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thinking of buying a EL00,need advice


jwmtele

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I was wondering since I can't get an answer . Could anyone here who has an EL-00 pro check the top across the lower bout and see if the top is flat or convex .

 

I called Gibson and was told by one fellow it was convex and another told me they are dead flat . Mine is convex but when I rock the straight edge and it touches the binding there is about a 1/32" low area like concave that is sort of between the center and the binding . To me it looks like it was dry I thought the tops were supposed to be convex where you could rock a straight edge and find no low areas.

 

Any help would help.

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Now you've got me looking at these.

 

Funny you should resurrect this thread today, catnine. I've talked myself into a trip to the local guitarcenter tomorrow for their "Columbus Day sales event" in order to pick out a nice EL-00 Pro for $254 and throw in an $80 Epiphone case to celebrate my good fortune. [cool]

 

As I understand it, flat is fine for a flattop. [smile] A little outward bow is even better, which shows the guitar is in good health. A low spot between the center and the side edge of the lower bout? I don't know if that's bad or no big deal. That's something I'll look for in my shopping tomorrow. ;)

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Funny you should resurrect this thread today, catnine. I've talked myself into a trip to the local guitarcenter tomorrow for their "Columbus Day sales event" in order to pick out a nice EL-00 Pro for $254 and throw in an $80 Epiphone case to celebrate my good fortune. [cool]

 

As I understand it, flat is fine for a flattop. [smile] A little outward bow is even better, which shows the guitar is in good health. A low spot between the center and the side edge of the lower bout? I don't know if that's bad or no big deal. That's something I'll look for in my shopping tomorrow. ;)

 

 

I don't know what the top should look like. I would think that as most acoustics I have now the two others I have both have a convex top would be normal.

 

I am really frustrated because Gibson techs tell me different things. One I spoke to last week told me it should have a slight convex top today I call and the fellow told me they are dead flat and asked where I got it and then said send it back. He even asked who told me it should be convex and I said one of the techs that works there. I got it from MF and it arrived on the 19th of Sept yet the case is still on back order. I called Musicians Friend and they said They would send me another and I could ship this one back they would send the replacement first . It might be better who the ---- knows. They my all be like this one I have . They may be worse. I don't like the idea of having them ship me another and if it's worse then send it back and deal with UPS again or if it's better then they claim it will cost me nothing . The part that really bugs me is once they get the one back and inspect it and say it was fine then what , I can't get a clear answer on that one. I still have 24 days to decide before the 45 day return expires. I read their return policy and it's questionable in certain areas and someone telling me over the phone it won't cost me anything does not make me feel secure about this. I'm not a lawyer so all the details in the return policy make my head spin. They tried to sell me the 3 year plan and I read it and it has nothing to do with guitars and all guitars come with the silver plan then in that they mention warps or cracks or marks and they have no control over what happens during shipping so that sounds like it's on me if it gets messed up during shipping. Plus on the silver plan you pay the shipping and they get it fixed. I really don't know what to do at this point , the more I read the worst it gets. People have told me MF will make it right many have told me this and maybe they are right.

 

I hope you get a good one and hope they have the case as well . On their web site GC says they are on back order , I can't say that applies to all GC stores.

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One I spoke to last week told me it should have a slight convex top....

 

I think the key word is "slight." EL-00s are not arch-tops. The back should have a healthy bow to it. The top, not so much, AFAIK. Shipping a guitar back is a pain, especially without a case. Is your "low spot" noticeable without the ruler test? Do you see any issues with the inside bracing? Is the guitar otherwise OK and sound good? Every guitar is different, even within the same model (and this is a $299 model). The geometry of the surfaces will be slightly different for each guitar. But bottom line, I only know what I've learned on this board from the members who really know what they're talking about. Maybe someone else will chime in with knowledgeable advice.

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On their web site GC says [EL-00 cases are] on back order...

 

That totally sucks! 79 bucks for an Epi case is a pretty good deal. They say they won't have any till December. I was planning on taking my new EL-00 Pro on a road trip next week. That could be deal breaker! I guess it could travel in its Epi box, but.... [cursing]

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I think the key word is "slight." EL-00s are not arch-tops. The back should have a healthy bow to it. The top, not so much, AFAIK. Shipping a guitar back is a pain, especially without a case. Is your "low spot" noticeable without the ruler test? Do you see any issues with the inside bracing? Is the guitar otherwise OK and sound good? Every guitar is different, even within the same model (and this is a $299 model). The geometry of the surfaces will be slightly different for each guitar. But bottom line, I only know what I've learned on this board from the members who really know what they're talking about. Maybe someone else will chime in with knowledgeable advice.

I called again last night and spoke to the same fellow who told me it should have a slight convex top and from what I was telling him and he kept notes from my last call a week ago. He said the slight dip on the top between the center of the lower bout and closer to the binding is usually caused from bridge pull/stress but could also be because it was dry at one point. The made it sound like they had a EL-00 that they were comparing to but it was a Gibson L-00 . He said it had the same shape top as mine displays and it was checked out and was fine. I can't see the low spot without a straight edge . I haven't looked at the inside bracing . I should , I don't know how far into the lower bout the X brace extends . I was checking at the lower bouts widest point. The guitar sounds fine and plays fine . The only reason I even checked the top with a straight edge was because the way I play I get a buzz on the low E and A from the 1st to the 6th frets . If I play light which still sounds fine I get no buzz. I wanted to see if the top was sunken in and if not then I need a bit higher action ( new saddle or more neck relief or both.

 

It could be dry . I have no idea what it went through during shipping and it's a new guitar built in sept 2013 so it has a year on it sitting in some wear house. I didn't have a good Hygrometer when I got the EL-00 but got on on Oct 2 and the last three days the closet I have it in is 52% RH but on Oct 2nd it was 30% , it's only been at 52% for three days now yet on Sept 24th I added damp sponges in zip locks and they seemed to get dry in a few days .

 

The trouble with buying on-line or even stores is these guitars still get shipped to the USA and shipped to GC or MF or any other on-line store and who can say what happens during shipping or how long a guitar needs to acclimate to the proper environment. For $299 I don't expect perfection , mine looks pretty good . The head stock is a bit less than 1/32" thicker on the treble side than the bass side , could be finish is thicker on one side. I see small things like this. Most would never notice this. I only do because I built my own solid body electrics since 1983.

 

I have a 2004 Seagull S series grand which cost twice as much now days than the EL and it is not perfect either . Perhaps an acoustic costing more than $1,000 might be closer to perfect. I wouldn't know . I was almost tempted to get the EPI 63 J45 instead yet it has a laminated top and is not built any different than the 2009 EPI AJ-100 I have just a shorter scale and better tuners. I imagine the J45 might be a bit better in some areas than the AJ-100 yet it's the same body and shape and top and neck just better tuners and a nicer sunburst finish . I read a few reviews and some like them others not so much .

 

I even listened to you tube videos of the J45 and EL-00 pro and a AJ-220S a Fender CP100 , they all sound great but then they are mic'd and probably setup well , you certainly don't see them pull one out of the shipping box and play it.

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That totally sucks! 79 bucks for an Epi case is a pretty good deal. They say they won't have any till December. I was planning on taking my new EL-00 Pro on a road trip next week. That could be deal breaker! I guess it could travel in its Epi box, but.... [cursing]

I'm sorry about the case . I thought GC would not have any but hoped one near you did.

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Sweetwater site says they are in stock for 94.99. Not as good a deal...but available.

 

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/EL0CS

 

I knew Sweet water had the cases but you do get a price break if you buy the guitar and case together . When I got my EL-00 the case was the same price as MF shows. If I got mine from sweetwater I would have only paid $23 more than MF since MF add's sales tax . I didn't get it from sweetwater because they do this 52 point inspection which may be great but their return is 30 days instead on 45 days and I didn't want someone dressing frets and adjusting things because they ship them too and things can happen where their setup can be out of wack when you get it. They say they set them up and store them in a climate controlled ware house which is fine and well meaning . Still not to put Sweetwater down they get guitars shipped to them just like MF or any online store and if the guitar was dry when they got it then they set them up guitar change during shipping and other reasons so it's all better if one can play a few first hand and decide. I never saw one anywhere since they came out so I didn't have that option.

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I find it interesting how "we" watch a picker doing a demo of a guitar online and add that it's a good mike and the guitar has been setup and "of course," it sounds good.

 

Well... is that really a surprise?

 

Isn't getting our own setup, and adjusting some sort of electronics to get the best sound also rational?

 

Sheesh.

 

I look at the quality of today's Epi guitar and marvel at the quality. If you like the fiberboard Martin shapes, ditto.

 

That doesn't make either one a Gibson of the same type or a Martin of the same type. It does make a potentially wonderful guitar to play and gig with.

 

Does that make a Gibson high-end instrument or a Martin high-end instrument a cheat? No way. They're sufficiently handmade as to be real works of art as well as individually nice instruments.

 

The bottom line, though, is something along the lines of whether one needs a $60,000 fancy car or whether one at a third to half the cost will quite comfortably and reliably get us to work each day - and may do it better in some ways just as each of us can play an Epi set up to our playing styles better than we could play a Gibson set up very differently.

 

I'll add that most of the $100-$150 guitars I've seen around recently are also marvels compared to a price-adjusted equivalent in the '60s.

 

m

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I have an EL-00, plain Jane, no electronics (not a "pro" model)...It's a cool little guitar...has a little bit brighter tone than the Masterbilt 500 things I have. It's not as loud as a Dove or Hummingbird. The music place here has all 3 Epiphone models...I picked up the EL-00 because I think it's a cool "acoustic blues" thing and, at this time, don't really mind that is w/out electronics...it's a great "beater" guitar and has a unique "voice" of it's own..a "blues" voice...I guess...lol. Epiphone makes a nice matching casemsp_smile.gif

 

But, I guess a Gibson EL-00 would be somewhat...better...for lack of a ....better...word

 

 

 

 

word

 

 

 

lol

msp_biggrin.gifmsp_thumbup.gif

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I find it interesting how "we" watch a picker doing a demo of a guitar online and add that it's a good mike and the guitar has been setup and "of course," it sounds good.

 

Well... is that really a surprise?

 

Isn't getting our own setup, and adjusting some sort of electronics to get the best sound also rational?

 

Sheesh.

 

I look at the quality of today's Epi guitar and marvel at the quality. If you like the fiberboard Martin shapes, ditto.

 

That doesn't make either one a Gibson of the same type or a Martin of the same type. It does make a potentially wonderful guitar to play and gig with.

 

Does that make a Gibson high-end instrument or a Martin high-end instrument a cheat? No way. They're sufficiently handmade as to be real works of art as well as individually nice instruments.

 

The bottom line, though, is something along the lines of whether one needs a $60,000 fancy car or whether one at a third to half the cost will quite comfortably and reliably get us to work each day - and may do it better in some ways just as each of us can play an Epi set up to our playing styles better than we could play a Gibson set up very differently.

 

I'll add that most of the $100-$150 guitars I've seen around recently are also marvels compared to a price-adjusted equivalent in the '60s.

 

m

 

I'm not one bit surprised that the guitars on you tube are all setup to perfection , they want to sell them not offer up some product that can't be played well. All guitars need to be setup for the player or just to play well for the average lot no matter what the cost. If I recall back in the 60's most shops setup guitars close enough before hanging them on the wall , today no so much. This was way way before the big stores like guitar center even blew on the scene let alone on-line who knew back then this was in the future. There was however a lot of imported crap even back then that were still close to $100.

 

I think Epi makes a fine guitar for the price one pays. I know in the 60's you could not get as well made of a guitar unless you paid at least $250 or more. In 67 I bought a country gentleman and it cost me close to $900 with the hard shell case.

 

I look at it this way . Sure I can set mine up to play well and I suppose I'm a perfectionist who expects perfect yet for me these days $299 is a lot of money . What really gets me is when people talk about guitars in this price range as beaters or even guitars like the Taylor Mini at $500 as a good beach guitar or beater , something to toss in the truck and bang around without a care in the world. I don't have money to burn like that , I was lucky I was able to scrape and save enough together to even buy the EL-00 . I must add most who title these guitars that cost $300 to $500 beaters are ones who put in their little reviews on-line so for all I know they could be very well blowing smoke . I also would not be the least surprised if in the very near future the only way to buy a guitar or anything one could want will all be on-line. All they need is a call center and a ware house and a shipper. In the mid 80's there were two guitar centers one here and one in Chicago and they were not huge stores , now they are all over the place. I think there are two small shops left here and there used to be 30 .

 

Beater guitar , that just cuts the cake.

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Well, that was a thoroughly unsatisfying experience. I drive cross-town to the Guitar Center. They've redone the place. It's big. There are a zillion electric guitars. Some real nice ones. I'm just looking to play and probably pick up one of these EL-00 Pro's. So the acoustics are over in this side room, which is also good size. It's a lot quieter in here. [biggrin] I check out what they've got on display. Lots of Yamahas and Fenders, along with a variety of other brands. I don't see an EL-00 so I ask the guy behind the desk if he's got an EL-00 Pro. He says, "An EL what?" Uh, yeah, an Epiphone. Long story short, they didn't have one. I was dumbfounded. I guess I could have found that out with a phone call. The trip wasn't a total loss though; they did have a nice IB Texan that I pulled down and fingered a little. That is a man-sized guitar. ;)

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Well, that was a thoroughly unsatisfying experience. I drive cross-town to the Guitar Center. They've redone the place. It's big. There are a zillion electric guitars. Some real nice ones. I'm just looking to play and probably pick up one of these EL-00 Pro's. So the acoustics are over in this side room, which is also good size. It's a lot quieter in here. [biggrin] I check out what they've got on display. Lots of Yamahas and Fenders, along with a variety of other brands. I don't see an EL-00 so I ask the guy behind the desk if he's got an EL-00 Pro. He says, "An EL what?" Uh, yeah, an Epiphone. Long story short, they didn't have one. I was dumbfounded. I guess I could have found that out with a phone call. The trip wasn't a total loss though; they did have a nice IB Texan that I pulled down and fingered a little. That is a man-sized guitar. ;)

 

That's a shame . I'm not surprised though, not one GC or Sam ash had anything like the EL-00 since they came out where I live is the middle of grand old Hollywood CA. The GC here usually has nothing but low end Epiphone's or high end name the brand. They had plenty of the EPI DR100's and the same thing in 12 string and One AJ220S. The only place is Sweetwater , they have both the guitar and case in stock if you get both they will give you a price break other wise they don't exist.

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How did that Texan sound? Did you finally hear what all the hubbub is about?

 

I see you have a EPI J45 . What do you think of it overall? I went with the EL-00 because I already have a AJ-100 and a smaller seagull grand and the EL-00 was right in the middle size wise and sound wise.

 

I have no idea based on the reviews I've seen if the 2014 63 limited J45 is better than the early ones or the same thing.

 

I know it has a laminate top and back and sides so it must be real close to the AJ-100 other than better tuners and a shorter scale.

 

The Texan was a bit out of my price range but at least most places stock them and have the case as well. Odd how that happens.

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Do not buy the new J-45....just don't. The Texan is worth every bit of its $399 street price and then some.

 

If you get an Epiphone J-45, make sure it's a used one built in 2010 or earlier so you get a solid top.

 

Even then, the Texan is a better instrument.

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How did that Texan sound? Did you finally hear what all the hubbub is about?

 

Oh yeah, it is really nice and a good deal for such a great guitar. So the advanced jumbo is a dreadnought variation? Like cat, I wasn't ready to drop quite that much. I guess I'll take my chances and pick up an EL-00 Pro online next week after my road trip to SoCal. I've had good luck online so far.

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Oh yeah, it is really nice and a good deal for such a great guitar. So the advanced jumbo is a dreadnought variation? Like cat, I wasn't ready to drop quite that much. I guess I'll take my chances and pick up an EL-00 Pro online next week after my road trip to SoCal. I've had good luck online so far.

 

The Texan and the AJ are both slope shoulder dreadnoughts.

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I think all the AJ guitar are basically the same size and shape . I do like the look better than a dread. The AJ's would include the j45 and 160E and the texan and and all the other epi variations that are titled AJ .

 

I really do feel EPI should at least specify that they do not cover setups in the warranty rather than let the first time buyer find out they need to spend an extra $60 . They do claim they are QC'ed and setup once they reach the states but after that they can change . So the Quality control stamp really means nothing unless a guitar floats in all twisted out of shape.

 

It really seems like a huge hassle to return a guitar on-line from what I've found . I'll just keep the one EL-00 I have and see if it acclimates then adjust the truss rod just because there is almost zero relief . I just can't deal with a return and then wonder if another new one to be either better or worse.

 

I asked Gibson if they would send me a new saddle so I can raise the action and they had me fill out this on-line form and I have not heard a thing in the two weeks since I asked . When I got the much less expensive AJ-100 in 2009 they sent me one no questions asked.

 

Musicians Friend did say they would help with the costs if I needed to take it to the local authorized repair guy 1/2 mile from me rather than have me ship this one back .

 

How much could a saddle cost that they can't just send me one. I know how to replace one , did it many times . I've adjusted truss rods as well and know better than to force one.

 

It's the time frame that bothers me and what I end up with if I send mine back to MF . I'm told my Gibson to let it settle in for a few weeks by that time my 45 days is up and without the case and just the EPI box how do I deal taking it to a tech and how do I keep it stable . Personally I think it was dry when I got it and I'm doing all I can to keep it stable checking the RH and temp every day three times. Mine was built in 2013 about this time so it's a year old and seems to have held up fine other than the action being a bit low . I keep a record of the temp and RH every day since I got it just so I know what it needs but the bloody case would certainly help a lot.

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I think all the AJ guitar are basically the same size and shape . I do like the look better than a dread. The AJ's would include the j45 and 160E and the texan and and all the other epi variations that are titled AJ .

 

I really do feel EPI should at least specify that they do not cover setups in the warranty rather than let the first time buyer find out they need to spend an extra $60 . They do claim they are QC'ed and setup once they reach the states but after that they can change . So the Quality control stamp really means nothing unless a guitar floats in all twisted out of shape.

 

It really seems like a huge hassle to return a guitar on-line from what I've found . I'll just keep the one EL-00 I have and see if it acclimates then adjust the truss rod just because there is almost zero relief . I just can't deal with a return and then wonder if another new one to be either better or worse.

 

I asked Gibson if they would send me a new saddle so I can raise the action and they had me fill out this on-line form and I have not heard a thing in the two weeks since I asked . When I got the much less expensive AJ-100 in 2009 they sent me one no questions asked.

 

Musicians Friend did say they would help with the costs if I needed to take it to the local authorized repair guy 1/2 mile from me rather than have me ship this one back .

 

How much could a saddle cost that they can't just send me one. I know how to replace one , did it many times . I've adjusted truss rods as well and know better than to force one.

 

It's the time frame that bothers me and what I end up with if I send mine back to MF . I'm told my Gibson to let it settle in for a few weeks by that time my 45 days is up and without the case and just the EPI box how do I deal taking it to a tech and how do I keep it stable . Personally I think it was dry when I got it and I'm doing all I can to keep it stable checking the RH and temp every day three times. Mine was built in 2013 about this time so it's a year old and seems to have held up fine other than the action being a bit low . I keep a record of the temp and RH every day since I got it just so I know what it needs but the bloody case would certainly help a lot.

 

 

I would do the repairs myself. pick up the saddle you want make the guitar your own. When you are done and it sings to you, you will appreciate it that much more

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I think that especially with acoustics, but also electrics, we've the difficulty of climate...

 

I've found that both for remote purchases (strings flat on the frets) and I've seen it at the guitar store that's closest to me when I was in a back room trying a guitar right off the truck and they were unpacking others.

 

If nothing else, it's made me look at how I can learn more about doing my own setups...

 

m

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I think doing your own setup is the way to go, learn how to do it right then do it to your style and liking. Low action is nice but if you are a banger then you get fret buzz, if you have a gentle style then its close to buzzing but not quite. I use light gauge picks and like a low action so I adjust as close to the neck as I can get and through the year adjust accordingly due to the season and weather.

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