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bumble bee caps

#1 User is offline   ken374 

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 10:00 AM

I see the musician friend sell bumble bee caps for 112 for 2 wonder if it would help in the tone. Bad review on it though
http://accessories.m...pack?sku=H65441
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#2 User is offline   Tim Plains 

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 03:36 PM

What a joke. Gibson's Bees only look like the part but they are referred to as fake Bees because they're not paper in oil capacitors like the original ones Gibson used. If you want real PIO reproduction Bees, they cost around $40/pair and are a hundred times better than those. Google "Luxe capacitors".

PIO Bees are an upgrade but they often have little to no effect if you keep everything on 10. They more so work their magic as you roll down the tone pots. Having said that, I replaced only the caps on two historic LPs and they made no difference on one guitar but a huge difference in the other (even with everything on 10).
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#3 User is offline   surfpup 

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 04:10 PM

 R9, on 29 October 2010 - 03:36 PM, said:

... Having said that, I replaced only the caps on two historic LPs and they made no difference on one guitar but a huge difference in the other (even with everything on 10).


Try flipping them around (one at a time). While technically those caps have no "direction" do like some other electronic caps, there can still be a noticeable difference in tone between directions.
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#4 User is offline   lakehaus 

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Posted 30 October 2010 - 09:08 AM

 ken374, on 29 October 2010 - 10:00 AM, said:

I see the musician friend sell bumble bee caps for 112 for 2 wonder if it would help in the tone. Bad review on it though
http://accessories.m...pack?sku=H65441


I bought a set of vintage Bumble Bees for less than $50 about 6 months ago. Each are .022uF. They were installed on my '76 SG, but are now on my '82 LP. See 1st pic.

I have the Luxe BBs and they sound great (on my '71 ES-175), but I learned thru trial that Russian PIO caps are just as good as Luxe at about a quarter of the price. There's a rumor about the similarities of the Russians and the Luxe...

Second pic shows the Russians now on my SG. .015uF on the neck, .022uF on the bridge.

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59 Gibson ES-175
61 Gretsch 6118 Annie
64 Fender Stratocaster
74 EDS-1275
76 Gibson SG Standard
79 Martin D-35
12 Gibson 56 Replica
13 Tidewater Handsome Outlaw Tele
14 Tidewater Accolades 58 CAR Strat

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59 Fender Deluxe
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#5 User is offline   Tim Plains 

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Posted 30 October 2010 - 02:00 PM

 surfpup, on 29 October 2010 - 04:10 PM, said:

Try flipping them around (one at a time). While technically those caps have no "direction" do like some other electronic caps, there can still be a noticeable difference in tone between directions.

I thought about doing that but don't think it would have made a difference. Either way, that guitar's long gone now.
Tim

#6 User is offline   ken374 

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Posted 31 October 2010 - 05:32 PM

 lakehaus, on 30 October 2010 - 09:08 AM, said:

I bought a set of vintage Bumble Bees for less than $50 about 6 months ago. Each are .022uF. They were installed on my '76 SG, but are now on my '82 LP. See 1st pic.

I have the Luxe BBs and they sound great (on my '71 ES-175), but I learned thru trial that Russian PIO caps are just as good as Luxe at about a quarter of the price. There's a rumor about the similarities of the Russians and the Luxe...

Second pic shows the Russians now on my SG. .015uF on the neck, .022uF on the bridge.

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so these do sound better then stock?, when the guitar is all the way up?
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#7 User is offline   lakehaus 

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Posted 01 November 2010 - 11:05 AM

 ken374, on 31 October 2010 - 05:32 PM, said:

so these do sound better then stock?, when the guitar is all the way up?


IMO, it sounds way better across the range of the pot. Stock caps on the '76 SG were very small green cylinders - not sure what they were in terms of material and value. Stock caps on the '82 were little pink aspirin lookin' ceramics. Worthwhile to note that I changed the pots on each at the same time I changed the caps.

This link might interest you - It demonstrates different cap materials and micro farad (uF) values.
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59 Gibson ES-175
61 Gretsch 6118 Annie
64 Fender Stratocaster
74 EDS-1275
76 Gibson SG Standard
79 Martin D-35
12 Gibson 56 Replica
13 Tidewater Handsome Outlaw Tele
14 Tidewater Accolades 58 CAR Strat

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59 Fender Deluxe
64 Vox AC30 TB
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#8 User is offline   Riverside 

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Posted 01 November 2010 - 11:19 AM

Opinions about caps intrigue me.

Give this a read - then break out the O-scopes:

http://www.tone-liza...ronic_Parts.htm

I suspect that if you spent >$100 for a set of caps, it had better sound better.

#9 User is offline   ken374 

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Posted 02 November 2010 - 07:50 AM

 lakehaus, on 01 November 2010 - 11:05 AM, said:

IMO, it sounds way better across the range of the pot. Stock caps on the '76 SG were very small green cylinders - not sure what they were in terms of material and value. Stock caps on the '82 were little pink aspirin lookin' ceramics. Worthwhile to note that I changed the pots on each at the same time I changed the caps.

This link might interest you - It demonstrates different cap materials and micro farad (uF) values.

thanks for the reply i just bought a new SG so im wondering what to do. I bought a Radial buffer/clean boost pedal, really brings out the pickups
Gibson SG standard
Epiphone Dot
Fender 68 Custom twin
Bogner pedals

#10 User is offline   lakehaus 

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Posted 02 November 2010 - 11:04 AM

 ken374, on 02 November 2010 - 07:50 AM, said:

thanks for the reply i just bought a new SG so im wondering what to do. I bought a Radial buffer/clean boost pedal, really brings out the pickups


There's a lot of no-cost things you can do before you acquire and install parts - like adjusting your pickup height (just turn the screws until you hit a sweet spot). You'll know it when you find it. Wrap the stop bar (push strings through the opposite side of the bar and wrap around the top, then onto the saddles to the tuner posts). Good luck, and good choice!
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59 Gibson ES-175
61 Gretsch 6118 Annie
64 Fender Stratocaster
74 EDS-1275
76 Gibson SG Standard
79 Martin D-35
12 Gibson 56 Replica
13 Tidewater Handsome Outlaw Tele
14 Tidewater Accolades 58 CAR Strat

.

59 Fender Deluxe
64 Vox AC30 TB
65 Fender Deluxe Reverb
71 Marshall 50w Super Lead w/ JCM A, quad '70 G12M 003s

#11 User is offline   voxampguy 

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Posted 08 November 2010 - 12:45 PM

Anyone try the orange drop caps on an SG or LP with 57/57+?

#12 User is offline   Blue Fog Experiment 

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 06:46 PM

FYI - LUXE Caps are Russian PIOs painted to look like the originals. They are K40y-9s - normally they use the 1000V series due to their size. I bought a bunch of NOS K40y-9s (200/400V) from Russia a few months back and have replaced all my caps in all my guitars and all my 'friends' guitars. I pickup up .022, .047 and .1s They really do make a difference if you know how to set your amp and use the tone knobs correctly. I also have a bunch of vintage Orange Drops from the 60's and 70's along with a few Chocolate Drops from the early 70's. They're good too - just not as woody. My SG has 'Blue Drops' from ITW Paktron in the .022 flavor. Nice sounding caps but like an earlier post said - if you don't move your tone knob from 10 - the cap isn't gonna make any difference. 50's wiring versus Modern Wiring does make a difference too and despite what other people say, I believe cloth wiring does add a little 'omph' to the sound. I recently rewired a guys Epi LP and left the Poly wire in it initially and he asked me to swap it out cause mine sounded much better and when I put the cloth stuff it - there was a little something more there.

Just my 2 cents.
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2005 Wine Birdseye-Maple Epi Les Paul (w/SD Phat-Cats)
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#13 User is offline   Riverside 

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 09:32 PM

 Blue Fog Experiment, on 15 November 2010 - 06:46 PM, said:

...and despite what other people say, I believe cloth wiring does add a little 'omph' to the sound.


Golly. That's amazing.

Who says it doesn't make a difference? Physicists? Electrical Engineers? People who test with oscilloscopes? What do they know?



Does your guitar sound better with witch hats or speed knobs? If you've never slapped on some Chicken heads, you're missing out.

I've also heard that the orange case-fuzz makes your guitar sound better than does the white.

#14 User is offline   lakehaus 

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Posted 25 November 2010 - 01:30 PM

 Riverside, on 15 November 2010 - 09:32 PM, said:

Golly. That's amazing.

Who says it doesn't make a difference? Physicists? Electrical Engineers? People who test with oscilloscopes? What do they know?



Does your guitar sound better with witch hats or speed knobs? If you've never slapped on some Chicken heads, you're missing out.

I've also heard that the orange case-fuzz makes your guitar sound better than does the white.


Pretty funny.

I'll subscribe to what I know makes a difference based on my own experience.
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59 Gibson ES-175
61 Gretsch 6118 Annie
64 Fender Stratocaster
74 EDS-1275
76 Gibson SG Standard
79 Martin D-35
12 Gibson 56 Replica
13 Tidewater Handsome Outlaw Tele
14 Tidewater Accolades 58 CAR Strat

.

59 Fender Deluxe
64 Vox AC30 TB
65 Fender Deluxe Reverb
71 Marshall 50w Super Lead w/ JCM A, quad '70 G12M 003s

#15 User is offline   Bender 4 Life 

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 05:39 AM

 Riverside, on 15 November 2010 - 09:32 PM, said:

Golly. That's amazing.

Who says it doesn't make a difference? Physicists? Electrical Engineers? People who test with oscilloscopes? What do they know?



Does your guitar sound better with witch hats or speed knobs? If you've never slapped on some Chicken heads, you're missing out.

I've also heard that the orange case-fuzz makes your guitar sound better than does the white.



but.....but.....my new SG has WHITE case fuzz, and it sounds great! especially since I adjusted the p'ups, did a proper setup on it, and replaced the SG TRC with a plain one....ohhhhh it's the TRC that made it sound better ! [biggrin]
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#16 User is offline   Kimbabig 

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 10:32 AM

I love my cork in oil caps, I even sniffed them to ensure quality.
With kidding aside I beleive that real paper in oil caps sound great, although I've never heard a difference.
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#17 User is offline   pete c 

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Posted 27 November 2010 - 07:14 PM

i dont get it why are they called bumble bees, i figured they would be black with yellow stripes [confused]
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if your not the lead dog the view never changes....

#18 User is offline   pete c 

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 08:12 AM

is there a good web site on how to identify bumble bees, i have a ton of old non working stuff and would i like to identify these caps
* this post was in no way intended to offend anyone who might get offended.
The poster acknowledges the rights of each person to take offense at whatever
he or she may choose. However the poster of the above comment is in no
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(copyright for this disclaimer is held by surfpup 2010-12)


if your not the lead dog the view never changes....

#19 User is offline   lakehaus 

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 02:12 PM

 bonfire, on 05 December 2010 - 08:12 AM, said:

is there a good web site on how to identify bumble bees, i have a ton of old non working stuff and would i like to identify these caps


Here's a color code chart that may begin to help: click
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59 Gibson ES-175
61 Gretsch 6118 Annie
64 Fender Stratocaster
74 EDS-1275
76 Gibson SG Standard
79 Martin D-35
12 Gibson 56 Replica
13 Tidewater Handsome Outlaw Tele
14 Tidewater Accolades 58 CAR Strat

.

59 Fender Deluxe
64 Vox AC30 TB
65 Fender Deluxe Reverb
71 Marshall 50w Super Lead w/ JCM A, quad '70 G12M 003s

#20 User is offline   pete c 

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Posted 06 December 2010 - 08:35 AM

 lakehaus, on 05 December 2010 - 02:12 PM, said:

Here's a color code chart that may begin to help: click



thank you very helpful
* this post was in no way intended to offend anyone who might get offended.
The poster acknowledges the rights of each person to take offense at whatever
he or she may choose. However the poster of the above comment is in no
way liable for said offense taking
(copyright for this disclaimer is held by surfpup 2010-12)


if your not the lead dog the view never changes....

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