re: EPI ES-175

[bluser]

I recently acquired an EPI ES-175. Wonderful blues or jazz box. Easy to play, low action, comfortable neck. Warm sound,

though not very powerful pickups.

I am planning on swapping the pickups for some kind of Gibson pickup. Has anyone done that and did a comparison to the stock EPI pickups?

How come Epiphone doesn't just put Gibson pickups in the 175 and charge a little more?

 

My only other complaint is the cheap input jack. It got loose right away - I tightened it, but not sure how long it will

last.

 

Does the difference in woods on the EPI and Gibson ES-175s matter that much, since it is laminated top, back, sides?

I've never played a Gibson ES-175, so can't compare sounds, myself.

 

Finally, anyone make any recordings using EPI 175 or EPI Zephr?

 

-- Bluser

[carverman]

Epiphone has to keep the price down for their version of the ES-175

"re-issue". I played a Gibson ES-175 last year with the Gibson (probably),

57 Classics... and the sound was..well..perfect for these old ears.

 

Getting a couple Classic 57s is a well worth investment for your Epiphone,

you won't regret the investment. As an more economic alternative, try a

set of GFS Vintage 59s..they are pretty mellow too.

 

As far as the input jack, replace it with a good gold plated switchcraft and

you won't have any more problems.

 

I had to do this with my Epi Broadway Elitist...here's a photo to show you

that there is a difference between the Switchcraft jack and the asian version,

especially the contact (spring)

tension.

 

[Suho]

I will have to replace the wiring (probably all of it) in one of my Sheratons. I think I might get some different GFS pups to put in there as well. I never realized the difference was so obvious between the two jacks. I thought the Elitists all had American electronics.

 

Carverman! Good to see you again. Haven't seen you around here much lately. How is the Spotlight Special coming?

[brad1]

How come Epiphone doesn't just put Gibson pickups in the 175 and charge a little more?

 

 

-- Bluser

 

 

 

 

Because Gibson owns Epiphone. Epiphone can't do just whatever they want to do.

[bluser]

I just uploaded a few clips of the EPI ES-175 with stock pickups played through a Fender

Champion 600 amp.

[bluser]

Here is the url of the EPI-175 youtube video:

 

http://www.youtube.com/user/entfred

[carverman]

Suho wrote:

Carverman! Good to see you again. Haven't seen you around here much lately. How is the Spotlight Special coming?

 

It's coming along very slowly right now. I'm getting ready for a carving show in 4 weeks, so the priorities have

been shifted. I'll get back to it in full force in mid March when the days are a bit warmer.

BTW, those Kluson tuners look real nice on my Emperor II and work well too.

[carverman]

Here is the url of the EPI-175

youtube video:

 

Hey! Nice finger style there Blueser! You sound a bit like Joe Pass

from that brief clip. You gotta agree..the ES-175 IS the jazz box of choice!

 

I don't know what kind of "pixie dust" Epi or Gibson put in these things, but

I played a couple in Memphis/Nashville last year, and it was SO hard not to

plunk down my MC and buy it on the spot!

I played a Tal Farlow model and a couple of ther archtops but

they just didn't have that magical sound that comes out of these things, so it's

not just the pickups used on the ES-175..it's that "mojo" built into it.

 

BTW; Brian Hughes, one of our Canajun jazz players plays a '71 ES-175 and

hangs a Roland GK 2A pickup behind the bridge humbucker to get a doubling

effect on some of the melody lines. ( He used to play a Guild DA-500 (similar to

an "L5", but dumped her for the "other blonde", the ES-175.)

[Old Bob]

I've recently bought the Epi 175 too, and as a 'hobby' guitarist thought it was good alternative to the Gibson original. Never played the Gibson either, so it's hard to say how well it sounds in contrast. Suspect the maple neck makes it a bit brighter, but then it is 5th the price. Mine has a dual-action truss rod in it too (which confused me for a while) and some say the extra rod in the next adds to the brightness. I already had a pair of Gibson 57's, so I put those in. Better tone of course (richer, fuller etc); but thought the original Epis were actually quite good already. Agree about the jack socket. In fact the wood there is fairly thin and I've managed to snag the jack plug a couple of times - the wood is OK but the poly varnish cracked both times. I've fitted a dummy jack plate now to spread the load (didn't use fitting screws because of the thinness of the wood here - just used it like a large washer) and this has given some support to the jack socket. Take care with the jack, or maybe fit a 90 degree plug. Fitted flat wounds (Chrome 11's) but the search for tone goes on. The amp and the fingers play a big part in this, so think it's unrealistic for the Epi to reproduce the Gibson sound straight out of the case. Godd luck with it - I like mine a lot.

 

Bob

[bluser]

Carverman,

 

Thanks. I tried adding a pickup to an acoustic guitar (Martin) and it did not get the "jazz" sound I was looking for.

I never thought something laminated would sound so good!

[bluser]

Old Bob,

 

I look forward to trying some 57s - I heard them on some other guitars and liked the sound.

Maybe eventually I will get the pickup switch and jack replaced. In the mean time, I'll be careful.

I had a friend with an EPI Les Paul and some Gibson pickups were far better than the stock EPI pickups,

from what I heard. But, you are right - the EPI pickups are "ok" and do the job.

[Old Bob]

I've taken up jazz guitar as my 'retirement project' - it's a steep learning curve, but as someone said to me: you may be too old ever to be a really good jazz guitarist, but you're never too old to enjoy yourself. Chasing the tone is all part of learning the guitar to me, so I reckon you can only learn by changing a few things around. I suspect - from what I've read on other forums etc - that maybe the Epi is a bit too bright to sound really authentic, and that even 57 Classics can't quite tame it. I've changed the top 'E' to a 12, which has helped. Just give it a go and enjoy it.

 

Bob

[bluser]

Old Bob,

 

I don't think the EPI is too bright (i.e. Danny Gatton used a telecaster for jazz). But, this is individual preference, of course.

The neck PUP is, if anything, too muddy, due to the stock PUPS, but within a month or two, I hope to have those replaced.

Will cost 40% to 50% of the price of the guitar to replace!

[arobatto]

Bluser,

 

I changed my Epi -175 stock p-ups with Seymour Duncan Seth Lover (bridge and neck) and was very pleased with the change in tone. It definately warmed it up. I primarily use the neck pickup. I'm learning jazz chord progressions and I'm very happy with sound of the Epi-175 for that toned down jazz sound. I added D'Addario chrome flatwounds (11's) and have been spoiled with their smooth texture. I too had the experience with the jack and decided it was best to add a jackplate to beef up the thin laminate wood they use for the sides. In fact, before I installed a jackplate, I noticed the jack started to crack the clear coat. With a little modification it worked well.

 

I was amazed with the finish of my Epi ES-175 at first, but have since noticed a finish crack running the seam of the neck joint. Overall, for a $500.00 guitar, it is a great bang for the buck. I have, however, put it to the side and have been playing a newly aquired Guild X-170 (drool). I'm sure to go back playing my Epi! It does sound awesome!

 

Regards,

 

Alex

[Old Bob]

Bluser

 

Yes - OK, I agree with you really (I'm new to this forum business - it's not always easy to write quicky and briefly and still say what you mean ... at least it's not easy for me). Not having played the Gibson I can't really say first hand how it compares - I'm reporting other forums when I say it's bright. But, even so, this is only bright campared to the Gibson. It would be interesting to hear from someone here who has compared the two. I've carried out a number of Gibson transplants to the Epi and it's still only a third of the price of the original.

 

Bob

[carverman]

I've taken up jazz guitar as my 'retirement project' - it's a steep learning curve' date=' but as someone said to me: you may be too old ever to be a really good jazz guitarist, but you're never too old to enjoy yourself. Chasing the tone is all part of learning the guitar to me, so I reckon you can only learn by changing a few things around. I suspect - from what I've read on other forums etc - that maybe the Epi is a bit too bright to sound really authentic, and that even 57 Classics can't quite tame it. I've changed the top 'E' to a 12, which has helped. Just give it a go and enjoy it.

 

Bob[/quote']:(

 

An all around jazz guitar is pretty tough to find that satisfies every experienced players tastes.

Obviously, from jazz guitar afficinados, the ES-175 stands out as very a "unique" tone,

equipped both with the original P-90s, and later on with Humbuckers. A lot of good jazz players

have played one at one time or the other...it's not just the pressed plywood shell, but the dimensions,

the florentine (sharp) cutaway and the pickups that make this one of the best jazz boxes to this day.

I don't have a ES-175 yet..but I do have a couple of Epi Emperor IIs that come close in tone,

now that they have GFS 59s...but they still leave me wondering....

maybe I shouldn't have gone for it and be done with it at this point in my life.

 

I've switched to Fender stainless flats 054- 013 on my Broadway and don't go below

012 on any of my archtops. I'll be switching over from D'Addario XLs to Fender on these as well.

You get a better tone with the thicker strings, with the tone control turned down.

 

You are right about never being too old to enjoy yourself (on a good archtop)..the inspiration

always remains to bring out single string melodics and experiment with some neat jazz chords.

[carverman]

Carverman' date='

 

Thanks. I tried adding a pickup to an acoustic guitar (Martin) and it did not get the "jazz" sound I was looking for.

I never thought something laminated would sound so good!

 

[/quote']

 

Old Bob...

My solution to a combo flatop/archtop sound would be the original late 60's

Epiphone Howard Roberts archtop with the unique oval sound

hole instead of f-holes. You get the best of both worlds with that model.. Gibson

flatop tone,(not sure about Martin) as well as the ES-175 tone that comes from the

shape and styling of the HR model styled close to the ES-175 dimensions.

 

Epiphone back in the Kalamzoo days developed this unique guitar, at his request,

he was a famous West Coast session jazz guitarist)...and over the years, this particular

and unique Epiphone seems to have been relegated to history books.

A few people were asking about some famous artists that played Epiphones.

he was one of them.

Not sure on the reasons..maybe it's not a big market to make it worthwhile to

re-issue it, but it is certainly unique in the acoustic archtop tone catagory, because it

is a loud acoustic as well.

[Parabar]

I used to have a Gibson ES-175, I think it was a '72 or '73 natural blonde, and at the time it was my dream guitar. Sometime later I had an attack of insanity and sold all my electric instruments, including the Gibson, a Fender Bassman amp, and a Rhodes Mark I electric piano .

 

I recently played an Epi ES-175 in a store, and it neither felt nor sounded like the Gibson. Not BAD, mind you, just not like the Gibson. It felt lighter and less substantial, and the tone had less body and punch. The cutaway shape isn't quite right either --- the Gibson's is aesthetically just right, and the Epi's is a bit asymmetrical. Maybe they thought they were "improving" it by making it wider for better access, but it looks out of balance to me. Still, for the price, it's a perfectly decent jazzbox.

 

On the other hand, my Epi Joe Pass gets all the tones I used to love about the Gibson, and then some, and is even more comfortable to play, so it gets my vote as best reasonably-priced 16" archtop with a 24.75" scale and 2 humbuckers. My second favorite is the Gretsch Electromatic 5120. Different tonal palette, true, but VERY impressive!

 

[bluser]

I just got the EPI 175 guitar back with 57 PUPS & new tone controls and it is a large improvement - well worth the bucks. That previous slightly edgy tone is gone - now there is a mellow sound on neck and middle positions. Eventually, I'll post some recordings on myspace. I don't think a minature built-in microphone is going to show this guitar off, on youtube, with what I have to use (i.e. Nikon digital camera). So, Myspace might be the best bet.

 

The bridge PUP gives significant more boost to the sound with better treble. Tone control for each PUP was swapped out, too.

The EPI sounds particularly good through a Marshall Artist 3203 head and also nice with an amp with more bass response, such as a Fender Bassman.

 

But, it sounds fine through any good amp and picks up a lot of the

characteristics of the particular amp, which in my opinion, is a sign of a good guitar.

 

This EPI 175 sounds great, but completely different than a previously owned Eastman archtop with floating PUP. I sold it in a fit of GAS.... The EPI is cool for gigs and jamming, since it is very durable and is not going to be as environmentally affected as an

all solid woods archtop.

 

In any event, I am satisfied with this experiment and would highly recommend it to anyone else who wants to improve it without having to buy

a much more expensive axe. The EPI 175 sound is woody, warm, and good mix of treble, mids, and bass. The new tone controls work and you can

turn down the treble to get a more dark, smoky jazz sound, if one wishes to get that tone. And you can get a biting rock lead sound, if you

wish to do that, so this is an extremely versatile guitar.

[JEPI]

For those that don't have the $$$ or the expertise to change the pups, do what Bluser suggested. With some determined practice at learning how to use your tone controls, you can vary the sound you get quite a bit.