D28boy Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Hi I have an '87 Les Paul which is my No1 guitar. The Bridge pick-up is really quite harsh and the neck pick up is really creamy and smooth.The only "problem" I have with the neck pick up though is that it seems to be muddy and distorted (not in a good way) on the E & A strings ...even on a single note and overdriven chords sounds pretty naff. I've tried moving the poles up & down with no real improvements. Can anyone suggest what if anything could improve the sound or is this typical of the Les Paul as its my first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Hi I have an '87 Les Paul which is my No1 guitar. The Bridge pick-up is really quite harsh and the neck pick up is really creamy and smooth.The only "problem" I have with the neck pick up though is that it seems to be muddy and distorted (not in a good way) on the E & A strings ...even on a single note and overdriven chords sounds pretty naff. I've tried moving the poles up & down with no real improvements. Can anyone suggest what if anything could improve the sound or is this typical of the Les Paul as its my first. Lowering the whole pickup quite a lot will often work wonders. Lowering the other pup can help too because of the magnetic pull on the strings. The other thing you can do is lower the value of the cap on that pup. Try a 0.015uf or 0.01uf. I've even seen 0.001uf caps in use as a pup filter cap. Also, check the value of the volume pot, it should be 500k ohms but these can vary, if it's below about 450 try a 50 ohm resistor in line to try before you buy a new pot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigzag Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 I agree about lowering the pickup height. But, I don't know of any Gibson humbucker that doesn't sound muddy on the neck. Gibson pickup comparison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D28boy Posted August 28, 2013 Author Share Posted August 28, 2013 I agree about lowering the pickup height. But, I don't know of any Gibson humbucker that doesn't sound muddy on the neck. Gibson pickup comparison Thanx ZZ that's a very helpful comparison. Gibson advised my pups were "original Humbuckers" so I'm guessing the 490's would be similar...I suppose they could be Shaws. I love the neck pup for lead but I guess I'll need to keep to the top E to D. But will try lowering on the bass side a little to see what that does though it's definitely not so close as to get any magnetic attraction/distortion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D28boy Posted August 28, 2013 Author Share Posted August 28, 2013 Lowering the whole pickup quite a lot will often work wonders. Lowering the other pup can help too because of the magnetic pull on the strings. The other thing you can do is lower the value of the cap on that pup. Try a 0.015uf or 0.01uf. I've even seen 0.001uf caps in use as a pup filter cap. Also, check the value of the volume pot, it should be 500k ohms but these can vary, if it's below about 450 try a 50 ohm resistor in line to try before you buy a new pot. Thanx will try lowering the pup but I'm afraid all the rest of your advice has sailed right over my head Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Thanx will try lowering the pup but I'm afraid all the rest of your advice has sailed right over my head Each pair of volume/tone pots is connected by a capacitor, almost certainly 0.022uf. Replacing it with a lower value cap will allow more treble through. The signal from the pickup is connected to ground, the volume pot causes a resistance between the signal and the ground, forcing some of it out of the output. When the volume is at zero all of the signal is dumped to ground and nothing is heard. When the volume pot is at 10 some of the signal is still going to ground. You'll have noticed that the volume pot effects the tone. Increasing the resistance of the pot is like turning the guitar up to 11, the effect on tone is the reverse of turning your volume down, it will brighten it. Adding a resistor, inline with the pot will allow you to hear the effect without replacing the pot, and can be done without removing anything from the guitar but this can only be used as a temporary measure because, with a resistor inline you won't be able to turn down to zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon S. Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Each pair of volume/tone pots is connected by a capacitor, almost certainly 0.022uf. Replacing it with a lower value cap will allow more treble through. The signal from the pickup is connected to ground, the volume pot causes a resistance between the signal and the ground, forcing some of it out of the output. When the volume is at zero all of the signal is dumped to ground and nothing is heard. When the volume pot is at 10 some of the signal is still going to ground. You'll have noticed that the volume pot effects the tone. Increasing the resistance of the pot is like turning the guitar up to 11, the effect on tone is the reverse of turning your volume down, it will brighten it. Adding a resistor, inline with the pot will allow you to hear the effect without replacing the pot, and can be done without removing anything from the guitar but this can only be used as a temporary measure because, with a resistor inline you won't be able to turn down to zero. Very good info!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender 4 Life Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 lighter guage e&a strings might also help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Very good info!! Why thank you, Jon. I've known my electronics for a long time but only in the last few years has the tonal side of electronics begun to click with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender 4 Life Posted August 30, 2013 Share Posted August 30, 2013 That's what I did to on both my 57 Classic neck pickups in both Les Pauls. I put about 3/8 inch or 1/2 from the strings and suddenly it had that wonderful classic kazoo sound when overdriven your kazoo needs a screen....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D28boy Posted September 13, 2013 Author Share Posted September 13, 2013 Each pair of volume/tone pots is connected by a capacitor, almost certainly 0.022uf. Replacing it with a lower value cap will allow more treble through. The signal from the pickup is connected to ground, the volume pot causes a resistance between the signal and the ground, forcing some of it out of the output. When the volume is at zero all of the signal is dumped to ground and nothing is heard. When the volume pot is at 10 some of the signal is still going to ground. You'll have noticed that the volume pot effects the tone. Increasing the resistance of the pot is like turning the guitar up to 11, the effect on tone is the reverse of turning your volume down, it will brighten it. Adding a resistor, inline with the pot will allow you to hear the effect without replacing the pot, and can be done without removing anything from the guitar but this can only be used as a temporary measure because, with a resistor inline you won't be able to turn down to zero. Just had the guitar looked at and I'm advised that the Volume pots are the 300 version and apparently the tone are 100 which read at about 85 ohms. However the guy has told me that he doesn't think that the pup is unusually wooly anyway. May look to replace later as although the tone is nice I need treble on 10 to achieve it and there's nowhere to go from there. Guess that's why I always think it sounds so bassy when I plug into anybody elses amp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted September 13, 2013 Share Posted September 13, 2013 Just had the guitar looked at and I'm advised that the Volume pots are the 300 version and apparently the tone are 100 which read at about 85 ohms. However the guy has told me that he doesn't think that the pup is unusually wooly anyway. May look to replace later as although the tone is nice I need treble on 10 to achieve it and there's nowhere to go from there. Guess that's why I always think it sounds so bassy when I plug into anybody elses amp. The best thing is to swap the 100 kOhms tone pots with 500 kOhms ones, and to leave everything else stock. The pots of my 1978 SG Std were 300 kOhms linear for volume and 100 kOhms audio taper for tone. The 100 kOhms tone pots load both resonance and treble down. I never understood why Gibson did that. The so dimensioned tone pots cranked up to ten act as audio tapered 500 kOhms ones when tweaked down to about four! My SG's neck pickup was muddy, too until I swapped the tone pots with 500 kOhms audio taper ones. The 300 kOhms linear volume pots are OK since you lose less highs when turning down a bit compared to the 500 kOhm types. All my Gibsons with "normal" pots do have 300 kOhms lin for each volume pot whereas those with push/pull volume pots have 500 kOhms audio taper. I have to put up with the fact that 300 kOhms with push/pull switches are unavailable, and I would want 250 kOhms as for Fenders in conjunction with no-load tone pots only. Those, however, aren't feasible with push/pull switches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D28boy Posted September 13, 2013 Author Share Posted September 13, 2013 The best thing is to swap the 100 kOhms tone pots with 500 kOhms ones, and to leave everything else stock. cheers capmaster I'll look at doing that then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaysEpiphone Posted September 14, 2013 Share Posted September 14, 2013 My Iby has a center pick-up that is quite dirty as I ordered it extra over-wound, it sounded "Honky", a friend of mine said I should lower just the top adjustment screw on it. It does help with "mud" to do this but a cap change may work better if you don't have a lot of EQ on your amp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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