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Real or ... ('76 J50/45 on kijiji)


Saul Good

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Looks fake to me also. And even if it's not.... $1700 for a 70's J-45? I see several of them at Guitar Center in the $1100 to $1500 price range and I'll bet you could talk them down too.

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Just curious, what are you Gents seeing that is marking it out as fake? It looks like a run of the mill tobacco burst mid/late ‘70s Norlin box to me, right down to the shallow bridge and the clumsy over-the-rosette burst.

 

I’m not discounting anyone’s opinions of course, I’m just obviously missing something...fake or not, it’s well overpriced.

 

As many will tell you, these Norlin era boxes are very variable-I’ve played a handful of them that have been gems, but there are plenty that I’ve had in my lap that sound like they’re full of wet socks.

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Not sure what red flags you guys are seeing but it looks like a typical mid-1970s Clown Burst to me.

 

Real Gibsons from that period look just like fake Gibsons. Not Gibson's high point, any way you look at it.

 

For that money, you can buy a nice near-new J-45 standard. I've even seen really nice modern AJ's for that money. No contest. Vintage doesn't necessarily mean good.

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A fine example of how the Norlin era’s quality deteriorated, especially as the 70s wore on. I have seen some late 70s Norlin era Gibsons look like the luthiers in Kalamazoo were so frustrated with Norlin that they might very well have been intentionally putting out bizarre guitars just because they could because Norlin’s quality control folks wouldn’t notice.

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

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For me, I think the angle of the pic made it look weirdly elongated.

 

No, that Hershey Kiss shaped burst is pretty much what you got. I have, however, seen mid-1970s J-45s with a darker brownish center. These were at least still built in Kalamazoo. The local shop back home would routinely price these in the $1100 to $1200 range hoping to move them, several hundred less if it showed enough playing wear.

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I just haven't seen one quite like this, but you guys have a lot more experience than me, so I'll accept your opinion. Just noticed that the site is in Canada, so using current exchange rates that would work out to about $1320. So maybe the price isn't that far out of line. It would help if people mention that prices are in Canadian (or Australian) dollars when they post, since this is a US website. :)

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I can't make (this square's) shape look right -- maybe it's the angle. I don't understand the "J50/45" model -- it should say. (The burst is on J45 & the J50 is natural -- according to the only catalogs I can find -- but know catalogs can be wrong.) I don't know a lot about 70's Gibsons, that's why I'm asking. I have contacted the seller, asking about the model number he's given. The sparseness of info and pic's could just be lack of effort on seller's part. I've only run across red bursts on square shoulder J45 -- but not (brownish) burst on J50. When I've encountered the brownish burst it's not been with the simple dot inlays -- it's been with SJ markers.

 

Sorry for my confusion. Thanks for a place to hash it out. I'll keep reading up on Norlin years, and Gibson history in general.

 

Edit: and no white relief, model designation on truss rod cover. And unresponsive seller. And I considered several Collings fakes, from the same area, recently. Similar look and feel to those ad's. Again not saying I disagree with. "It's legit.", just explaining why it caused me to pause & be suspicious. Thanks & apologies again.

 

And apologies for not saying the Canadian ad' was in Canadian dollars. I think of the internet as being multi-national [smile] .

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I can't make (this square's) shape look right -- maybe it's the angle. I don't understand the "J50/45" model -- it should say. (The burst is on J45 & the J50 is natural -- according to the only catalogs I can find -- but know catalogs can be wrong.) I don't know a lot about 70's Gibsons, that's why I'm asking. I have contacted the seller, asking about the model number he's given. The sparseness of info and pic's could just be lack of effort on seller's part. I've only run across red bursts on square shoulder J45 -- but not (brownish) burst on J50. When I've encountered the brownish burst it's not been with the simple dot inlays -- it's been with SJ markers.

 

Sorry for my confusion. Thanks for a place to hash it out. I'll keep reading up on Norlin years, and Gibson history in general.

 

 

Based on the ones I have played, if you look on the back of the headstock you will see a J45/50 stamp below the serial number. As the necks and boards were interchangeable maybe it saved them a few seconds of work on the assembly line or a nickel to do this.

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Not, perhaps, some more understand why the Norlin era and its management’s cost cutting and lack of concern for Gibson’s heritage and quality gained such a poor reputation. And, why Henry is greatly defended for restoring Gibson’s reputation and previous historically great quality of instruments.

 

All of those things began to slip in the Norlin’s early 70s era and then by the mid 70s took an even greater dive in increasing numbers. Some were still good, but some were strange strange strange.

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

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Here’s a reverb ad for essentially the same guitar. $900. Seems FAR more reasonable for a mid 70s Gibson acoustic. I would just say no altogether. Like many people said for the same amount you can get a modern j45 which is miles ahead better.

https://reverb.com/item/10567497-gibson-j-45-50-1976-sunburst?gclid=CjwKCAjwlIvXBRBjEiwATWAQIsR36OPbTwjhsMHmcUp2R86kwhW877QgAW2ZXZxtH125HosqUmqdtxoCqiMQAvD_BwE&pla=1

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And apologies for not saying the Canadian ad' was in Canadian dollars. I think of the internet as being multi-national [smile] .

 

I certainly wasn't expecting an apology! And I agree that the internet is international. I am not familiar with that website and didn't look closely at where it was located, just saw your screenshot with a dollar sign and a price. :)

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Based on the ones I have played, if you look on the back of the headstock you will see a J45/50 stamp below the serial number. As the necks and boards were interchangeable maybe it saved them a few seconds of work on the assembly line or a nickel to do this.

 

I'm having an, "Ah ha!!", moment. Thanks.

 

Thanks everyone. Not looking to purchase this guitar. (My wife, who can see the text on screen, just chimed in with, "There's a first time for everything.")

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I certainly wasn't expecting an apology! And I agree that the internet is international. I am not familiar with that website and didn't look closely at where it was located, just saw your screenshot with a dollar sign and a price. :)

 

's all good -- my tongue was firmly in my cheek & no rankle intended, and seriously -- Thank You eh. [smile]

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The relationship of guitar price to exchange rate is interesting. No idea how this compares with used instruments, but we have had a few threads where new Gibson prices were discussed. In most cases, an American could exchange their money, buy a new J-45 in Canada and come out between $100 and $200 ahead - enough to pay for the day trip if you are near the border. :)

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Not, perhaps, some more understand why the Norlin era and its management’s cost cutting and lack of concern for Gibson’s heritage and quality gained such a poor reputation. And, why Henry is greatly defended for restoring Gibson’s reputation and previous historically great quality of instruments.

 

All of those things began to slip in the Norlin’s early 70s era and then by the mid 70s took an even greater dive in increasing numbers. Some were still good, but some were strange strange strange.

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

 

Quality started to slip well before the ECL/Norlin days. The downward slide began in the mid-1960s - the result of mismanagement by CMI's new President accelerated by the Great Society Recession. By the 1970s virtually nothing was left of the Gibson system of building guitars.

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Get a mirror inside and see if its a double X brace.. if its a double X .. its a Real 70s J45/50../hummingbird / dove.. /sj / gospel /artist.. / Heritage.. .. Those Burst were used on Doves as well..

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