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Solid vs Chambered vs Weight Relieved

#21 User is offline   Gary Moore Tribute 

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Posted 22 January 2012 - 04:52 AM

Just out of curiousity I weighed my Guitars

08 Standard (Chambered) 8.4Lb
08 Traditional (Relieved) 9.4Lb
Bonamassa Studio 9.4Lb

I think the metal plate must add at least a 1lb in the pot cavity
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#22 User is offline   JO'C 

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Posted 24 January 2012 - 02:54 PM

View PostGary Moore Tribute, on 22 January 2012 - 04:52 AM, said:

Just out of curiousity I weighed my Guitars

08 Standard (Chambered) 8.4Lb
08 Traditional (Relieved) 9.4Lb
Bonamassa Studio 9.4Lb

I think the metal plate must add at least a 1lb in the pot cavity


I got curious also and took a digital scale home from work last night and weighed some of mine:

97 LP Elegant, chambered 7.4 lb
2004 CS Zebrawood Std, chambered, custom order 8.4 lb. Much fatter neck than the Elegant
99 LP Classic 1960 ltd edition 9.2 lb
2008 Hot Rod Mag 50th anniv R8 9.2 lb
2000 CS Peace Frog LP custom order 10.2 lb

My Semi-hollows

2003 Johnny A. 6.4 lb with a Bigsby
2004 CS-336 7.0 lb
2008 Larry Carlton ES-335 8.6 lb

And I'm happy to report that all of them have that "Gibson" tone. I prefer the lighter ones when I have to stand and play for more than a few songs.

#23 User is offline   rocketman 

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Posted 24 January 2012 - 11:10 PM

I have a chambered and a weight relieved. I did this comparison playing the same lick on each a while ago and most people got it right. There is a definite difference.


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#24 User is offline   AlanH 

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 01:31 PM

I'd say the one you're playing the riffs on first is the chambered model.


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#25 User is offline   rocketman 

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 11:22 PM

Actually it was the second. No big deal. I think the correctly picked one happened about 75%.
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#26 User is offline   FennRx 

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Posted 26 January 2012 - 02:00 AM

chambering is more about feel than sound for me. Chambered Les Pauls are so light, they feel like toys to me. It's all in my head.

#27 User is offline   ovohm 

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 05:46 AM

Hi,

I have a question: if chambered, should it be just one piece on wood on the back though?
Moreover, I have "another" question: I checked a post of a guy who was stating the the initial run 2006/2007 chambered guitars had a different "chambering structure" than the final 2008 released version... Is this a correct info?

Thanks to answer... Is just for my personal understanding.
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#28 User is offline   JO'C 

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 07:27 AM

View Postovohm, on 26 March 2012 - 05:46 AM, said:

Hi,

I have a question: if chambered, should it be just one piece on wood on the back though?
Moreover, I have "another" question: I checked a post of a guy who was stating the the initial run 2006/2007 chambered guitars had a different "chambering structure" than the final 2008 released version... Is this a correct info?

Thanks to answer... Is just for my personal understanding.


I'm not sure I can answer your question fully, but may be able to shed some light. I have a 2004 custom order one-off Zebrawood Les Paul that is based on a Standard but is chambered. The body is a single piece of wood. I've been told that the chambering on mine is less extensive than on the chambered reissues which are really hollowed out like the Johnny A model. I also have a 1997 Les Paul Elegant. Back then they called chambering dynamic sound chambers and this is less chambered than my 2004. It also has a one-piece body. So my take is that the custom shop started tinkering with chambering in the 90's and it was probably an evolution until they finalized in 2008. The chambered reissue website has a good history and pics:

http://www.chambered...org/history.htm

#29 User is offline   Rabs 

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:43 AM

View Postovohm, on 26 March 2012 - 05:46 AM, said:

Hi,

I have a question: if chambered, should it be just one piece on wood on the back though?
Moreover, I have "another" question: I checked a post of a guy who was stating the the initial run 2006/2007 chambered guitars had a different "chambering structure" than the final 2008 released version... Is this a correct info?

Thanks to answer... Is just for my personal understanding.

Chambering and weight relief have nothing to do with a one piece back.. not many come with one piece back, usually more like three pieces (and can be five) but they are usually matched really well and its sometimes hard to even see the joint. The best way to look is look at the end of the guitar on the side. You will more easily see the join where the strap button is positioned...

Some Les Pauls are one piece backs though depending on model like the Paul Kossoff model where it actually states in the description that they will all be one piece backs.

And yes there is a spoke type of chambering that Gibson are now using on the new Standards and have been using for some time on some customs I think. Most guitars pre 2012 will have the old style chambering though..

However I have a chambered and weight relieved guitar and both sound great.

So at the end of the day really you cant judge a guitar on what the process is used but how each individual guitar sounds as even models that are produced on the same line can sound slightly different.

this vid shows some of the process

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#30 User is offline   Rabs 

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 08:51 AM

View Postovohm, on 26 March 2012 - 05:46 AM, said:

Hi,

I have a question: if chambered, should it be just one piece on wood on the back though?
Moreover, I have "another" question: I checked a post of a guy who was stating the the initial run 2006/2007 chambered guitars had a different "chambering structure" than the final 2008 released version... Is this a correct info?

Thanks to answer... Is just for my personal understanding.

Further more.. this is what they look like in an x-ray (not seen one of the new process yet)
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#31 User is offline   RUSHian 

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 09:00 AM

Chambered, Weight Relieved... it's still Rock and Roll to me!
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#32 User is offline   AlanH 

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Posted 27 March 2012 - 09:51 AM

View PostRabs, on 27 March 2012 - 08:43 AM, said:

Chambering and weight relief have nothing to do with a one piece back.. not many come with one piece back, usually more like three pieces (and can be five) but they are usually matched really well and its sometimes hard to even see the joint. The best way to look is look at the end of the guitar on the side. You will more easily see the join where the strap button is positioned...

Some Les Pauls are one piece backs though depending on model like the Paul Kossoff model where it actually states in the description that they will all be one piece backs.

And yes there is a spoke type of chambering that Gibson are now using on the new Standards and have been using for some time on some customs I think. Most guitars pre 2012 will have the old style chambering though..

However I have a chambered and weight relieved guitar and both sound great.

So at the end of the day really you cant judge a guitar on what the process is used but how each individual guitar sounds as even models that are produced on the same line sound slightly different.

this vid shows some of the process

.


Yes.............and just to clarify further that when you say "back," as it's commonly called on a LP, you mean body without the cap (which is about and inch and a half thick of mahogany in itself.) A "back" in the true sense of the word would apply more to an archtop which will have a back and then added sides shaped by heat to match the shape. Right?


Alan

Guitars:
Yamaha SE350; Gibson SG Faded; Epiphone Wildkat; Charvel USA Pro San Dimas Style 1 -2H; Gibson Les Paul Studio '50s Tribute Humbuckers; Ibanez RG 1570 Prestige; Peavey Millenium BXP4 bass

Sold:
Epiphone Les Paul Standard Plus with JB and Jazz; Epiphone Les Paul Studio Deluxe with 490R and 490T; Kramer Pacer Classic 2010

Amps:
Peavey Royal 8 Valve King; Peavey Backstage 50; Ashdown Tourbus 10W bass amp; Zoom H4 recorder/effects

Pedals:
Digitech Bad Monkey (Overdrive); EH Pocket Metal Muff Nano (Distortion); Marshall Regenerator (Modulation); MXR Carbon Copy (Delay); Artec SE-GEQ (EQ/Tuner)

Sound clip: http://soundcloud.co...nhgtr1/alankob2
Video: http://www.youtube.c...h?v=c9rI5yP4v_k
Club: http://forum.gibson....ker-model-club/
Reviews: Wildkat; Pacer Classic
Useful restringing vid I found: http://www.youtube.c...B&v=Oclc4MHWbzw

.......

#33 User is offline   Nic LP 

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Posted 04 April 2012 - 06:41 PM

C'mom guys : 80% of the tone of any guitar is about the pickups, the rest is called finger tips, wood, strings, etc...

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#34 User is offline   JoeM17 

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:25 PM

It's a personal choice. I never would have purchased a LP because of the weight. I was buying Gretsch G6120's and i have some vintage SG's. Since the LP is chambered and a great deal lighter I now have 3 of them. I love the the guitar and they feel and sound just the way I like. I own many guitars but the LP is a Rock legend. I already know what number 4 is going to be, I have to have one solid body LP. Hey, it's my bucket list. Next thing I'm gonna find Bigfoot.
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#35 User is offline   Rabs 

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Posted 07 April 2012 - 09:48 AM

View PostJoeM17, on 06 April 2012 - 11:25 PM, said:

It's a personal choice. I never would have purchased a LP because of the weight. I was buying Gretsch G6120's and i have some vintage SG's. Since the LP is chambered and a great deal lighter I now have 3 of them. I love the the guitar and they feel and sound just the way I like. I own many guitars but the LP is a Rock legend. I already know what number 4 is going to be, I have to have one solid body LP. Hey, it's my bucket list. Next thing I'm gonna find Bigfoot.

Not that id want to pay that much but according to the specs the new Paul Kossoff LPs are solid bodies
http://www2.gibson.c...l-Standard.aspx

"Like great 'Bursts of the late '50s, it has an elegantly figured two-piece carved maple top married to a solid, one-piece, lightweight mahogany body." now the fact it says lightweight kind of contradicts itself.. so who knows :P
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#36 User is offline   Nic LP 

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Posted 07 April 2012 - 09:59 AM

View Postrocketman, on 24 January 2012 - 11:10 PM, said:

I have a chambered and a weight relieved. I did this comparison playing the same lick on each a while ago and most people got it right. There is a definite difference.




I think the only fair comparison is with two guitars with the very same pick ups configuration. Is it the cas here ?

Thanks !
===================================================

'93 Gibson Les Paul Standard vintage sunburst
'09 Gibson Les Paul Standard desert burst
Carvin Bolt Plus
-----
Guild Jumbo acoustic
-----
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#37 User is offline   Nic LP 

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Posted 07 April 2012 - 10:02 AM

View PostJoeM17, on 06 April 2012 - 11:25 PM, said:

It's a personal choice. I never would have purchased a LP because of the weight. I was buying Gretsch G6120's and i have some vintage SG's. Since the LP is chambered and a great deal lighter I now have 3 of them. I love the the guitar and they feel and sound just the way I like. I own many guitars but the LP is a Rock legend. I already know what number 4 is going to be, I have to have one solid body LP. Hey, it's my bucket list. Next thing I'm gonna find Bigfoot.


Can I suggest a Traditional or the new Standard. Also, the Classic Plus is great and not too expensive. [thumbup]
===================================================

'93 Gibson Les Paul Standard vintage sunburst
'09 Gibson Les Paul Standard desert burst
Carvin Bolt Plus
-----
Guild Jumbo acoustic
-----
Marshall JVM210H + 1936 2x12'' cab
Line 6 Spider III amplifier

#38 User is offline   Rabs 

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Posted 07 April 2012 - 10:11 AM

View PostNic LP, on 07 April 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

I think the only fair comparison is with two guitars with the very same pick ups configuration. Is it the cas here ?

Thanks !

Im not sure the point is that they sound slightly different.. sometimes two guitars of the same model and make can sound slightly different due to the way they are set up (pickup height and intonation etc)..

Can a person really say one is better than the other or just that they may prefer the sound of one to the other in which case its not the chambering/weight relief/solid body that makes the difference, just if you like the sound of an individual guitar which is why its always best when looking to try as many as possible.

I was going to get a honeyburst when i bought my 60s Tribute but decided to try a few.. After trying about six of them in different colours I tried a Goldtop version which I hadnt even really thought about and straight away I was hooked... And these were all guitars from the same run, the Goldtop just had something that the others didnt and I cant even really explain it. Like you get some new cars that break down in a few months and some that live forever, its just one of those things. And guitars by their nature are all different as the section of wood and the desnsity of each indivisual piece can make a difference in sound and the fact that each guitar is hand finished also makes each one unique (even if every so slightly).
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#39 User is offline   Bender 4 Life 

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:16 AM

View PostBender 4 Life, on 22 January 2012 - 04:46 AM, said:

my 30th Ann. Plaintop built in 8/88 is 14.1 lbs. and has a 1 pc body.

everyone that handles it says they've never felt one heavier.


i've recently built a guitar that's in direct conflict w/what I THOUGHT I knew about wood/wt/sustain/ring-out.

i scored a "budget" quilt-tele body, poly covered 3 pc paulowana(sp?) with 1/4" quilt top, weighs about 2.5 lbs.....put a Tele-slim rock maple neck on it(had to "tap" neck into pocket [thumbup] ) and ended up w/a final wt of just over 7 lbs.
This guitar rings out & sustains better than anything I own!!!

i'm really scratching m'head now, because i've not only found THIS anomaly, but also my Mexi-Strat rings & sustains better than my American Deluxe :unsure: ......
in general my "budget" guitars (epis/agiles/non US Fenders/home builds) sound as good as my "big-namers".
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#40 User is offline   pippy. Pippy pippy. 

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 04:51 AM

View PostNic LP, on 07 April 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

I think the only fair comparison is with two guitars with the very same pick ups configuration. Is it the cas here ?

I've posted a pair of clips with my R9 and my R0 back to back. Both are absolutely identical spec-wise and yet they sound very different.

There's obviously something else going on to create 'the tone' than just electronics.

P.

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