bluezguy Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 10 Decades long performer here who bought into the hype about lightweight aluminum stop bars. I really coulda used the money for something else My 2003 LP Standard sounds exactly the same as it did with the stock Zamick. I firmly believe people sometimes really want to hear a difference that doesn't exist when money has been spent. Before you buy one of these exaggerated claim pieces called a 'lightweight aluminum stop tail piece' for your beloved Les Paul, record your stock one, then, with the same strings and your new piece of joy attached, record again. One thing for sure .. they sure are light ... I'll do this in a week or so on my next string change and will post results here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuitarBuilder Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I think it's counter-intuitive that a light-weight stop tail would sound better. The technically savvy know that the more mass and rigidity is present in the guitar, the better the string is able to vibrate, hence giving good sustain and clarity. Tone is indeed affected by those materials that absorb string vibration, but I doubt that the tail piece plays a large role there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brantobrien Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Funny that you posted this, I've been looking into replacing my abr1 (starting to get the dreaded sag in the middle) and it in the threads on other sites I've been reading there was a ton of people talking about aluminum stop tails as well. I figured maybe I'd give one a shot, but after your post, I think I'll pass. It did seem counter intuitive to me, but sometimes what doesn't make logical sense makes musical sense. Thanks again for the post, sorry it didn't work out for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AXE® Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 10 decades??? Your deaf by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angellus Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 i changed all mine over, there is a subtle difference, but to really get a different sound with the clarity and tone that i like, i changed the nashville to a callaham abr-1 steel billet (i plug the holes with maple and re-drill) locking lightweight aluminium stop bar and historic 50's wiring with oil in paper and quality pots, i measure and match the pot values with regards to tolerances and choice either a 300k or 500k for the neck pickup to get the tone i prefer i fixed a number of problems on an SG doing this and a unique sounding les paul. what works for some may not be what works for all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyBillyBob1 Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Is this aluminum stop bar locking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angellus Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 the stop bar http://www.tokaiguitar.de/xtcommerce/index.php?cat=c7_Tailpiece.html and the locking kit http://www.tokaiguitar.de/xtcommerce/index.php?cat=c9_-Tone-Lock--Kits.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluezguy Posted August 25, 2012 Author Share Posted August 25, 2012 10 decades??? Your deaf by now. As in - a very long time .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGgypsyboy Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I'll just stick to the heavy standard issued tail piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaicho8888 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 10 Decades long performer here who bought into the hype about lightweight aluminum stop bars. I really coulda used the money for something else My 2003 LP Standard sounds exactly the same as it did with the stock Zamick. I firmly believe people sometimes really want to hear a difference that doesn't exist when money has been spent. Before you buy one of these exaggerated claim pieces called a 'lightweight aluminum stop tail piece' for your beloved Les Paul, record your stock one, then, with the same strings and your new piece of joy attached, record again. One thing for sure .. they sure are light ... I'll do this in a week or so on my next string change and will post results here. I agree with your assessment...With the amp crank up...who can tell? Marketing is a specialty business...he he he I know! Perhaps one spends money thinking it will make you play better. After spending your hard earned money; you start hearing virtual improvements. LOL... Just practice, practice, and more practice! It's priceless and fun! I just saw a youtube video "Capt'n and Chappers" do a comparison test on Gibson and Ephihone Les Pauls. The Ephihone had a super long sustain compared to the expensive Gibson LPs. They both were surprised...rather lenthy but great video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angellus Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I agree with your assessment...With the amp crank up...who can tell? Marketing is a specialty business...he he he I know! Perhaps one spends money thinking it will make you play better. After spending your hard earned money; you start hearing virtual improvements. LOL... Just practice, practice, and more practice! It's priceless and fun! I just saw a youtube video "Capt'n and Chappers" do a comparison test on Gibson and Ephihone Les Pauls. The Ephihone had a super long sustain compared to the expensive Gibson LPs. They both were surprised...rather lenthy but great video. 'In your opinion' your statement including the epiphone vs gibson comment show me your lacking some experience, in my opinion. If we were all penny pinchers that never tried to experiement with ideas both new and old to find what works for us then we would all sound and be the same, again in my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluezguy Posted August 29, 2012 Author Share Posted August 29, 2012 'In your opinion' your statement including the epiphone vs gibson comment show me your lacking some experience, in my opinion. If we were all penny pinchers that never tried to experiement with ideas both new and old to find what works for us then we would all sound and be the same, again in my opinion I think the 'lacking some experience' shows in your own posting here. Get 10 Les Paul Standards off the assembly line, made the same day, same components etc. Ad 10 individual players with the same amp and ALL 10 will sound different. Take it for what it's worth to ya ... real players DO understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyBillyBob1 Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I think the 'lacking some experience' shows in your own posting here. Get 10 Les Paul Standards off the assembly line, made the same day, same components etc. Ad 10 individual players with the same amp and ALL 10 will sound different. Take it for what it's worth to ya ... real players DO understand. Now now boys, let's play nice. My gut tells me that it would not make a difference in sound at all but you never know. If you're curious than give it a try. As long as you're not drilling any holes in the body what harm can it do? Worst thing you are out 30 to 40 bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brantobrien Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I love the process of tinkering around with hardware, strings, etc and think that all of that is part of what keeps me (and others) inspired to play and pursue the art of music. Buy a stop tail, switch from nashville to abr1, put a bigsby on, SHOOT (if you are REALLY brave) have someone put in a third pickup (worked for Frampton), but never stop playing, practicing, and finding the tone and connection with the art that is in you. The good news for the OP, is that he can just pull it off, sell it on the bay, and be back to where he started ready to try the next thing that moves him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaicho8888 Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 'In your opinion' your statement including the epiphone vs gibson comment show me your lacking some experience, in my opinion. If we were all penny pinchers that never tried to experiement with ideas both new and old to find what works for us then we would all sound and be the same, again in my opinion Hey, by all means, have fun and please spend all the money experimenting! Our economy (and my companies) needs it. That's why we have great marketing for consumers who do not know what they need. Look at all the merchandising on pickup alone! Obviously, money is to be made! Strange that the majority is striving for that "vintage" PAF. Original PAF's were built with no consistency. Ironically in the early sixties, hardly anybody cared or bought pickups. One of the larger store at that time in San Francisco stocked only few pickups for replacements. You buy a stock guitar and learned how to use it. My 45+ year old guitars are still sought after as premium pieces. I always wondered why the more expensive new guitars are specified (VOS)to be like the "oldies" ... are musicians traditionalist or is it "Veblen goods" marketing? Here's the link to Epiphone Vs Gibson...rather humorous test on who's got the longest sustain (about 11 min. in the video) I can use the axe/rigs of Joe Bonamassa, and guess what... I still sound like me! No wonder I'm "lacking some experience" in being a well know rock star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angellus Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 thats what i found, the VOS R8's 7's and 9's are all premium models with aluminum stop bars ABR-1's among other differences (some have longer neck tennons) from what I have played and worked on the original designs sound right to my ears, however gibsons premium in my opinion are too high for the VOS R8 etc, most of the 'extra's' can be completed on a modern model for a fraction of the cost I agree experiement if you can, i made some mistakes in purchases (TP6!!!) but I found some great pieces of hardware that have changed the tone and response of my guitars and found hardware that is inferior IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angellus Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I think the 'lacking some experience' shows in your own posting here. Get 10 Les Paul Standards off the assembly line, made the same day, same components etc. Ad 10 individual players with the same amp and ALL 10 will sound different. Take it for what it's worth to ya ... real players DO understand. your statement above proves your stupid and i am not about to educate in idiot, lets start off by stating, DONT START A THREAD ASKING FOR OPINIONS AND GET HOSTILE WHEN PEOPLE DONT KISS YOUR OPINIONS A $ $ you missed my point with my first post but somehow managed to stumble over and regurgitate what I was getting at. no two guitars sound the same! no no matter how old you are, arrogant, narrow minded, self opinionated and dismissive of others you will always look like an idiot to others, do some reading and come back when you have more of an idea what you are talking about and I can have a constructive conversation with a grown adult rather than an old know it all fool. your response is not needed however somehow I dont think you will be able to control yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmj5150 Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Aluminum Tailpiece you can FEEL the difference in weight not hear it..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike From Canada Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 I've added aluminum tailpieces to both my Les Pauls. The primary reason for me is to cut the weight of the guitar. I do think they make a slight sound difference, but that isn't the primary concern. It's about the weight. In terms of the sound, the added weight of the stock tailpiece is like pushing on the top of the guitar with your finger. It stops the vibration of the top a bit. I found the sound was a bit more compressed with the stock tailpiece than with the light weight one. But, the effect is minor. All the best, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 I'm not going to get sucked into an unresolveable argument but... ...If you're curious than give it a try.......Worst thing you are out 30 to 40 bucks... The Gibson Historic Alu T-P over here works out as being a slightly less reasonable $160....... P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowboyBillyBob1 Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 I'm not going to get sucked into an unresolveable argument but... The Gibson Historic Alu T-P over here works out as being a slightly less reasonable $160....... P. Thank you. I stand corrected here it is at GC in Chrome or Nickle for $100 USD. Maybe get 10 to 15% off if you can work the salesguy. Aluminum Stop Bar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 Thank you. I stand corrected here it is at GC in Chrome or Nickle for $100 USD. Maybe get 10 to 15% off if you can work the salesguy. Aluminum Stop Bar Thanks for that, CowboyBillyBob. Things Stateside are clearly healthier than over this side of the Pond...lol! There are so few on sale here in the UK that even on ebay the only ones I could find offered were the official Gibson Historic parts. We get fleeced on imports in any case so I don't think I'll be trying one anytime soon! I know there are other manufacturers, as well as the TonePros in your link, who offer excellent substitutes but a Google search failed to turn up any dealerships in the UK. Even typing in the manufacturers' names failed to turn up any treats. Thinking about it; I have a couple of Historics which probably have alu stop bars but I'm not really fascinated enough to swap them for the steel ones from my other LPs. But, then again, perhaps I should do a test next time I change strings just so "...I know of which I speak" ! ! ! Regards, P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old mark Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 In the 1970's, the theory was that HEAVIER tailpieces and nuts-made of bell brass-would give a clear tone and longer sustain. You can still occasionally find a '70's guitar in someone's closet that has these features. I doubt the heavy brass theory was any more valid than the light aluminum theory, but, hey, aftermarket parts makers have to live, too...it is all SALESMANSHIP!!!. Back in the very old days, when Seth Lover first designed the humbucker, he made the first few without the screw adjustable pole pieces, as he KNEW they served no real purpose...Ted McCarty, of Gibson, told Lover that he wanted adjustable pole pieces in the new design...because the older DeArmond pickups had them, as did the P90's, and people would think they were being cheated if their latest and greatest pickup did not have them. They all have them. They serve no actual purpose, but people-myself included - have spent time adjusting them trying to get a "perfect sound"...I think there might be some difference noted in various height adjustments of the pole pieces if you used some sort of electrical meter or scope, but as far as sound, I really have my doubts....But they SELL!!! The internet was/is the greatest sales tool ever invented, and we do all the selling to ourselves. mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted September 27, 2012 Share Posted September 27, 2012 ...I think there might be some difference noted in various height adjustments of the pole pieces if you used some sort of electrical meter or scope, but as far as sound, I really have my doubts.... Agreed. As someone here once said; "Especially once the drummer kicks in..." I've been to places where the acoustics have been so awful it's been difficult to tell a Les Paul from a Strat, never mind whether the LP has a 'Lightweight Aluminium Stop Tail Piece' fitted... P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black13 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 your statement above proves your stupid and i am not about to educate in idiot . . . "Your statement above proves *YOU'RE* stupid and I am not about to educate *an* idiot." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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