MrBlimp

OK, so here’s my follow-up to: I sent the following email: -----Original Message----- From: NAME WITHHELD TO PROTECT THE INNOCENT Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 10:49 PM To: Customer Service Subject: Looking for validation on my Epiphone Dear Gibson Service Representative, I just read the "Beware Web Sites That Incorrectly Identify Fakes as Real Gibson & Epiphone Guitars" article on the Lifestyles section of the Gibson site in which Ric Olsen, the Gibson Manager of Brand Protection stated that "“There are many entities that claim to be experts on the serial numbers of Gibson and Epiphone guitars, but the only advisable validation method is to contact our Gibson Customer Service department. Send it to us. It is that easy." So here I am. I purchased a used Epiphone Les Paul Standard within the past year from a private seller here on Long Island, NY. The Serial Number is: E E 0 5 1 0 6 3 1 7 Everything looks legitimate. All the inlays, logos, labels, etc . . So like Olsen says: Send it to us. It is that easy. I just did. And received the following response: -----Original Message----- From: "Customer Service" [Customer.Relations@gibson.com] Date: 12/15/2009 01:34 AM To: NAME WITHHELD TO PROTECT THE INNOCENT Subject: RE: Looking for validation on my Epiphone Hi, Thanks for the email. The serial number is consistent with an Epiphone Les Paul Standard in Ebony finish, made in China in October of 2005. Thanks again!! Gibson Customer Service 1-800-4GIBSON service@gibson.com • Sign up now to receive the latest news from Gibson http://www.gibson.com/emalesignup.aspx • AOL Instant Messenger, Yahoo! Messenger, & MSN Messenger users can IM Gibson Customer Service at customer.service1@gibson.com • To locate a Gibson Dealer in your area, please visit http://www.gibson.com/Dealers/ • For schematics, repair tips, FAQs , Authorized Service Center locations and more, please visit the Gibson Customer Service website at http://www.gibson.com/Service/ ***CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication is considered a private and proprietary exchange between Gibson Musical Instruments and its customers, and is intended for the eyes of the original recipient(s) only. This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. *** ******************* So my “serial number is consistent with an Epiphone Les Paul Standard in Ebony finish”, which is exactly what I have. Still doesn’t certify the guitar’s authenticity, but it seems as close as I’d ever get, that is unless there was some warrantee under someone else’s name and that other person still has the instrument in their possession. ******************* I took pictures – I’m trying to follow the upload directions right now.

I checked that Gibson Lifestyle site from which I quote: Olsen warns that there are some easy ways to detect an incorrect reading from the site. “If you come across' date=' say, a ‘brand new’ Gibson or Epiphone guitar, but the serial number tells you it’s anything older than one year ago, question it,” he says. “If you’re looking at a piece that is older than one year old and it’s being sold as ‘new,’ that’s a red flag because a lot of these fakes are coming with serial numbers that actually roll to a manufacturer date of up to five years ago or longer .” [/i'] So that leads me back to my earlier posts and my gut feeling after the purchase that my '05 serial numbered guitar was too old to be so new without being a FAKE. But, like I said in one of these threads: if they are all made in the same thrid world factory, which I believe they are, then, since I wasn't going to buy new anyway, and I wasn't spending all that doe on a Gibson either, it doesn't really matter to me at all. I'm enjoying my guitar no matter what anyone says. Years from now my already 4 year old brand new used guitar will just look like a 15 year old guitar. In the meantime I am going to follow-up on what was in that article: Olsen, . . . “There are many entities that claim to be experts on the serial numbers of Gibson and Epiphone guitars, but the only advisable validation method is to contact our Gibson Customer Service department. Send it to us. It is that easy. and send them my Serial Number for validation. I'll report back here if I get a response, regardless of what they tell me (Fake/Not Fake).

Jerrymac, Thanks for the responses. [i sorta figured out what the +1 meant and edited my original post. I also sorta felt dumb once I had figured it out. I guess I should have thought about it a little longer before posting.] I just looked up my Serial Number on http://www.guitardaterproject.org/epiphone.aspx and found: Guitar Info Your guitar was made at the Qingdao Plant (Epiphone), China October 2005 Production Number: 6317 Gibson: Qingdao The Gibson Qingdao Plant was opened in October 2002, Qingdao, China. It is the only plant run by Epiphone in Asia. Both acoustic and electric guitars are made here. The factory is dedicated to making Epiphone and only Epiphone guitars with the aim of producing higher quality guitars. So, ok, my guitar is not a FAKE, that is unless someone is knocking-off copies of real guitars so that there are now more than one Epiphone LP with that serial number on it out there. I realize that this sounds like I just want to own a FAKE, but I have even seen a few others, like 1 or 2 listed in the same dollar figure as mine that also As for

Jerrymac - thanks for the thumbs up but, I actually did it because I really wanted that Gibson LP so to me the Epiphone is a bit of fakery of sorts.

What does this mean? Oh' date=' I just saw it in another post - it appears that it means: another thumbs up. Sorry, I'm Newbie to this forum.[/b']

I posted on this subject in another thread - "How to really spot a counterfeit Epiphone" where I discussed how I believe that my EP/LP is probably a China fake. Someone in that thread mentioned that on the Sweetwater's guitar gallery you can see examples of what the Serial Number should look like. I looked up the Epiphone Standard to check the serial number where I found that the serial number on the site showed the following format: 0906230698 (with tight justification) and my guitar looks like this: E E 0 5 1 0 6 3 1 7 (with wide justification). [For those not in the know: justification = space between characters] Someone responded to my post with the following: Which I didn't understand. My headstock has a Les Paul sig in the place where talks about: #2 - The opposite direction : Custom split diamond inlay.

So I am late to this post by almost a year, but I wanted to answer the question someone posted about a future where the China fakes started showing up stateside. So here's my tale. During the past year I purchased a Epiphone LP Standard off Craig's List from someone here on Long Island (originally listed at either $300.00 or $350.00 - I can't remember any more - the seller dropped it to $275.00 when I offered $250.00 over the phone). So I drove over and checked it out. The guitar still had the plastic protective skin on the pickguard and lots of inspection stickers on the back of the headstock, like: Setup in the US, hand-crafted in china, etc. It took a tune and played nicely. I had forgotten my tuner at home so, on the way over, I stopped and bought a cheap one. Having made this extra investment I offered the seller what I had left in cash. For only $243.00 I walked out with the guitar and hardshell Epiphone logo case. Honestly, when I bought it I had no idea that there were China fakes of these instruments, but I did have some reservations. Specifically since, though the house was sorta full of instruments (all child sized guitars and some keyboards) the seller said he bought the guitar figuring he could learn how to play and just couldn't, so he decided to sell it. As the other guitars were child sized it sounded reasonable, especially when he seemed impressed by my playing a few lame licks. I figured if he was that impressed he really couldn't play. A day or so after buying it I happened to be in Sam Ash and looked at the Epiphone there to see if my reservations were real or just buyer's remorse. They looked, and felt identical. I sort of thought they sounded the same as well - though I didn't have mine with me so I obviously couldn't do a side-by-side comparison. Then, after, just today, seeing this thread, I took a much more critical look at the instrument. The guitar looks as real as can be down to every detail. So then I went to the Sweetwater's guitar gallery and looked up the Epiphone Standard to check the serial number where I found that the serial number on the site showed the following format: 0906230698 (with tight justification) and my guitar looks like this: E E 0 5 1 0 6 3 1 7 (with wide justification). [For those not in the know: justification = space between characters] OK, so that leds me to believe mine is a fake - the seller must have gotten taken by one of the China web sites or ebay - and it seems pretty obvious that he had to know he was selling his fake to me. Now, many years ago (way pre-global garment manufacturing) I purchased a Tux at the "Tux Factory", a local factory that claimed they manufactured all of the top name brand Tuxedos. They even had the real deal style books to select from and all of the labels (large extra cost if the label was sewn in the garment). So that makes me think, how much of a difference is my guitar from the one in Sam Ash - if they are made in the same factory, then not much. Maybe mine would have rated "second" off the Epiphone line. Maybe it would have been "first" quality and the manufacturer is just making extras and selling them for profit outside of his contract with Epiphone. Hey, the reality is now that these things are made in China they are probably all made in the same factory, just like that Tux I bought. And they are probably all pretty much the same quality. I have been reading a lot of Lutherier posts lately that the name brand instruments they are seeing lately from their customers looking to make the instrument more playable with a setup are all, pretty much crap. Shortly after buying it, having some doubts, I took a Rub-a-dub marker to my case blackening out some of the letters so it now reads: E Phonie So where does that leave me - well, the original reason I went for an Epiphone, and a used one at that, was because the way I play I just couldn't justify the purchase price of either a new (Epiphone) guitar or a Gibson.