracing.
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#3 User is offline   mking 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 09:24 AM

View PostThemisSal, on 31 December 2017 - 09:08 AM, said:

I suppose a definitive answer from the experts here (not me), you might need some mirror shots of your bracing.

I can tell you I had a 2007 J45 TV with a sitka top (not adi). It was one of the first TVs... and it did have advanced bracing.


You had the the same guitar I now have. Mine is a 2007 and Gibson told me it has a Sitka top. They said that 2007 was the last year for Sitka and then they went to Adirondack.
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#4 User is offline   zombywoof 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 10:28 AM

It is my understanding that the J45 TV shares the same top bracing as the AJ. This is essentially Ren Ferguson's modern take on the scalloped bracing that was used in the original AJs. Other guitars such as the J-35 historically had a slim taper non-scalloped bracing. Gibson did not start using scalloped top bracing in all its guitars until around 1942.
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#5 User is offline   tpbiii 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 10:55 AM

The primary functional difference between the original AJs and J-45s was not the scalloping but the angle of the x-braces. The AJs crossed at a larger angle -- 105 degrees.

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#6 User is offline   Red 333 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 01:16 PM

The J-45 True Vintage has the same top bracing as the modern Advanced Jumbo. The back bracing, however, is taller and thinner, while the AJ's is low and wide.

Red 333
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#7 User is offline   mking 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 03:11 PM

Thanks for all the info. I imagine the J-45 Standard does not have the AJ bracing?
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#8 User is offline   Red 333 

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 03:47 PM

Correct.
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#9 User is offline   gotomsdos 

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Posted 02 January 2018 - 07:42 AM

Besides scalloped, I read from somewhere, if I remember right, that AJ seems to have forward shifted bracing whereas J-45 TV does not. Correct me if I have a wrong memory.
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#10 User is offline   mking 

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Posted 02 January 2018 - 09:58 AM

View Postgotomsdos, on 02 January 2018 - 07:42 AM, said:

Besides scalloped, I read from somewhere, if I remember right, that AJ seems to have forward shifted bracing whereas J-45 TV does not. Correct me if I have a wrong memory.



I have no idea regarding the forward shifted braces on the TV. Hopefully someone will know.
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#11 User is offline   bassetman 

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 03:08 PM

View PostRed 333, on 31 December 2017 - 01:16 PM, said:

The J-45 True Vintage has the same top bracing as the modern Advanced Jumbo. The back bracing, however, is taller and thinner, while the AJ's is low and wide.

Red 333

I was checking today ...the bracing on the back of the AJ is lower and wider with rounded tops. All the others have tall thin pointed tops to the back braces. Interesting.
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#12 User is offline   Red 333 

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 11:53 PM

This was a characteristic of Gibson back bracing in the mid thirties. Beside on the AJ, you'll see this low, wide bracing on some J-35s (but not all of them!), Ray Whitley Recording Kings (they were built by Gibson and are similar to the J-35), and I think the J-55 (though I will have to refer back to pictures of I've taken of the J-55s I've seen to be sure).

Red 333

This post has been edited by Red 333: 03 January 2018 - 11:55 PM

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#13 User is offline   ajay 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 08:50 AM

View PostRed 333, on 03 January 2018 - 11:53 PM, said:

This was a characteristic of Gibson back bracing in the mid thirties. Beside on the AJ, you'll see this low, wide bracing on some J-35s (but not all of them!), Ray Whitley Recording Kings (they were built by Gibson and are similar to the J-35), and I think the J-55 (though I will have to refer back to pictures of I've taken of the J-55s I've seen to be sure).

Red 333


The new J35's have 1930's Advanced Bracing. Almost any web search will prove this to be true.Attached File  image.jpeg (36.93K)
Number of downloads: 3
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#14 User is offline   zombywoof 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 09:08 AM

View PostRed 333, on 03 January 2018 - 11:53 PM, said:

This was a characteristic of Gibson back bracing in the mid thirties. Beside on the AJ, you'll see this low, wide bracing on some J-35s (but not all of them!), Ray Whitley Recording Kings (they were built by Gibson and are similar to the J-35), and I think the J-55 (though I will have to refer back to pictures of I've taken of the J-55s I've seen to be sure).

Red 333


With Gibson, of course, it often came down to different hands holding the tools. A friend of mine owns a late 1930s Gibson-made Recording King. He always described it as a J-55 without the stairstep headstock. When he brought in for restoration the guy doing the work stated he had never seen any guitar with as wide an angled X brace. He measured it and said it was around 108 degrees.

My 1942 J-50 has knife edge sharp back bracing and as best as I can describe it a triangular cross section tapered X brace.
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#15 User is offline   Red 333 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 10:28 AM

View Postajay, on 04 January 2018 - 08:50 AM, said:

The new J35's have 1930's Advanced Bracing. Almost any web search will prove this to be true.Attachment image.jpeg


I never said otherwise. I was talking about guitars from the thirties, above, not new ones. More importantly, I was describing the back bracing, not top bracing.

Current J-35s have Advanced top bracing and the J-45 Standard's back bracing, which is medium density. The Fuller's 1939 J-35 Reissue, on the other hand, has the Advanced top bracing and the Advanced Jumbo's low and wide, denser back bracing.

Red 333

This post has been edited by Red 333: 04 January 2018 - 12:04 PM

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#16 User is offline   Red 333 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 11:15 AM

Here are a couple pictures I took recently of the back braces in various 1930's/40's vintage Gibsons, so you can see the difference between the low, wide, dense braces versus the tall, thin, knife's blades.

This is the low style, as seen on a 1939 J-35:
https://imgur.com/a/rEp46

Posted Image

This is the brace seen through the soundhole directly. The ones below it are two to three times as thick.


You can see its orientation to the soundhole better in this picture (though this is a 1936 Original Jumbo):
https://imgur.com/a/jZ0Gm

Posted Image

Red 333

This post has been edited by Red 333: 04 January 2018 - 12:18 PM

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#17 User is offline   Red 333 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 11:16 AM

This is the knife's blade style, as found in a 1941 J-35:
https://imgur.com/a/82jQX

Posted Image



For kicks, zombywoof, here is the low style in a 1939 Recording King:
https://imgur.com/a/khUut

Posted Image

Red 333

This post has been edited by Red 333: 04 January 2018 - 11:39 AM

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#18 User is offline   zombywoof 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 12:41 PM

If anyone is really interested, the UMGF maintains a Gibson bracing library.
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#19 User is offline   Red 333 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 01:49 PM

 zombywoof, on 04 January 2018 - 12:41 PM, said:

If anyone is really interested, the UMGF maintains a Gibson bracing library.


I just went over there to take a look, and see if I could contribute; I've taken many pictures. I found the Martin bracing library (under Technical), but not the Gibson. Do you know what section it's in?

Thanks, zomby.

Red 333

This post has been edited by Red 333: 04 January 2018 - 01:50 PM

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#20 User is offline   zombywoof 

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Posted 04 January 2018 - 02:57 PM

View PostRed 333, on 04 January 2018 - 01:49 PM, said:

I just went over there to take a look, and see if I could contribute; I've taken many pictures. I found the Martin bracing library (under Technical), but not the Gibson. Do you know what section it's in?

Thanks, zomby.

Red 333



Try this Red

https://www.tapatalk...rary-t1364.html

This post has been edited by zombywoof: 04 January 2018 - 02:59 PM

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