stevendv

Thanks for all the remarks and observations about your own experiences with the J-185, they do help to establish a context to think about the guitar, and sorry to be silent for so long, but I still haven't had a chance to play the J-185 in question (or any other one). The trade option fell through when the J-185's owner realized, understandably enough, that to trade any of the 3 nice guitars he was trying to sell would defeat his original aim of having 3 less guitars, rather than only 2 less and one different one. As long as it was a trade, he was willing to meet 1/2 way between where we live, but once he decided he was going to stick with his original idea of getting rid of those 3 guitars my 2.5 non-stop train ride became more than a 5 hour one, with train changes thrown in. And in the middle of preparing for an overseas move this 11 or 12 hour round-trip didn't seem like something I had time for, or something I should even be thinking about at this point. So I'm trying to put the J-185 out of my mind until I can actually, really, practically look into it--when we get to North America. And in the meantime I'm still happy with my granadillo J-45, so it's not exactly a hardship. I'm intrigued by maple, having had no experience with it, only what I've read about (and clips I've listened to of) the J-185, the J-200... But has anyone tried one of the Custom Shop J-45 maple b/s guitars (I saw one listed in a wine red color)? Granadillo is as far from the typical J-45 specs as I'd like to go myself, but I was wondering if anyone had tried one. Thanks again for your remarks.

Thanks very much for your replies: at least of couple people mention the comfort of the J-185's body shape and that too is a big reason I'm interested in and really look forward to trying it out. And the bass note clarity, and the recognizably Gibson-esque sound but with additional elements of precision, and the distinct characteristics of maple, all those things you guys mentioned... I love Lucinda Williams's cover of "Return of the Grievous Angel," and like to do my own much inferior version of it, and always associate it (like certain other songs) with a J-45, but those songs can all be changed a bit, and it would be interesting to see what comes of doing it. And it's just for my own and my wife's entertainment anyway, it's not like there are gigs on the line here. Thanks again for your replies. Someone contacted me about a trade of my J-45 for a 2103 Martin D-42 with me making up the difference in value we agree upon with cash. D-42s are beautiful guitars, but they are dreadnought beasts which, among other things, would defeat the whole purpose of moving from a slope dread to the J-185 form.

I've had and enjoyed playing my Gibson Custom Shop J-45 Granadillo (2016, with the rosewood fingerboard & ebony headstock instead of the granadillo board and headstock of 2015) since I bought it new 4 years ago. But there's the possibility of what would be a straight up trade for a 2015 Gibson Custom Shop J-185 True Vintage Red Spruce that's got me intrigued--at least intrigued enough to think about making the train trip to try it out (I've lived in Italy for over a decade but will be moving back to North America in July). The maple back and sides and Red Spruce would be a big change from the sitka and granadillo of my J-45, to say nothing of the body shape and its effects. I strum, fingerpick and flatpick--things like the Stones's "Love in Vain" and "Sweet Virginia," REM's "Don't Go Back to Rockville," Dylan, etc, and fingerpick things like Townes Van Zandt's version of "Dead Flowers," Beck's "Lost Cause," Dylan's "Don't Think Twice," plus some Italian songs by Fabrizio de Andre, etc. I look (and listen to) my J-45 and tell myself I've got all this stuff covered with this guitar and more. Then think about the different qualities of the J-185 and wonder if maybe it's worth a try. Those of you who have experience with the J-185 True Vintage Red Spruce have any thoughts on this? Any would be appreciated. I also think that when I do return to North America this summer if the J-185 True Vintage Red Spruce doesn't turn out to work for me I could probably sell it for more than I could sell my J-45 Granadillo for. Does this seems true to you as well? (Reverb prices searches on this question have resulted in some extremely dubious results. Based upon them you'd think it wasn't much trouble to find a mint Guild F-512 for around $2,500 which I know is not the case.)

I suspect our readings of Animal Farm might differ, too, and that's just fine. No comment on the hens.... I foolishly took the bait, I admit it, but if you look at the first comments that yanked this thread out of its original path it was the same old comments that are made every time Springsteen is mentioned in any thread in any context. I should have just let them go, I know that.

Writes the guy whose broad-minded light-hearted contribution to the discussion was that musicians should just "SHUT UP AND SING"... It's also "just life" that some musicians and other entertainers talk about politics, or even sing about them. While some just sing about themes that grate on some people as being from an "implicitly political" angle. I don't see that anyone commenting on this thread from any perspective has been "running and hiding" or finds it impossible to imagine that not everyone agrees with them. Just the opposite, I'd say. Given the the fact this thread started out being about a double pick guard J-200 one might wonder why anyone felt compelled at any point to say anything at all about whether or not they listen to Springsteen, as that wasn't even vaguely related to the original post. (It's a little like someone declaring during a conversation about a recent Yankees or Manchester United game that "I haven't followed that team since Dererk Jeter or Cristiano Ronaldo left." Okay, and your point is..? It obviously has nothing to do with the game--no more than the comments about not listening to Springsteen have to do with the original subject of this post.) But, hell, now the forum is fillin' up with "pigs" and "hens" and others of below "average intelligence": commenters who have "earned" these labels by not writing about what they should in the way they should, according to those folks labeling them as such. Irony really is absent from this forum, ain't it?

Okay, to return closer to the original post: double pick guards: some people love the way they look, some hate it; some think they ruin tone/sound, some don't worry about it (or at least not apart from each specific guitar). But aside from lefties (guitarists, not political parties) who in a world of so many guitars for right-handers might be happy to see an easy conversion come their way, does anyone actually find the double pick guard useful? Do you have a double pick guard guitar that's been protected from marks you make on your other guitars? Or do you have a guitar that you wish would have had un upper pick guard on it because of the way you (or its previous owner) played it? I can imagine they might be useful, but really have no idea from personal experience, so I'm wondering if some people out there do.

Honestly, I wasn't thinking specifically of your post when I wrote that part, though because I started off quoting your post I'd see how you'd think that. I'm sorry about that. The acid reflux was more generally about the comments sections of, say Youtube, and newspapers, where people just let 'em rip (even if the connection to the subject is tenuous). Didn't actually see much bile in your comment, and the only question I'd have had about it specifically was when did Babs, the cast of Hamilton and Pence start playing Gibsons? If that were true, whatever else one might say about them at least they have good taste in guitars. I agree with your main point, JC. I've watched the video in which Yusef said those things and have never been able to decide exactly one way or the other, though I'm also certain that your description of what the British press did with it is accurate. Given the high tension at that moment and the fact that a death sentence had been put upon Rushdie, to "joke" in the way Yusef claims he was joking (though it didn't look like "dry British humor" to me) is tone deaf, at the very least. So I can understand why Rushdie would still hold it against him, as what I've read of Yusef's "apologies" or accounts of the incident tend suggest that he, Yusef, was the victim of the incident. I don't know. In any case, I certainly know I agree with your main points. I agree with this, and have thought this even more since I've learned to play and sing (badly and very badly, respectively) some of his songs. They're great. The only issue I've ever had with Bruce is just a matter of personal musical taste: to me, most of his stuff seems overproduced; the material is strong enough, and his own talent, that sometimes the production strikes me as overkill. So I'm one of those people whose favorite album of his is Nebraska. But that kind of opinion says nothing about the artist, and everything about what appeals to the particular listener (though we sometimes like to act as though it's all the artist's fault). For this reason I'll often enough like covers of Springsteen's songs a bit more than the album versions of them--which means I should listen to yours! You seem to be one of those extraordinarily literal readers of which certain countries seem to produce so many, but I can assure you I didn't believe you were *actually* proposing a law to that effect (although in certain US state legislatures I'm sure a "Shut Up And Sing" bill would go pretty far, and even national politicians have suggested laws that would curtail free speech). But as you live in America (which I didn't know before you told me, as there are people from around the world on this blog, and I'm an American with dual-citizenship living in Europe), then I'm sure we're in agreement on issues of free speech, which is not just an American ideal (it pre-dates America) but a fundamental principle of democracies in all parts of the world. I find it ironic that you believed *your* rights to free speech to be threatened by my mere disagreement with your original "SHUT UP AND SING" post--even as you suggested an opinion that artists (or *certain* ones, as dhanners points out) should keep their mouths shut when not performing. But it's the kind of irony that's lost on literal readers. (Who seem inevitably to read almost everything as another instance of themselves being victimized.)

Luckily for you there are some countries in the world where this "policy" of yours is actually law--and there's generally no line for citizenship to them if you'd like to apply. Unluckily for the rest of us, a dismaying number of Western politicians are starting to express admiration for such blatantly authoritarian, anti-democracy regimes. All of us have very selective memories about what we consider offensive statements by performers. As a lurker here for years I've noticed that a mention of someone like Springsteen is sure to evoke indignant responses from a predictable group of commenters, whereas nothing is ever said when someone gushes about the talent or music of Cat Stevens, though the latter is actually on record as supporting the death of a writer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat_Stevens'_comments_about_Salman_Rushdie. I don't mention this in an attempt to stir up anti-Muslim sentiment, or outrage Cat Stevens/Yusef Islam/Yusef fans, but simply because I think it's been shown to be rather dangerous to try to define what is "appropriate" for an artist to express, regardless of whatever the ideology motivating it may be. Too many artists have actually been killed for saying what they think, in their work or outside it--but maybe this is on my mind as I just interviewed the daughter of one last week, Ken Saro-Wiwa, who was executed with 8 others after a sham trial by a right-wing military government working closely with Shell oil. His murder was no less appalling because it was committed on behalf of corporate/capitalistic interests than if it had been done for the sake of religious or communist ones. Of course no one is calling for the official "silencing" of anyone in this forum, I just find it interesting to see the indignation that inevitably flares up at the slightest mention of certain performers but not others. But I guess that's what social media is largely for: indignation--coming up irresistibly, like acid reflux belches. Though in this case, I'm not sure why it wasn't just focused on those double pick guards and how they MAY--or may NOT--be ruining that beautiful guitar's tone!