Buying an expensive Gibson Les Paul... how?

[leovan83]

Hey guys,

 

What's your prefered method for buying a brand new, high end Gibson? Say, the one I'm planning on buying - a brand new Gibson Les Paul Custom.

 

I bought my previous Gibson Les Paul Custom online, through Privatereserveguitars.com (which is part of Musiciansfriend.com) and had no issues, except the hardshell case it came with had a broken metal clamp on the handle, and I had to buy a brand new Gibson Custom hardshell case from Musiciansfriend.com, since the guy at Private Reserve said "I'll just send you one I may find laying around here from a returned guitar or something, no biggie dude!"... and I was like, hell no, I just spent like 4200 dollars (I was living in Utah at the time and had to pay taxes), I want the thing to be "complete" and "new".

 

Anyway, would you guys still take the classic "go to a guitar store (Guitar Center for example) and buy one of the guitars hanging on the wall" or, the buy online the "undisplayed" guitar which comes with a full quality control check and stuff?

 

I'm leaning towards the online option, but again, if I go to Guitar Center, I'd be like, "hey... do you guys have one inside sealed in it's original box and all that I can buy?" otherwise, I personally don't like the idea of spending that much cash on something that's been hanging from a hanger on a wall for months or years, collecting people's sweat, dust, and swirl marks from the store cleaning them!

 

What do you guys thing it's the better option?

[strat-o-steve]

I would rather see the guitar in person before I pay big money. If I were ordering online, say a $400 guitar, no big deal. But $4000 and I wanna KNOW it is perfect!

[Rich W]

Wondered the same thing myself. Would definitely want to look over and play an expensive or vintage guitar before pulling the trigger. But they're rarely in stores in Vancouver, and a challenge to find without taking a road trip to the big smoke.

[stein]

Do you have any other options than Guitar Center? I usually find the best service I get is from other shops. I find around me that the other shops tend to care more about what I want and also give me better service and support after the purchase.

 

I wouldn't rule out GC, but it wouldn't be first. And, if going there they did not treat me the way I think I should, I wouldn't be buying an expensive guitar there. I would be giving my cash to someone else. That goes for any shop. But if a particular GC happens to give me the service I think is good, then it is a good shop just like any other.

 

If I was going to buy something that I could'nt touch and play first, I would buy used right from the gate. I see no reason to pay the extra for new if I am not choosing from a number of options I can inspect and spend a little time with.

[AlanH]

In the UK we have distance selling regulations covering anything purchased mail order or online. You legally have 7 days to return an item without any questions. That said, for that amount of money, I'd be wanting to try out several over a number of weeks/months and be taking my pick.

[Tim Plains]

You paid way too much for a Custom. Gibson has a minimum advertised pricing policy. Places like Guitar Center usually make you pay that price. Other places give you deep discounts.

[charlie brown]

I've only bought a guitar "on-line" (Musician's Friend) 2 times.

1, because they were "blowing out," AIUSA Sheraton's, for $999.00

(I wish now, I'd have bought 2!) And, the second one was my Epi

P-93LE Riviera, when they first came out. In both cases, the

guitars were just fine! (Thankfully!) Normally, I never buy a guitar

without seeing it, in person, and...more importantly, playing it, first!

My dealer has prices, well below the Big Box retailers, anyway! So,

on-line purchases have been limited to accessories, and an extension

speaker cabinet, for my Fender HR Deluxe.

 

CB

[Malchik]

I find Guitar Center over charges their guitars by a couple hundred bucks. If your going to order online, Musicians Friend, Sweet Water, Wild Wood are usually as cheap as you'll find a Gibson.

 

I suggest buying locally when buying an instrument that expensive. I'd never buy a guitar that expensive without a good return policy.

[RedSkwirrell]

I drove thousands of miles over the course of two years looking for my first LP, then I bought the second one 'sight unseen' (albeit from an established dealer I have known for years).

 

I was pretty certain the second purchase would not be an issue and was prepared to take the risk.

It worked out and it plays better than the first.

 

The first purchase took me ages because I could not find one that had everything I was looking for;

Feel; Sound; Balance; Look.

There was always something wrong or missing.

Even when I found the 'right' one for me, I still had to change the nut and have the neck shot and re-fretted three times before it was perfect.

After two years of trying out hundreds, buying the last one twenty years later 'unseen' was a risk.

 

I had clues and experience that allowed me to buy my new one 'unseen'.

Ordinarily I wouldn't do that, and would encourage anyone without Les Paul experience to try-before-you-buy.

Spend a long time 'feeling' it.

A Les Paul should play and feel better than anything else, otherwise why would you buy one?

 

{ 8-]

[JellyWheat]

WOW! Most guitars only get refretted three times in their lifetimes!!

 

J/W

[CaptainNemo68]

If you are very familiar with the specs of a Les Paul (ie how certain pickups will sound, how a certain neck is going to feel, fretboard, etc etc) then buying online shouldn't be a problem. If there is something wrong with the guitar when you receive it just send it back.

[badbluesplayer]

Guitar center seems to be the worst large Gibson dealer. Don't even go in there.

 

I buy all my new guitars online. I don't have a choice. I have recently bought from Ryan Murphy at Sweetwater. They have pictures of the actual guitars that they stock on their website. They will check out the guitar and do a fifty point setup checklist before they send it out the door. Sweetwater is one of the best. You will not get a badly setup guitar from them.

 

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/LPCEBGH

 

[RedSkwirrell]

Most guitars only get refretted three times in their lifetimes!!

Yeah, I had a struggle finding one I really liked (and some of those I tried were downright junk).

This one met all the main criteria but the intonation was slightly out and there were a couple of fretboard blemishes.

I decided to buy it and sort those out after.

That's what took the services.

I wasn't comfortable with the original fretwire which I had worn out in about three years.

There were actual divots in it in some places and they were mostly causing buzzes.

Some wore so low it was sounding on the next fret up.

I tried it with Fender wire, but that was too chuncky, and came back to Gibson.

I got everything right on its' third service (I don't service my own Gibsons).

That was around 1995 (I think) and I've been too scared to have anything else done to it since, just in case.

I don't play anywhere near so much now as I used to anyway.

[leovan83]

Private Reserve Guitars (which is Musiciansfriend.com's division of expensive guitars) does the 50 something point check before they send a guitar out as well, I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

The thing is, I will travel to the USA, stay there for 3 days and then come back to Peru. So I will have the guitar purchased online for sure. Will you rather do Private Reserve Guitars or Sweetwater?

 

I just want to get a guitar that hasn't been displayed or hanged on a showroom, that's all.

[gdecantoo]

WOW! Most guitars only get refretted three times in their lifetimes!!

 

J/W

I also have some issues with fret wear. Taking up the guitar again, i bought a 2007 ebony studio last march. Awesome guitar but don't care for the slim taper neck. Bought a new SG standard in june. OK now i'm hooked (addicted) and my latest purchase was a traditional pro 50's neck in honeyburst. I noticed on the SG, the second fret seems to be wearing very fast with a divot also. I tend to do alot of bending mostly on the third string, second fret. Most if not all of the problem is probably because i may be a little heavy handed. I'm going to try to lower my action and use a lighter string to see if that helps. Do you or any other forum members Know of any tricks, remedies or products that will help extend the life of the frets? Are there fret materials That are longer lasting as replacements? I haven't found much discussion on the forums about fret wear. Speaking of the forums, Thank You J/W and all forum members for sharing your knowledge about guitars and amps. My purchases have been influenced by you all. Any info would be appreciated.

OR do i just need to learn to " lighten up"!

[marvar]

Anyway, would you guys still take the classic "go to a guitar store (Guitar Center for example) and buy one of the guitars hanging on the wall" or, the buy online the "undisplayed" guitar which comes with a full quality control check and stuff?

 

I'm leaning towards the online option, but again, if I go to Guitar Center, I'd be like, "hey... do you guys have one inside sealed in it's original box and all that I can buy?" otherwise, I personally don't like the idea of spending that much cash on something that's been hanging from a hanger on a wall for months or years, collecting people's sweat, dust, and swirl marks from the store cleaning them!

 

What do you guys thing it's the better option?

Even if GC has a sealed unopened one in the back, they will tell you they don't- I guess they are too lazy to go look-

I used to have a friend that worked at the regional office, one day I went to GC looking for a certain item- they said they only had the floor model- I called my friend, who looked on their computer inventory and she said they had 3! She then asked me to hand my phone to the salesman, and she proceded to ream him a new backside, as a matter of fact, I never saw that guy working there again- My experiences with GC are "BUYER BEWARE!"

[JellyWheat]

1. I noticed on the SG, the second fret seems to be wearing very fast with a divot also. I tend to do alot of bending mostly on the third string, second fret. Most if not all of the problem is probably because i may be a little heavy handed. I'm going to try to lower my action and use a lighter string to see if that helps.

 

2. Do you or any other forum members Know of any tricks, remedies or products that will help extend the life of the frets? Are there fret materials That are longer lasting as replacements? I haven't found much discussion on the forums about fret wear.

 

3. Speaking of the forums, Thank You J/W and all forum members for sharing your knowledge about guitars and amps. My purchases have been influenced by you all. Any info would be appreciated.

OR do i just need to learn to " lighten up"!

 

 

First off, I think I misunderstood Red Skwirrel's post #9: I read it that he bought the guitar and immediately had it refretted not once, not twice, but three times to get it right.

 

Now, in response to the numbered items:

 

1. This is a common place for fret wear to occur, although bending that C# note is not something I would say I do a lot. If I wanted to bend C# to D, I would do it at the 3rd string, 6th fret.

 

2. Stainless steel frets are virtually impervious to wear, since the alloy is usually harder than the strings themselves, but I personally find the tone "clanky" and brittle. Some folks swear by them, however. My favourite frets are usually "German nickel silver", or 15 to 20% nickel alloy fret material. Dunlop has a wide variety of fret alloys, widths, heights, tang widths, etc. to choose from.

 

3. In my younger years, I too was an extremely "heavy-handed" player (back in the '60s when I first started getting heavy into blues, there were no numbered gauges of strings. You could get light, medium or heavy, nickel or Monel, Gibson, Fender, Gretsch, Guild , or LaBella, roundwounds or flats. Lights broke too quick, so most of us used mediums, and bending was hard work... you had to be heavy-handed). Trouble is , practice does not make perfect, but it DOES make permanent! So if you develop and practice a bad habit enough, it is very hard to break!

 

Of course, I had the concomitant fret wear issues. It was only after I heard our local Gibson rep saying to a salesperson, "Yep, Jelly can play, but I wish somebody would tell him he's not building a house!" that I really started to work at developing a lighter touch. I had a LOT of problems, and I had to ask all sorts of questions of people like Bill Lawrence, some of the Nashville cats, and some of my former students who went on to university to study Jazz.

 

All I can say is that I finally developed some degree of "finesse". I think it has improved my tone and speed, it is much more elegant to watch (so I have been told). and I don't have serious fret wear problems anymore. So YES, I would say you should try to "lighten up".

 

You are quite welcome for whatever help I can offer. I wish there had been forums and learning tools like this when I was young! This is a pretty great forum, and I'm sure others will offer you some tips, as well.

 

Regards,

J/W

B)

[leovan83]

I basically want a guitar that hasn't been displayed. Does anyone know what's the story with privatereserveguitar (musiciansfriend) or Sweetwater in that department?

[cjmwrx]

I basically want a guitar that hasn't been displayed. Does anyone know what's the story with privatereserveguitar (musiciansfriend) or Sweetwater in that department?

 

 

In order for me to obtain my LP Studio Deluxe in a sealed box from Guitar Center, was to order it from the store, in a color they did not have, and have it drop shipped to my house directly. I was the first person to open the box since it came from Nashville. Original Copper staples were still intact.

 

But, even that is a crap shoot, I just got lucky and got a good one. This was just a Studio. BIG difference in price. My case still got damaged in shipping and had to be replaced by the local store. Buyer beware is the best advice. Buy from somewhere that has a good return policy, and happy shopping.

[gdecantoo]

First off, I think I misunderstood Red Skwirrel's post #9: I read it that he bought the guitar and immediately had it refretted not once, not twice, but three times to get it right.

 

Now, in response to the numbered items:

 

1. This is a common place for fret wear to occur, although bending that C# note is not something I would say I do a lot. If I wanted to bend C# to D, I would do it at the 3rd string, 6th fret.

 

2. Stainless steel frets are virtually impervious to wear, since the alloy is usually harder than the strings themselves, but I personally find the tone "clanky" and brittle. Some folks swear by them, however. My favourite frets are usually "German nickel silver", or 15 to 20% nickel alloy fret material. Dunlop has a wide variety of fret alloys, widths, heights, tang widths, etc. to choose from.

 

3. In my younger years, I too was an extremely "heavy-handed" player (back in the '60s when I first started getting heavy into blues, there were no numbered gauges of strings. You could get light, medium or heavy, nickel or Monel, Gibson, Fender, Gretsch, Guild , or LaBella, roundwounds or flats. Lights broke too quick, so most of us used mediums, and bending was hard work... you had to be heavy-handed). Trouble is , practice does not make perfect, but it DOES make permanent! So if you develop and practice a bad habit enough, it is very hard to break!

 

Of course, I had the concomitant fret wear issues. It was only after I heard our local Gibson rep saying to a salesperson, "Yep, Jelly can play, but I wish somebody would tell him he's not building a house!" that I really started to work at developing a lighter touch. I had a LOT of problems, and I had to ask all sorts of questions of people like Bill Lawrence, some of the Nashville cats, and some of my former students who went on to university to study Jazz.

 

All I can say is that I finally developed some degree of "finesse". I think it has improved my tone and speed, it is much more elegant to watch (so I have been told). and I don't have serious fret wear problems anymore. So YES, I would say you should try to "lighten up".

 

You are quite welcome for whatever help I can offer. I wish there had been forums and learning tools like this when I was young! This is a pretty great forum, and I'm sure others will offer you some tips, as well.

 

Regards,

J/W

B)

Thanks J/W for sharing your wisdom on this issue. After my original post there was a post titled "Fret Crown" by AlanH that had some good tips. I do need to start working my way around the fretboard more as i seem to get stuck in the first five frets alot. AlanH had a great tip, BUY MORE GUITARS and rotate them . I've seen the acronym GAS on the forum before, don't know what it stands for but i'm pretty sure i've got it :lol: . When the time comes i will try the stainless frets as i like "virtually impervious"!

Getting back to the original post, my last two i ordered online after trying them out in the GC showroom and had them shipped to the store. They were brought out in their original shipping boxes and opened in front of me. Other than some finnish issues with the SG everything was fine.

Again thank you all for the great advice and sorry for getting off topic.

[dbreslauer]

I basically want a guitar that hasn't been displayed. Does anyone know what's the story with privatereserveguitar (musiciansfriend) or Sweetwater in that department?

 

 

I've purchased two guitars from Private Reserve: they were absolutely awesome to deal with.

 

One of their team, Chris Swope, worked for Gibson, and is very knowledgable. He took the time to email me multiple pictures, made informed suggestions regarding specific guitars, and even had the guitar set up to my request (including my preferred strings).

 

I would not think twice about calling them up again: highly recommended!

 

I hope this helps, and that if you deal with them you're as pleased as I was.

 

Don

[badbluesplayer]

I've ordered from both Private Reserve and Sweetwater. They are both great. At Sweetwater, I get the same salesman every time. He knows me. I've only bought one guitar thru Private Reserve, but I'm sure I could always talk to the same guy.

 

And you will ALWAYS get a fresh guitar from both these guys.

 

[leovan83]

I've purchased two guitars from Private Reserve: they were absolutely awesome to deal with.

 

One of their team, Chris Swope, worked for Gibson, and is very knowledgable. He took the time to email me multiple pictures, made informed suggestions regarding specific guitars, and even had the guitar set up to my request (including my preferred strings).

 

I would not think twice about calling them up again: highly recommended!

 

I hope this helps, and that if you deal with them you're as pleased as I was.

 

Don

 

Chris Swope was exactly the same guy that sold me my previous LP Custom! He even sent a signed letter thanking me for the purchase, I'll talk to him again.

[RedSkwirrell]

First off, I think I misunderstood Red Skwirrel's post #9: I read it that he bought the guitar and immediately had it refretted not once, not twice, but three times to get it right.

 

Ah, no.

I did have it refretted immediately but all three re-frets were incidental to the set-up, and the 2nd and 3rd occasions were to correct the mistake in my original choice of wire.

The re-frets were something I had done at the same time as other neck problems were being sorted out, mainly the intonation.

 

The first time I wanted something chunkier than the original Gibson narrow gauge wire.

Tragically I tried Fender wire which was the worst thing I could have done and was corrected on the next set up.

It buzzed and wore through even faster than the original.

I certainly couldn't claim to be 'light-of-touch' using a lot of pinched harmonics, back in the day.

The guitar is brilliant for that.

 

The best thing to come from these set-ups was when I broke the nut and the lutheir fixing it suggested that he hand carve a new one out of an old piano key he happened to have lying around.

Genius.

It had a kind of calming effect on the guitar, which also calmed me down.

Having said that I don't play as much as I did before that, so maybe it wasn't such a good thing.

[Bradmeister]

Buy in person. Every guitar is different, even Gibsons that are several thousand dollars in price. I tried several custom shop guitars before I found the one I liked. Every one from Guitar Center was crap. The other dealers had better guitars. I still haven't played a custom at Guitar Center I liked. I did find a Standard that was nice, though....

 

Brad