Adirondack Spruce on old Gibsons?

[robroy]

I was talking to a local luthier who was tuning up my old LG-2 this past week and he told me that my guitar and all old Gibsons, up to, like the early 1960s, had Adirondack Spruce tops. Can any of you guys verify that? I had no idea, but it sure has great tone.

 

He also said that Gibson arched their flat tops very slightly both horizontally and vertically, crowning around the bridge. I could see that was the case with my LG-2, but I didn't know whether that was due to old age or design. Anybody ever heard that one?

 

Robert

[Rosewoody]

My understanding from Fabulous Flattops is that, yes, Gibsons are arched. The Ad Spruce is probably a case of Gibson and other makers using what was (is) available. I think Adi was no big deal, somewhat like Brazilian Rosewood--the norm at that time which now has mythical stature.

[TM]

The accepted wisdom is that adirondack tops ended in the WWII years, near the end of the war and was not used again until the Bozeman era. The tops are assumed to be Sitka. Martin also quit using Ad around the same time. Uniformed sellers will say their 50s Gibson have Ad tops, but it just isn't so.

 

This question came up on the UMGF. John Arnold, a leading authority of Ad spruce, said he has never seen a 50s Gibson with an Ad top. When he speaks people listen.

 

Terry

[jt]

TM has it right. Adi ended in 1944, at about the same time that CMI bought Gibson.

 

Gibsons do have a top and back radius. Pre-1935 flattops don't have it north of the soundhole on the top, but 1935 and post, they do.

[robroy]

The arching of the top is very interesting; was that designed as a structural thing to help prevent the top from bellying or for better tone, or both?

 

Martin doesn't do that, do they? I don't hear about neck resets on Gibsons as much as on old Martins.

 

BTW, my LG-2 is a late 40s model so I assume it's probably Sitka.

 

Thanks for the input!

 

Robert

[jt]

Robert,

 

I believe that the radiusing was done for both tone and structural stability. That radius is one of the things that I've been examining in my Project X-Ray.

 

Martins certainly did not have as significant a radius as Gibson, and may have had none. Some of the kerfings on 1930s Martins do, though, have a bit of beveling. That's next up in Project X-Ray (and vintage Larsons).

[robroy]

Wow, this is becoming quite a learning experience for me.

 

I followed the link to your explanation about all of the Gibson guitars produced during WWII being made by an all female-staffed factory.

 

That's a great bit of Americana.

 

thanks!

[jt]

Thanks, Robert! It has been a fascinating project. It started a year and a half ago when I saw the 1944 photo of Gibson's work force. I imagined that some of those women would still be living, so my search began. I've now met with and conducted detailed oral histories (recorded to DVD for a companion DVD for the book and for an exhibit at the Museum of Making Music) of 12 of them. The women's stories have been really interesting and I feel honored to have shared time with my "Kalamazoo Gals."

 

Meeting the women and talking about the construction techniques of the time led me to begin X-raying those WWII instruments and those built just before and just after the War. Really fun stuff!

[ballcorner]

I don't hear about neck resets on Gibsons as much as on old Martins.

 

 

There is no guitar in the world that needs neck resets more often than a Martin, but at the same time they are not overly difficult to do, or expensive, and they usually last 30+ years if they have been fitted well.

 

The structure of a Gibson makes it less likely to ever need a reset as the Gibson is more well engineered to distribute the stress evenly. Still, as much as I love my Gibsons, I can say that I am more likely to record on a Martin because they are easier to voice in the studio, and that is really a result of the guitar being built in such a way that it is on the verge of exploding in concert pitch - exactly what you want for tone, but perhaps not best for the changing climate conditions of a camping trip.

 

For any guitar maker, neck setting is the most challenging part of the process. The differences between the production methods at Martin and Gibson are miniscule, but the focus at Martin is on production and the focus at Gibson is still on experience and quality. More simply put: You are more likely to get a newer employee setting necks at Martin.