RMT Posted April 10, 2013 Posted April 10, 2013 Hello Gibson Forum: I am a brand new Les Paul (my first) owner and I have a question about the lacquer on my guitar. I bought a 2013 Studio Deluxe 2 at Guitar Center and when I was setting it up at home I bumped the top putting a small dent in the lacquer. Nothing bad. Just annoying. I was/am confused at how easily that happened so I flipped the guitar over and, using my finger nail in a discrete place on the back side of the guitar, I noticed that I could make a mark. I was under the impression that the lacquer process was pertty hard? Am I mistaken in this? I am not worried about a repair of the dent I put in the finish since it is so small, but is the lacquer so soft that I will have to be scared of any bump that might happen? My guitar is only 2 months old (according to the serial) so, is it possible that the lacquer still needs to cure? Thank you in advance everyone. RMT
btoth76 Posted April 10, 2013 Posted April 10, 2013 Hello and welcome to the Forums! Although I am not entirely sure, but I think it has more to do with the nature of nitro laquer, rather than with a yet uncured finish. It will not change - I think. Consider this: the same impact on a poly finished guitar would leave a much uglier mark. I've seen a Select Strat, damaged by pieces of glass of an exploded display cabinet. It was awful, just like when small stones hit the windshield of a car at speed. Nitro is a soft finish, hence easier to repair. Find a good luthier, if it bugs You. Cheers... Bence
Bender 4 Life Posted April 10, 2013 Posted April 10, 2013 Welcome to the forum ! been looking at the Studio Deluxe II myself, sharp guitar ! if it left a dent, it wasn't so gentle a bump, but yes, nitro damages fairly easily....especially the 1st couple of years, but those dents & dings are just part of owning a Gibson. be careful what type of stand/hanger you use with it too, most of the rubber pieces will eat thru nitro....always cover the rubber w/a soft clean cloth. and above all...enjoy your new guitar !
badbluesplayer Posted April 10, 2013 Posted April 10, 2013 The surface will dent pretty much anytime you hit it.
RMT Posted April 30, 2013 Author Posted April 30, 2013 Just an update for those that are curious. My LP Studio Deluxe 2 from Guitar Center was deemed defective due to soft lacquer. When I pointed out that my microfiber cloth was leaving indentations in the head (I covered my guitar stand with a microfiber cloth to keep the rubber of the stand from contacting the guitar) GC decided that, yes, my guitar was not supposed to be like that. I even contacted Gibson who told me to take it back to GC since I was still within my 30 period from my original purchase date. It was pretty funny actually; the GC manager asked me to show him how soft the finish was and I told him to lightly poke the finish with his fingernail, which he did, which left a mark in the finish. He was amazed. Long story short, GC replaced my guitar. Those of you looking at the Studio Deluxe 2 at GC keep an eye out for soft finish. It should be rare as hell, but it does happen.
JohnnyJ Posted April 21, 2015 Posted April 21, 2015 I just got a brand new LP 2015 Classic with the same nitro finish. When I got it home there was a dirty finger mark under then pick guard that wouldn't come off with a dry cloth so I scratched it off with my finger nail. When I Shawn the light against the spot I could see left over indentations in the finish from my finger nail. Deep! I tested in another spot like this poster and found that indeed the finish is very delicate. I happen to own a strat 59 reissue, Mexican tele, Yamaha and an Ovation acoustic. None of the others including the bare wood acoustic were as delicate or showed any sign of damage to being scratched on the surface the same way. I sent a video in of the damage and showing me scratching the hell out of my Fendor strat and Yamaha, to customer service, got no reply. I called in and a fellow named Vince told me this was normal. When I pointed out that a pick could cause this same damage he agreed and told me that's normal for Gibson guitars. This was my first Gibson. Note the word "was". It plays beautifully for as long as the body lasts. As a side note, I had noticed a minuscule dent along the top edge of the guitar. Didn't know what caused it till I looked at the inspection photo that came with the guitar and noticed the "G" string post of a Waiting Gibson Signature poked into the very spot on my Classic that the dent is. I guess I just expected Gibson to Burry my Fenders for quality.
capmaster Posted April 21, 2015 Posted April 21, 2015 Hello Johnny, and welcome here. These are the properties of nitro finishes. They are very prone to picking up mojo... It was the same on vintage Fenders and still is on their remakes. Until the century ended when nitro also was used to coat cars, Fender used it, too, and switched to synthetic resins along with the automotive industry. The reasons were mostly economical ones in mass production. There also is the other side of the coin. Nitro finishes allow for nearly unlimited touch-up repairs since they don't cure. Although nitrocellulose is a polyester, it's structure is mostly chain-like, so sideways results just a physical compound. Synthetic resins like polyurethane and other polyesters cure through high grade of crosslinking. The entire guitar ends up coated with a single macromolecule so to say. Repairs will always be visible except for complete refinishes. My Gibson guitars and basses look like new after thousands of playing hours, same as my Fender, Ibanez, Epiphone and other instruments. I don't touch the finish of any of them with fingernails, picks, belt buckles, zippers, buttons or the like. Nobody who specifically watches my tender loving treatment would even notice it. All of my handling during playing and changing guitars is as quick as careful. The only parts suffering significantly are the strings... Not only my guitars and basses are worth that to me, but all of my gear looks neat because I like it - amps, pedals, recorders, outboards in their racks, and even mics, stands and cables look fine. All that stuff costed lots of money and has to serve me reliably. Just my two cents...
JohnnyJ Posted April 21, 2015 Posted April 21, 2015 Wow so this around the neck and to a lesser degree, the bumps along the edge of the neck are all a normal Gibson finish?
capmaster Posted April 21, 2015 Posted April 21, 2015 Yes, they are. All of my Gibsons - there are seventeen - have these ripples more or less. I think they come from tiny overlaps of glue along joints. It is next to impossible to remove them entirely. However, I prefer them over gaps in glue joints - these occasionally appear, too, at Gibson as well as other brands. On all of my Fenders, there are edges or locally ridges along the glue joints of the body parts. It's less apparent on my single US made, my single Japanese and my single Indonesian Fenders, and more obvious on the MIM Fenders, but finding the seams always works, even on solid finishes. There also are some funny ripples across resinous areas on alder bodies, clearly identifiable as such on transparent coats. Finally, none of my instruments has a coat completely free of ripple or orange peel. I think it's the nature of the beasts... ;)
JohnnyJ Posted April 21, 2015 Posted April 21, 2015 Yes, they are. All of my Gibsons - there are seventeen - have these ripples more or less. I think they come from tiny overlaps of glue along joints. It is next to impossible to remove them entirely. However, I prefer them over gaps in glue joints - these occasionally appear, too, at Gibson as well as other brands. On all of my Fenders, there are edges or locally ridges along the glue joints of the body parts. It's less apparent on my single US made, my single Japanese and my single Indonesian Fenders, and more obvious on the MIM Fenders, but finding the seams always works, even on solid finishes. There also are some funny ripples across resinous areas on alder bodies, clearly identifiable as such on transparent coats. Finally, none of my instruments has a coat completely free of ripple or orange peel. I think it's the nature of the beasts... ;) Well thankfully NONE of my other electrics have glue joints. Starts and Teles are all solid body and neck pieces bolted together and don't share common finishes between the parts. Shocking that yours do. Probably explains why none of my other 5 look this bad.
capmaster Posted April 21, 2015 Posted April 21, 2015 Well thankfully NONE of my other electrics have glue joints. Starts and Teles are all solid body and neck pieces bolted together and don't share common finishes between the parts. Shocking that yours do. Probably explains why none of my other 5 look this bad. Sorry, but I never encountered a Fender with a one-piece body. Some are two-piece, most three-piece, and these parts are glued together. Through transparent finishes the seams are clearly visible due to different graining, and viewing against the light will reveal them through opaque finishes sooner or later.
JohnnyJ Posted April 21, 2015 Posted April 21, 2015 Sorry, but I never encountered a Fender with a one-piece body. Some are two-piece, most three-piece, and these parts are glued together. Through transparent finishes the seams are clearly visible due to different graining, and viewing against the light will reveal them through opaque finishes sooner or later. Here's a little link for ya of Fender staff demoing the assembly of a strat. You'll finally get to see how those other Fenders get made. No glue required.
capmaster Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 Sorry, even Fender or their vendors use glue to put the planks together which make up a whole body blank which is later sawn, routed, drilled, milled and sanded before finishing. How else do you think do they join the two or three parts together?
Eracer_Team Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 there are many 1 piece body Fenders and Gibson's but it doesn't mean its the "norm" for all of one type and that video about attaching the neck to the body.. There a point to that? I have a 2008 Fender MIA Strat.. and it's a 3 piece body of Ash.
capmaster Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 All of my Gibson Les Paul guitars are one-piece - I picked them for that. The others have two or three pieces, the SG Supra bookmatched top and back, half/half in thicknesses, which makes four pieces so to say. Until now I seriously never had the luck to meet any one-piece bodied Fender in person, and I found out they are hard to find on the web, too.
Blueblooded Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 Wow so this around the neck and to a lesser degree, the bumps along the edge of the neck are all a normal Gibson finish? Is this guitar in your photos the 2013 studio you talk about? I question this because I don't know of any Studio models that got binding on the body or neck, and I don't think any Gibson had neck binding without "nibs" before 2014. You sure it's a Gibson??? I smell Chibson!!!
capmaster Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 I just got a brand new LP 2015 Classic with the same nitro finish. ... Is this guitar in your photos the 2013 studio you talk about? ... It's not about the 2013 Studio from the OP but Johnny's 2015 Classic from post #8, so the pics could match.
pippy Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 Is this guitar in your photos the 2013 studio you talk about?.. As 'Q' would say; "Oh, DO pay attention, 007..." I just got a brand new LP 2015 Classic with the same nitro finish... Not just a different poster to the OP but a different year of posting... Pip.
JohnnyJ Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 As 'Q' would say; "Oh, DO pay attention, 007..." Not just a different poster to the OP but a different year of posting... Pip. Yeah, um spelling it out would have been insulting to most. Same problem spanning 2 years and 2 models and one where Gibson already ruled a bad finish. Think and read 007. Personally I loved it when the original responder to my posting went on about how normal this is after the OP posted that Gibson diagnosed it as a bad finish, but I think it's especially great how you've not only helped to keep bumping this to the top and highlighted the major points for me! Thanks!
jaygl Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 Wow so this around the neck and to a lesser degree, the bumps along the edge of the neck are all a normal Gibson finish? Normal. All my Gibby's have that. Like they say, it's a hand built/finished guitar, so, imperfections are part of that process.
deeman Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 If the finish gets damaged by digging your thumbnail into the finish then STOP DIGGING YOUR THUMB NAIL INTO THE FINISH!
Blueblooded Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 It's not about the 2013 Studio from the OP but Johnny's 2015 Classic from post #8, so the pics could match. Oops! My bad. I must have been half asleep when I was reading this. Carry on...
capmaster Posted April 22, 2015 Posted April 22, 2015 If the finish gets damaged by digging your thumbnail into the finish then STOP DIGGING YOUR THUMB NAIL INTO THE FINISH! Touching a guitar like a vinyl disc record should be sufficient. But hey, what is a vinyl disc record?
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