Need help identifying this old Gibson acoustic

[smyrnagc]

I posted this in the Instrument ID and Identification forum and it was recommended that I post it here for more views.

 

My wife and I were given this old Gibson that was her grandfathers. Can any of you guys identify what I have here? There are no stamping serial numbers on the back of the headstock like typical Gibsons and nothing on the inside but some numbers and lettering on the neck block. They are a little faded but the best I can make out is:

 

D668 6

 

No other lettering or model identification anywhere on this guitar inside or out. The Grover tuners are replacements and there are some old holes that have been filled and varnished. Looks like the originals were 3-in-a-line but I am not sure. The original bridge pins are white and sort of messed up so the bridge pins in the pictures are some I had that I used when I re-strung it.

 

MEASUREMENTS

Nut Width: 1 11/16"

Upper Bout (Top): 11 1/2"

Upper Bout (Side Width): 4"

Middle (Top): 10 3/4"

Middle (Side Width): 4 3/8"

Lower Bout: 16"

Lower Bout Side Width): 4 3/4"

 

Pictures are here:

 

http://forum.gibson.com/index.php?/topic/101204-please-help-with-identifying-this-old-gibson-acoustic/

[j45nick]

Welcome!

 

I believe what you are reading as a "D" in the stamped FON is actually a "U", making this a 1957 model. This guitar has all the hallmarks of a late-'50s J-45, although both the tuners and the pickguard are non-original.

 

Guitar looks to be in nice shape.

[smyrnagc]

It could be a U...Hard for me to tell. I cleaned it up, strung it with some new EJ17s and it plays great. It has sat in a case for probably over 10 years and I can't believe it doesn't have some issues. There is the usual finishing checking but the neck is perfectly straight. I gave it a good work out yesterday and it seems to be opening up today.

[j45nick]

I assume you meant the nut width to be 1 11/16", and what is there is a typo. I've reviewed the pictures again, and stick with my original 1957 J-45 assessment. You can see the shadow of the original three-on-a-strip Klusons beneath the Rotomatics. This was a pretty common change for people to make in the 60's and 70's, as a lot of people didn't like the Klusons.

 

The pickguard change-out was a fairly common thing as well.

 

Both of these changes can be undone fairly simply if you want.

 

The guitar itself appears to be in very nice shape. These late 50's J-45's--and there's no doubt in my mind that's what this is--can be really, really good guitars.

 

The ink-stamped numbers on the neck block are exactly right for the instrument and the era. Those would have been the only identifying numbers on a J-45 in this period.

 

If there is a good luthier in your area who has legitimate experience with vintage Gibsons, it would be worth taking it in to have him go over it and set it up. You may also want to take an inspection mirror to the interior to check the bridge plate and the condition of the braces, but there is no external sign of trauma, which is a good thing.

[tvguit]

Looks like a nice example but something is bothering me about the burst. Forgive me for nit picking but I thought I'd mention it either way. Here is a '57 Gibson J-45. See how the burst doesn't extend above the soundhole rosette? The next picture is the burst on your guitar which shows the light part above the rosette. These guitars were made and finished by hand so it could just be the variability of the burst being done by hand.

 

However, the back of the headstock makes me question if the finish is original as well. There should be creases and indentions in the laquer from the Klusons but all I see is rust residue in the wood under the finish.

 

I think this guitar has been refinished at some point. This isn't a problem if you are just collecting/playing it but I thought I would bring that up. Either way, Nice score! Wish I could hear how it sounds. As Nick says, late 50s J-45s are known for having great Gibson tone. Welcome to the Gibson forum and thanks for showing us your Gibson!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[smyrnagc]

Thanks for the input...It sounds pretty sweet but when I first re-strung it (it had strings on it that had to be 10 years old or older) it was noticeably muffled. I worked it out pretty good yesterday and it really seems to be opening up. If one of you guys would let me know how to post sound clips I would be glad to. I have an Apple iPad that could easily record it but how would I post it to this forum?

[j45nick]

Looks like a nice example but something is bothering me about the burst. Forgive me for nit picking but I thought I'd mention it either way. Here is a '57 Gibson J-45. See how the burst doesn't extend above the soundhole rosette? The next picture is the burst on your guitar which shows the light part above the rosette. These guitars were made and finished by hand so it could just be the variability of the burst being done by hand.

 

However, the back of the headstock makes me question if the finish is original as well. There should be creases and indentions in the laquer from the Klusons but all I see is rust residue in the wood under the finish.

 

I think this guitar has been refinished at some point. This isn't a problem if you are just collecting/playing it but I thought I would bring that up. Either way, Nice score! Wish I could hear how it sounds. As Nick says, late 50s J-45s are known for having great Gibson tone. Welcome to the Gibson forum and thanks for showing us your Gibson!

 

 

 

You raise some interesting points, but I would reserve judgment until I had better photos or a first-hand inspection.

[tvguit]

You raise some interesting points, but I would reserve judgment until I had better photos or a first-hand inspection.

 

Agreed, in hand is really the only way to tell for sure. I'd be too busy playing the heck out of it to stop and look at the finish! Nice guitar guys!

[Bigg T]

Original or not, the pick guard is pretty cool. Looking at those pictures one can here the woody thump singing.

[smyrnagc]

Found something interesting today. This is a picture of a 1962 Gibson J45 "Country Western SJ". It has the same pick guard as my J45. So...it appears that either the wrong pick guard was installed at the factory or added later.

 

[j45nick]

Found something interesting today. This is a picture of a 1962 Gibson J45 "Country Western SJ". It has the same pick guard as my J45. So...it appears that either the wrong pick guard was installed at the factory or added later.

 

 

Pickguards get changed all the time. Don't lose any sleep over it. It is most likely that some early owner--maybe the same person who put the Grovers on--took a liking to the SJ/CW pickguard, and put one on. Chances are the guitar came from the factory with the standard guard like the one shown in tvguit's photo.

 

It's easy enough to go back to that style if you want, although be aware that when a larger, non-original guard has been installed, it often means there was some top damage--usually pick damage--that someone is covering with the larger guard.

 

In your case, as tvguit points out, the sunburst has an unusual pattern, but it is well executed. It may be that the guitar went back to the factory for top work at some point, and both the original burst and original pickguard were changed. It would not be the first time this has happened.

[smyrnagc]

Pickguards get changed all the time. Don't lose any sleep over it. It is most likely that some early owner--maybe the same person who put the Grovers on--took a liking to the SJ/CW pickguard, and put one on. Chances are the guitar came from the factory with the standard guard like the one shown in tvguit's photo.

 

It's easy enough to go back to that style if you want, although be aware that when a larger, non-original guard has been installed, it often means there was some top damage--usually pick damage--that someone is covering with the larger guard.

 

In your case, as tvguit points out, the sunburst has an unusual pattern, but it is well executed. It may be that the guitar went back to the factory for top work at some point, and both the original burst and original pickguard were changed. It would not be the first time this has happened.

 

Thanks j45nick...You might just be right. That makes sense. We don't know anything about the history of this guitar it was just passed down from my wife's grandfather. Gotta love it!

[j45nick]

Found something interesting today. This is a picture of a 1962 Gibson J45 "Country Western SJ". It has the same pick guard as my J45. So...it appears that either the wrong pick guard was installed at the factory or added later.

 

The guitar in the picture really doesn't have anything to do with the J-45. The Country Western was a re-named Southern Jumbo Natural. In 1962, both the SJ and the CW dropped the round-shoulder jumbo body they had previously shared with the J-45 and took on the square-shoulder dreadnought body of the Hummingbird, introduced a couple of years before. They also shared the pickguard shape of the Hummingbird, but without the famous hummingbird and morning glory decoration.

 

That pickguard shape and size works well with the square-shoulder dread body, but doesn't go with the body contours of the slope J-45 as well as the pickguard shown in tvguit's photo. In the long run, I would give serious consideration to bringing it back to its original look with the proper pickguard. Reproduction pickguards are readily available, if you decide to go that route.