Wmachine
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Posts posted by Wmachine
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On 9/11/2020 at 8:25 AM, Wmachine said:
All you need is a time machine:
BTW, I have a 2016 and I'm really impressed with it.
Sorry, I pulled the 2014 339 by mistake. Actually by poor eyesight! Here is the 2014 335
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All you need is a time machine:
BTW, I have a 2016 and I'm really impressed with it.
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19 hours ago, Rshaw49rs said:
I have a 2005 335 Dot ReIssue, and according to serial number it was built in early 2005 at the Nashville facility (last 3 digits of s/n 7xx )
but I cannot find any info on figured top 335 Dot out of Nashville. Is it a standard 335, or any special attributes other than flame ?
I believe a 2005 from Nashville would automatically make it a Custom Shop model? That means "special attributes" in itself.
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11 hours ago, bobalu said:
Wasn't asking you, mate.
I am neither. But obviously you're not interested in the real message. No matter who you hear it from.
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On 8/30/2020 at 9:31 AM, Troy Kebab said:
Yes, there are quite a few '61 335 reissues out there at the moment... it's the model numbering that I'm not sure about / would like clarification on. I received a reply from a Gibson 'Consumer Relations Representative' who informed me (rather cryptically) that "Concerning production totals: we do not have production totals available, as these are seen as Gibson property."... what on earth does that mean?
It means they are not going to tell you, period. They've also said "they don't know" as another way to deflect the question. But at least "not available" is a lot more honest answer. Sometimes some detective work can yield numbers when they are more limited. First, there are certain models that when released, Gibson said right off the bat there were "XX" number made. And those are generally more well known and documented as such. But there are other ones that when released, dealers were sent info on the models that said, for example, "60 made for world wide distribution". I have personally searched old websites and found some of these cases. I have a 2015 and 2016 reissues that I traced to claimed production for 50 and 60 respectively. In both cases, when I contacted Gibson to confirm those numbers, they would neither confirm nor deny the numbers. For the record, I saved screen shots of the old web pages to keep as documentation.
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https://reverb.com/ca/item/40453-gibson-custom-shop-1961-es-335-vos-reissue-2012-61
A quick search for a start
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The more you can tell us the better. Where do you get the model number? How do you know it is a '61 reissue? Are you sure it is not a '59 reissue? Always start by contacting Gibson by phone or email as they can verify what it is and give you info on it.
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On 8/8/2020 at 11:28 PM, GeneIV said:
My Les Paul 1960VOS model number reads LPGC60LBNW1
This is from the Custom shop COA and the Gibson gold warranty pamphletI read it as Les Paul Guitar Center 1960 Lemon Burst I get lost at that point..... the NW1 at the end throws me off
The Serial number is GO 6402 from head stock and warranty card pamphlet
The card has nothing filled in where the date should be entered. The exterior finish and the playability checklists are filled in but the inspected by and packed by sections are not signed.
The COA has what seems to be a printed signature but I cant tell if its a real signature by Rick Gembar the general manager
any help would be appreciated... year of production???
The only clue to a date is the date printed on the back page of the Truss rod pamphlet , 2001Are you absolutely positive of the W in the NW1? Pic? That digit should be the tailpiece, and being a stopbar should be H. Other ones of that model I looked at were NH. Could be a mistake.
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12 hours ago, Jim Bagodonuts said:
Les Paul Classic (LPCS)
Bouillon Gold (BG)
Nickel Hardware (NH1)
Almost.
N = Nickel Hardware
H = Hardtail
1 = Gibson distribution code
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gnappi can indeed tell you quite a bit about it. That's a great ES-330 '59 reissue you have there. Not sure where you get the "hand made at Memphis Custom Shop" from, as there was never any Custom Shop in Memphis. Gibson did say some really misleading things, though.
Here is a nice review on it: https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/hands-on-review-gibson-memphis-1959-es-330-historic/
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On 8/14/2020 at 11:41 AM, Pinch said:
What are the '61 Zebras like?
Hard to describe, but I would say less hot. Not better, not worse. Just different.
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On 8/14/2020 at 5:56 PM, bobouz said:
Actually, your information is incorrect on all counts. I try to be absolutely sure that the info I post is accurate, least we begin creating alternative "truths". Here is what I can tell you based on fact:
- I have a 2009 ES-339. The serial number is CS 9XXXX (five numbers). CS denotes Custom Shop, and the number nine denote the model year of 2009. The COA that came with the guitar identifies the model & serial number, and states the following: "The instrument bearing the serial number above was hand-built by Gibson Custom....." and continues on with lofty prose. It is signed by Rick Gembar, General Manager, Gibson Custom Shop. The guitar also has the Custom Shop logo on the back of the headstock.
- I have a 2010 ES-330L. This is a 335ish long neck version, with a fully hollow body. The serial number is CS 0XXXXX (six numbers). The zero denotes the model year 2010. All other information is identical to the details regarding the 339 above.
Now it is understood that this was essentially all fluff, and these guitars were built on the standard Memphis assembly line - but nevertheless, this indeed is how these instruments are identified.
But let's dig a little deeper and muddy the waters even further as follows:
- I have a 2011 ES-335 with P-90s. This was a limited run instrument that carries a standard Gibson serial number (& no CS logo on the headstock). But it did come with the exact same Gibson Custom COA, with model & serial number identified, the same Gibson Custom prose, and the same signature by the Gibson Custom Shop GM.
- Finally, I have a 2012 ES-330 VOS. This guitar was Gibson's initial attempt at a very serious reissue of a '59 ES-330, and they were trying to nail all the pertinent details. This particular model was highly successful in reaching that goal, and received a great deal of praise upon release. In their reach for accuracy, Memphis used a stamped serial number, visible through the right-side F-hole. The serial number begins with a letter. There is no serial number on the back of the headstock, and no CS logo. But once again, this instrument came with the exact same COA as the other instruments noted above, specifying it's origin as a Custom Shop model.
All of the above helps to illustrate that the utilization of the term Custom Shop was clearly a moving target at Memphis. And it also helps to illustrate the conclusion I have come to after 49 years of being an instrument junkie: Guitar generalizations are made to be broken!
Thanks, you've illustrated that the deception is even worse than I was aware of. Not only a moving target, but inconsistent. Sure, they had a genuine "need" to try to identify special models, ones that were supposed to be a cut above the average ones. But their use of "Custom" and "Custom Shop" especially the sporadic use, was serving only their marketing and sales, and was doing their discerning customer a disservice. Understanding the models became quite difficult.
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17 hours ago, bobouz said:
There was no physically separate custom shop in Memphis, but the facility generated Custom Shop models, with Custom Shop headstock logos and serial numbers that began with CS to designate them as Custom Shop models.
Right, so they we "custom shop" by name only. Which is totally misleading. I don't think that was a fair thing for Gibson to do. They were intentionally being deceptive. It is hard to argue they weren't. FWIW, this was also done with some Gibson USA models. Even more deceptive there to me.
I do take exception to what you said, I don't believe any of them came with CS serial numbers. and the COAs did not say Custom or Custom Shop. CS still means true Custom Shop.
I should also be noted that even though those Memphis models were not true Custom Shop, Memphis generally made really great guitars. Though made in the same plant in the same lines, those "Custom Shop" models, the Reissues, and the higher end models like Lucilles were really outstanding. So even though they are not true Custom Shop models, they really shouldn't be dismissed as pedestrian models.
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I believe the difference in pups alone would be enough to make it quite different. I have an SG with 490s and one with '61 zebras. When I got the latter, I was surprised how different it is.
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On 8/11/2020 at 1:25 PM, alphasports said:
Apparently debatable, given that most of the time even Gibson doesn't know which hand is doing what. If they spent more time on production and QC issues and less time suing other builders they might build a cohesive operation. But I digress.
You can debate anything, doesn't mean it does or may have existed. There is good reason for this question to come up. But the answer, with answers to the questions to back it up, is that there was never a Custom Shop in Memphis. That's a fact, so debate away if you like.
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On 8/8/2020 at 11:47 PM, cesarbg said:
It's an M3. It says Custom Shop, but do not confuse that with *the* Custom Shop. That decal prior to 2005 (I think) meant a special run. So it is special, but not 'Custom'-made.
Not familiar with this particular "Custom Shop" reference, but I do know this was done in Memphis with some ES models. They used the same "Custom Shop" reference. In this case it was technically a model that was "Custom Shop Series". A well hidden detail making one think they were made in the Custom Shop. But they were made in Memphis. And Memphis never had a Custom Shop. I didn't know they pulled the same shenanigans with some Gibson USA models.
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On 8/7/2020 at 4:04 PM, littlejohnny said:
I don't expect people to read my lengthy posts, but commenting, when you didn't even get half of the story is beyond me.
No I didn't go back to the other thread, I addressed what you posted here which was misleading. That's why I qualified what I said with "unless there is more to it". My point is still valid whether or not I read the prior thread. Obvious now that you had more major problems.
Regardless, I'm glad you persevered and got satisfactory results. One shouldn't have to go through all of that, but in the end, it is what you end up with that matters. That may sound rather obvious, but it is too easy to lose sight of that when you are in the middle of problems.
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If one pays for a new guitar, I guess one can reject one that isn't perfect. But unless there is more to it than that little chip in the finish, I probably would not have sent it back. If the real world of what can be expected, that is really no big deal. Only due to forums full of chest beaters that demand rejection of anything that isn't perfect that those little things now loom large. The first thing to do when something like this is encountered is to play it an fully, and objectively evaluate. Unless you bought it for display, how it sounds and plays is the most import thing about it. And determining if it a good one is more important than anything else. Pretty simple from there. If it is a good one, you can go to great lengths to keep it. If it is not a good one, then it shouldn't take much to make a return out of it.
Forums must be full of wall-hangers, because I rarely see "whether it is a good one or not" come up in threads about whether to return a guitar or not. But tons of posts that say "demand perfection, send it back". Personally, I'm much more interested in getting a good one than trying to make a statement about quality expectations.
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On 8/3/2020 at 11:29 AM, badbluesplayer said:
I think NH does mean nickel hardware. Not that my memory is any good or anything.
No, NH definitely does not mean nickel hardware. N is for nickel hardware, but the H is not for hardware, it has to do with the bridge/tailstock. That is widely believed and misstated, but not true. That misinterpretation probably came from Les Paul circles where there is rarely anything other than a hardtail. All you need for proof is look at any Gibson model number for a guitar that has anything other than a hardtail. Floyd I believe has an F there. I know Maestros has an M there. Totally disproves the H is for hardware. That's hard proof, not a belief.
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You know the rules. Pics or it didn't happen!
You may want to consider Steinberger tuners like some of the newer Birds have, like my 2015.
Don't know if these are exactly the right ones, but like these: https://www.stewmac.com/parts-and-hardware/tuning-machines/solid-peghead-guitar-tuning-machines/steinberger-gearless-tuners.html
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Search old threads here. This has been discussed. ME is a legit s/n. The custom shop logo in not on all the models/years, that was only done for a limited time. FWIW, that custom shop logo simply means that it was a "Custom Shop Series" model made in Memphis. There was never a Custom Shop in Memphis. Yes, intentional deception by Gibson marketing. Don't get me wrong, they are still great quality guitars.
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I suggest you listen to some current playing reviews of Strats that you are considering. That should tell you if the Strat sound is what you want or not. The rest should be self-explanatory.
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6 hours ago, Bruce Pettengil said:
Huh? Wrong (8 year old) thread?
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21 hours ago, alphasports said:
Like @Eades said, in the 137 the C stands for Classic and there's even a big "C" inlaid at the 12th fret, but of course Gibson being Gibson they also made the Custom version (which in case you didn't notice also starts with "C" haha!). Both models were built at the Memphis "C"ustom Shop so there's rumor it also stands for that...
Sigh.
Yeah, except there was no Custom Shop in Memphis. Ever.
Share your ES's
in Gibson ES
Posted
Nice! Is the one in the center a Premiere?