Always Buy Better Gear Than You Think You Need

[milod]

A cupla points...

 

First, I think my current Epi semis are at least equal to a Gretsch or two I had in the old days - or my current Gretsch archtop. And my Eastman archtop is yet "better" in some ways.

 

Second, I think proper setup, whether for a beginner or a seasoned pro, is vital on grounds of changing environmental factors as well as the player's preferences. Yeah, a beginner doesn't "know," but a $100 Epi flattop or Jr. set up to be playable by the individual can bring great playability for their level. Buying a Gibbie for a 12-year-old who is experimenting may in some cases be incentive to play like a pro or... it could mean a guitar left under the bed for ages, if not functionally forever.

 

I think we've more going here than what's mostly been said.

 

Yes, quality, but quality for what? I've seen little other than, as Izzy noted, some "Walmart" stuff that's not pretty decent and could be used on a pro basis nowadays, at least as concerns the guitars themselves. Again, I'm leaving out psychological stuff.

 

OTOH, I think once one gets into electric/electronic stuff, there are a lot of practical decisions to be made that are seldom discussed here or elsewhere. What's "appropriate quality" for a given solo or ensemble? I'd say a lot has to do with where and what they're playing. Frankly a pro-level PA and smaller amps probably makes far better sense than a lot of us wanna admit. A "band" with a batch of $4,000 instruments and $4,000 amps and a lousy PA system probably will sound lousy to an audience. A band with a batch of Epis and $400 amps and a $4,000 PA system has the potential, at least, to sound pretty good in small to medium venues.

 

To me, the weakness of startup bands is that everybody wants the best he/she can get for him/herself and the PA system is either owned by somebody who spent a minimum on it, or is chipped in on by everybody after the real cash goes to guitars/amps.

 

So... What's "better?" I don't think there's a single answer. Frankly my $150 AE amp is far "better" for most of what I do "out" than the big old tube monster that would cost at least 10 times as much to replace.

 

Between that amp and a nice but rather inexpensive PA, I figure I'm good for a solo or duo with what I'm most likely to do, although were I to go "on the road," I'd likely get a better PA and a backup amp that's identical to what I have. Were I to get a strange offer to go on the road with some sort of larger band, I'd take a look at what I'd be doing musically and what would best fit to help the band's overall sound. I can't imagine much need for a "better" guitar at this point, but that also might vary depending on the type of gigs.

 

m

[Greybeard]

A cupla points...

 

First, I think my current Epi semis are at least equal to a Gretsch or two I had in the old days - or my current Gretsch archtop. And my Eastman archtop is yet "better" in some ways.

 

Second, I think proper setup, whether for a beginner or a seasoned pro, is vital on grounds of changing environmental factors as well as the player's preferences. Yeah, a beginner doesn't "know," but a $100 Epi flattop or Jr. set up to be playable by the individual can bring great playability for their level. Buying a Gibbie for a 12-year-old who is experimenting may in some cases be incentive to play like a pro or... it could mean a guitar left under the bed for ages, if not functionally forever.

 

I think we've more going here than what's mostly been said.

 

Yes, quality, but quality for what? I've seen little other than, as Izzy noted, some "Walmart" stuff that's not pretty decent and could be used on a pro basis nowadays, at least as concerns the guitars themselves. Again, I'm leaving out psychological stuff.

 

OTOH, I think once one gets into electric/electronic stuff, there are a lot of practical decisions to be made that are seldom discussed here or elsewhere. What's "appropriate quality" for a given solo or ensemble? I'd say a lot has to do with where and what they're playing. Frankly a pro-level PA and smaller amps probably makes far better sense than a lot of us wanna admit. A "band" with a batch of $4,000 instruments and $4,000 amps and a lousy PA system probably will sound lousy to an audience. A band with a batch of Epis and $400 amps and a $4,000 PA system has the potential, at least, to sound pretty good in small to medium venues.

 

To me, the weakness of startup bands is that everybody wants the best he/she can get for him/herself and the PA system is either owned by somebody who spent a minimum on it, or is chipped in on by everybody after the real cash goes to guitars/amps.

 

So... What's "better?" I don't think there's a single answer. Frankly my $150 AE amp is far "better" for most of what I do "out" than the big old tube monster that would cost at least 10 times as much to replace.

 

Between that amp and a nice but rather inexpensive PA, I figure I'm good for a solo or duo with what I'm most likely to do, although were I to go "on the road," I'd likely get a better PA and a backup amp that's identical to what I have. Were I to get a strange offer to go on the road with some sort of larger band, I'd take a look at what I'd be doing musically and what would best fit to help the band's overall sound. I can't imagine much need for a "better" guitar at this point, but that also might vary depending on the type of gigs.

 

m

 

 

I can agree with some of what you say Milod. But when I talk about buying your kid a quality instrument, I'm talking from the standpoint of someone who's played/performed professionally since the '60s. The instrument a musician buys for his kid who starts out playing is purchased with experience in dealing with quality instruments, and even if the kid decides he wants to quit, the instrument won't sit under a bed, it will get used by the parent. And, any instrument purchased will be set up properly because of that experience.

 

Starting up bands for the first time is an experience everyone has to go through at some time and sadly you are absolutely correct about the way it happens. Something is always lacking in the equipment balance between what some members can afford or what they are willing to put into a PA system. On top of that, some musicians don't want any part of ownership in PA equipment. I know people my age who have played for years without owning any of it. They have only joined bands that have it already.

 

I've lived through the extremes with bands who had crappy PA systems when I first started but also had one PA designed by a guy who is in the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame for his work in sound system design for the best rock bands. I came to the conclusion a long time ago that if you want a good sounding band that you had to bite the bullet and get the best PA you could afford and started buying the whole system myself years ago. I'm talking from my own personal experience and preferences, and because of the standards I've set for myself to be a professional performer.

 

After you go through so many years of performing in front of audiences, you set standards of quality for yourself for how good a performance has to be to not just satisfy the audience but to satisfy yourself that it is the best that you can make it. Then when you invest in a piece of equipment that you are willing to play under those expectations, it has to be the best you can afford.

 

GB

[kidblast]

yep just everything that needs to be discussed has been said here regarding the instrument

 

In the past I've done quite a bit of teaching, and this is the one thing that I've definitely agreed with when it comes to purchasing an instrument. Get the best one you can afford, -- the idea that you will upgrade when you "Get better" is a paradox.

 

one of my students was a guy about my age, always wanted to learn, but never really took the plunge. He was quite crossed up about what to get started with.. "I don't need anything good" -- yes,, actually you do... So he decided to take his own advice, and bought an acoustic that I could barely play up past the 6th/7th fret. It was a tuff guitar to play and he struggled with it, and he eventually tired of the battle and he quit.

 

his son in law decided he'd give it a go and picked up guitar, and did the opposite. Bought the best one he could afford.

 

So one day, my friend picked it up one day just to see what he remembered, and he was amazed with how much easier it was to get around. he sold his first one, and bought one just like his son in law, and now he's playing again. Says he's not ready to waste my time with lessons yet. but he's picking it up and interested again. Definitely,, it makes a difference!

 

amps, maybe a different story, there's so many to chose from that have good sounds and are not lot of money.

 

the priority goes to the guitar..

 

PA Gear,, a horse of a different color...

[BobF_]

Absolutely get good stuff for the kids! Spend all you can possibly afford? Not necessary these days. Squier, Epiphone, Ibanez, PRS ... plenty of really good instruments out there that won't break the bank.

 

Why in the world would I buy a kid a $20-30,000 guitar? :)

[badbluesplayer]

 

In the past I've done quite a bit of teaching, and this is the one thing that I've definitely agreed with when it comes to purchasing an instrument. Get the best one you can afford, -- the idea that you will upgrade when you "Get better" is a paradox.

 

 

Yeah - When I had my first trumpet lesson the teacher said I needed to get my flat trumpet fixed. Four years later I quit. <_<

[btoth76]

I always feel guilty when I buy something guitar-related. I know I am not good enough for spending that much money.

[milod]

Graybeard...

 

Yeah, I actually think we're singing the same chorus. I haven't done a regular "band" gig since '79 - started in late '65 - but instead it's mostly been solo gigs and occasional "could you sit in."

 

The one thing I think may require a bit of clarification is that I'm not suggesting a "bad" guitar be purchased for a beginner whether age 10 or 75. What I'm suggesting, though, is that a high-end Gibson is not at all necessary for that 10-year-old unless the parent already figures the kid ain't gonna play much, and Dad/Mom wants it anyway. Also an ES175 probably isn't the best choice for a 10-year-old even if the kid reeeeally wants to play and his parents are doing weekend jazz gigs.

 

Flattops vs. electric etc... Honestly, I think Epis are about the best choices properly set up for the kid. An Epi Masterbuilt flattop is a pretty nice guitar, ditto an Epi Dot or LP, and frankly more than I'd choose to buy for a 10-year-old. OTOH, a well set up $300 Epi should do quite well and even do well for "Dad/Mom" if the kid just ain't headed that way.

 

I think it's obvious, too, that a kid of any age starting guitar (<grin> including kids like us) should have input into the type of music and an appropriate "beginner" guitar for how he/she will be learning.

 

I guess my pet peeve is the rock/country guitar player who gets the $5,000 electric, the $3,000 amp that will blow out windows, and functionally ignore that he/she will be playing in a band with other musicians. To me, that tends to be ego rather than professionalism.

 

For me, a couple of nice guitars, reliable "clean" amp with a reliable backup, a cupla decent mikes and a decent small venue PA is basically all I need for what I do and where I've played over the past 10 years. Lots of times I've either plugged an AE into the venue's board or miked an amp for an electric guitar and used their mike/system for vocals.

 

For you, if you're doing bands whether bluegrass, blues, rock or country, it sounds like you're making similar practical choices for what you do.

 

That's all I'm suggesting.

 

m

[kidblast]

Yeah - When I had my first trumpet lesson the teacher said I needed to get my flat trumpet fixed. Four years later I quit. <_<

 

yea BBP, read your first post, which was exactly the situation my friend was in with his first guitar.

 

Then again, good brass is not cheap tho, it was hard for the kids who were aspiring to be horn players unless they could rent something decent. I played sax in elementary school, you could get into the school band in 5th grade.

 

the teacher was a nasty old fart tho, I remember practicing God Bless America until I thought my cheeks were going to explode, for one of the assignments, (each kid could choose one of three of four pieces) -- So I finish with a few squeaks here and there, but I got thru it, thought I did "okay", easily as good as others who'd gone before me.

 

his response was, "I know when someone is practicing, and you are not practicing."

 

Like you, I soon after quit Sax and concentrated entirely on guitar, which I had started to dabble with at age 8. a nylon string thing that was just a nightmare to play.

 

/Ray

[Greybeard]

Graybeard...

 

Yeah, I actually think we're singing the same chorus. I haven't done a regular "band" gig since '79 - started in late '65 - but instead it's mostly been solo gigs and occasional "could you sit in."

 

The one thing I think may require a bit of clarification is that I'm not suggesting a "bad" guitar be purchased for a beginner whether age 10 or 75. What I'm suggesting, though, is that a high-end Gibson is not at all necessary for that 10-year-old unless the parent already figures the kid ain't gonna play much, and Dad/Mom wants it anyway. Also an ES175 probably isn't the best choice for a 10-year-old even if the kid reeeeally wants to play and his parents are doing weekend jazz gigs.

 

Flattops vs. electric etc... Honestly, I think Epis are about the best choices properly set up for the kid. An Epi Masterbuilt flattop is a pretty nice guitar, ditto an Epi Dot or LP, and frankly more than I'd choose to buy for a 10-year-old. OTOH, a well set up $300 Epi should do quite well and even do well for "Dad/Mom" if the kid just ain't headed that way.

 

I think it's obvious, too, that a kid of any age starting guitar (<grin> including kids like us) should have input into the type of music and an appropriate "beginner" guitar for how he/she will be learning.

 

I guess my pet peeve is the rock/country guitar player who gets the $5,000 electric, the $3,000 amp that will blow out windows, and functionally ignore that he/she will be playing in a band with other musicians. To me, that tends to be ego rather than professionalism.

 

For me, a couple of nice guitars, reliable "clean" amp with a reliable backup, a cupla decent mikes and a decent small venue PA is basically all I need for what I do and where I've played over the past 10 years. Lots of times I've either plugged an AE into the venue's board or miked an amp for an electric guitar and used their mike/system for vocals.

 

For you, if you're doing bands whether bluegrass, blues, rock or country, it sounds like you're making similar practical choices for what you do.

 

That's all I'm suggesting.

 

m

 

 

I understand where you're coming from Milod. But as a musician, I think we naturally think that we don't want our kids to struggle through the same junky instruments that we had to go through as beginners. My experience with my own two boys may be somewhat out of the ordinary parent with kids starting out. My kids loved watching my band practice in the basement from when they were little kids and got the music bug early.

 

My oldest boy started taking piano lessons at four years old because he was bugging us to let him. By the time he was twelve, his piano teacher told us that she could no longer teach him because she would have to go back to school to learn more. He then started taking music lessons at the local university for six more years while also learning to play just about any other instrument he picked up. He has perfect pitch and can sit down and play a song after hearing it one time. He learned to play the trumpet in one afternoon and played it in the high school marching band the next day. He played bass guitar in a band after practicing with them for a few hours because their bass player broke his arm the day before a gig that the band had booked. He had never touched a bass before that day of practice.

 

The younger son also started into music when he was five years old and migrated through piano, guitar, and drums which he finally settled on. He now has his PHD in percussion performance and teaches percussion and music business at a big ten university. He has endorsement contracts with a number of different percussion companies and passed through a bunch of Nashville studios as a session drummer while getting his advanced degrees in music. So with these two guys taking off in music, it was easy for me to buy good instruments because their talent was obvious and I saw no indication of them stopping.

 

Its a matter of who the parents are and who the kids are in determining what you are willing to buy for the kids and what they are willing to do to deserve what they get. I never had to tell the boys to practice.... though with a young drummer in the house who sometimes practiced six or seven hours at a time during the summer break, we sometimes asked him to stop practicing.

 

As for my own equipment, I've played in some very large places over the years. But, I've never had to plug into a house PA to do a job because we didn't have enough to fill a place. We actually owned a pretty good sized moving truck for our equipment at the time we were playing the coliseum sized jobs and the truck was pretty full of PA gear as well as our personal equipment. That was back in the late 60s and early 70s and it probably was the most fun I've had making music. That was also the time that had the most influence on learning what equipment was best for each type of job and setting the personal standards I have for what is good enough. The rest of the guys I played with for so long worked so well together that we never had a problem with someone buying something to blow the rest away with volume. Our attitudes were very well connected in how the sound should be put together and it never became an issue of who owned a better amp or guitar. I think that is a very fortunate circumstance since so many musicians do tend to think emotionally about what they will or won't do in their musical pursuits.

 

I've owned a lot of the best stuff over the years but it wasn't until a little over a year ago that I bought my first Epi. I do enjoy the Epi's I have now for playing here at home although I haven't been able to let go of some of my other favorites.

[milod]

Grey...

 

Yeah, if I had your sort of experience, and kids with the same sorta talent, I'm pretty certain I'd say the same sorta thing.

 

I've no kids running around with my genes in 'em. Maybe when I grow up, although my wife suggests it ain't likely regardless how one takes my comment.

 

But I've taught mid to late teens who had various musical aspirations and abilities at various times. None were in your kids' class although one did have some Warner albums and some stuff on the charts; several ended up somewhere between pro and weekend warrior.

 

I guess I'm looking not so much at musical families where, as with you, the kids had the opportunity, talent and inclination to be "pros," but rather average kids of average musical backgrounds, a few of whom did have ability and did play for money in various ways. I figure they all came out of the pickin' experience somewhat richer, regardless.

 

I'm still convinced that in most cases for a raw beginner, a well setup Epi/Squier that is the type of guitar that suits the music a pre-teen or early teen kid wants to play is the better choice than a higher-end G/F/M.

 

If one has kids with an obvious talent and a bank account that fits more expensive instruments, the $100-$500 Epi or Squier likely will be just a starter. OTOH, I think they're far better than they get credit for, at least when I compare them to "name" guitars throughout the '60s.

 

Then again, the average Gibson is pretty inexpensive when compared to a high-end classical.

 

As for your case... I don't know "who you were/are," but I'd say your kids got a better musical education than most - and that comment emphasizes material that has nothing whatsoever to do with creation of sound from instruments.

 

m

[Izzy]

Many of you are thinking with the mind of an adult who, as a child, wanted to play guitar or trumpet or whatever and had the misfortune of having poo instruments, or the fortune of having good instruments. Maybe some of you have talented kids and the investment was great.

 

Keeping objectivity in mind...

 

Kids, even talented kids, need playable stuff that can be REPLACED in case of an accident. That having been said and not including kids who are joining band or orchestra (good instruments are to an orchestra/band kid what proper athletic wear is to a football player); To tell a single, lower-middle class mom of a kid who wants "to play guitar" that she needs to get the best she can afford when there is a risk that the kid may do what kids do best and FLAKE out or break the thing is just mean.

 

Remember, to regular, non-instrument playing people, instruments are annoying toys for children designed to torture parents for hours...unless you're Asian and then you must practice 'till your fingers bleed as the family honor depends on your mastery level (its just a joke, milod, don't lecture me )

[btoth76]

Hello All! Hello Izzy!

 

I completely understand Your point. Most of the people can't afford the best, that's true. On the other hand: children must learn to appreciate assets. They must learn that not all things grow on the trees. They must recognize what it takes to have all the goods. Sooner they learn, the better it is. The era of wellfare states has come to the end. We will be back to the point when we will have to create/grow what we use and consume.

 

Another thought on this. A good friend of mine only buys the best quality things. He once told me that He is not rich enough to afford Himself buying crappy things that fail all the time. On the long run it's cheaper to buy the best, than to continously waste money on repair/service of something inferior.

 

Cheers... Bence

[zigzag]

Point well taken, Izzy. I think that it is a waste of money, in most cases, for a child under 8 to 10 years old to own a serious instrument. I bought my daughter a high end Selmer sax when she was 14 after she showed a serious interest in playing and learning in her school band. She was responsible and appreciative enough by then to take care of the instrument. Kids' interests change so quickly while growing up, and it is rare for a kid to maintain interest in one area for very long. I've found that they will often rebel if forced to do anything. They need support and encouragement in their interests. It can be easy for parents to go overboard.

[milod]

Late last fall I helped a coworker buy a relatively inexpensive, but decent, AE for her 14-year-old daughter who was weeping for one.

 

I ensured it was well set up and could play just about anything I can play, and with as much ease as with my "better" instruments.

 

In fact, I could easily have taken it out to a coffeehouse type gig. It was good enough in tone and played that well.

 

I planned, that if the daughter did well with her Christmas present, I'd pass on a "much better" AE to her, no charge, etc.

 

The daughter played it about thrice.

 

Mom and Dad had to push even for the low end price tag, which is why, if the girl kept going, she was going to get a better one.

 

She didn't.

 

m

[Greybeard]

Many of you are thinking with the mind of an adult who, as a child, wanted to play guitar or trumpet or whatever and had the misfortune of having poo instruments, or the fortune of having good instruments. Maybe some of you have talented kids and the investment was great.

 

Keeping objectivity in mind...

 

Kids, even talented kids, need playable stuff that can be REPLACED in case of an accident. That having been said and not including kids who are joining band or orchestra (good instruments are to an orchestra/band kid what proper athletic wear is to a football player); To tell a single, lower-middle class mom of a kid who wants "to play guitar" that she needs to get the best she can afford when there is a risk that the kid may do what kids do best and FLAKE out or break the thing is just mean.

 

Remember, to regular, non-instrument playing people, instruments are annoying toys for children designed to torture parents for hours...unless you're Asian and then you must practice 'till your fingers bleed as the family honor depends on your mastery level (its just a joke, milod, don't lecture me )

 

+1 Izzy. I do agree with some of what you are saying. But I also have to add that it IS a matter of perspective in how you as a parent identify with the situation, not just objectivity. If it was only objectivity, yes every kid would have a lower quality instrument to play when starting out. But adding perspective of what the parent knows about music and what they see in the kid is a very large factor in deciding what to buy. We already had a piano that my wife played to start piano lessons for the first boy who wanted to start playing so we were able to see how fast he made progress and we had added information about his talent level when buying future equipment. It was the same for boy number two.

 

Yes every parent doesn't have the advantage of musical experience or the financial capability to buy the best. My father didn't have a large income and I started out with a pretty low end guitar. But I was one of those kids that played it until the skin came off my fingertips and I got a part time job at twelve years old to pay for my own equipment from the second guitar on.

 

All I'm saying is don't discount perspective in what a parent does for their kids. It applies in a lot of different situations besides music. Objectivity is fine in starting the analysis for a decision concerning your kids, but somewhere in that process you're going to run into the emotional connection of wanting to do whatever you can for your kids. That also involves you taking the time to teach them some of what you know about the care and feeding of musical instruments so they know what it is and how to respect it. That could also apply to teaching them how to care for a calculator, computer, sewing machine, etc. that you may know something about and are letting your kids use. It could also apply to coaching their baseball and soccer teams.

 

I'm talking from the perspective of a senior citizen who's been there and done all that.

 

GB

[Erwin]

When I started playing in clubs in 87, I only have a strat copy that I bought for 80 dollars. It's heavy enough to bust a vertebrae on my back. It became a workhorse and when I joined the Navy, I brought it with me and formed a band onboard the ship playing enlisted clubs on our freetime. I painted it haze gray ( like the ships color ). The other members (high ranking) were playing Rickenbackers and Gibsons and that's what pushed me to start saving. I was able to acquire a 84 Gibson Explorer Designer Series during that time. Still have it and love it head over hills. And the collection started to grow when my business starts to roll.

[badbluesplayer]

When I look back at my experience as a kid and a parent and look at how the people around me have treated their kids, I keep seeing the same thing. Some parents treat their kids right and some don't. How they deal with getting their kids musical instruments is part of the larger issue of how they treat their kids. We had a heiriarchical family where my oldest sister had two new concert instruments, a grand piano and a new acoustic guitar. I had a trumpet that didn't work and I wasn't allowed to play my sister's guitar. My parents were pretty well off, enough so that they surely could have afforded a working instrument.

 

My other sister - the middle child - has 3 boys and she is a wonderful mother. She's very smart. Her boys are grown and they're great people. She told me once that she made one of her sons buy his own guitar - for some reason or another that she regrets - and now she says it's the stupidest thing she ever did. The guy's a great guitar player. And his mom just abandoned him when he needed an instrument. Now he will always associate his mom with preventing him from pursuing what he wanted. A great mom making the biggest mistake of her motherhood.

 

Every family is different. But when I hear what my sister did I just hang my head.

[ShredAstaire]

A great mom making the biggest mistake of her motherhood.

 

 

 

If that's the BIGGEST mistake....she's in good shape. Not to worry.

[Greybeard]

When I look back at my experience as a kid and a parent and look at how the people around me have treated their kids, I keep seeing the same thing. Some parents treat their kids right and some don't. How they deal with getting their kids musical instruments is part of the larger issue of how they treat their kids. We had a heiriarchical family where my oldest sister had two new concert instruments, a grand piano and a new acoustic guitar. I had a trumpet that didn't work and I wasn't allowed to play my sister's guitar. My parents were pretty well off, enough so that they surely could have afforded a working instrument.

 

My other sister - the middle child - has 3 boys and she is a wonderful mother. She's very smart. Her boys are grown and they're great people. She told me once that she made one of her sons buy his own guitar - for some reason or another that she regrets - and now she says it's the stupidest thing she ever did. The guy's a great guitar player. And his mom just abandoned him when he needed an instrument. Now he will always associate his mom with preventing him from pursuing what he wanted. A great mom making the biggest mistake of her motherhood.

 

Every family is different. But when I hear what my sister did I just hang my head.

 

 

When I was just starting out in my career (a long time ago), I noticed that my boss at the time had to travel a lot to meetings with customers and suppliers. Knowing how much work it is to keep up with everything at home and everything at work, I asked him how he did it all with so much time away.

 

He told me something that I've always remembered...Keep up with what is important to the wife and kids, they may not remember the reason that kept you from helping them with their important stuff, but they will remember the important things that you didn't help with.

 

GB

[kidblast]

this has been a great topic.

 

when my son was about 7, he wanted to play guitar (it's all he saw me doing, and my wives brother was the bass player in the cover band we'd been in since he was about 4.) all my friends were players.

 

So we ponied up and we got him a pretty nice Japanese import strat and an amp for his birthday, I started him off with the basics, and he practiced everyday, for about a year and a half, in that time learned enough of guitar which led him to realize,,, he really wanted to play drums... Wups!

 

By then had just relocated to a new house (our first home owner's experience) back in my home town.

 

The only music store in town at the time had been in business since I was a kid, where I got lots of stuff, (my first Tele, my first strat... etc) and took lessons from one of the teachers there for a number of years.

 

The owner had passed on a few years prior, but now his son was now running the show. (he was about a year behind me in school. we knew each other quite well, and he was and still is a GREAT drummer. So I lamented to Tommy the situation with my son Shawn. "I need to find a kit, and get him on your schedule.."

 

he snaps his fingers and says, "Man I got just the thing..." a slightly used Ludwig butcher block kit had just come into the store on a trade. it was more money than we had available, and it was way more "Drums" than he needed, but we made it work and got the set home and Shawn started lessons that very week.

 

as it turns out, he was a natural. 25 years later and he's never stopped playing and he's one drummer that still practices, a lot, every day..

 

We've jammed together countless times and have played a few gigs together which has been an awesome experience.

 

He's without question, the best drummer I've ever played with, he's got talent far beyond what I could ever have given him, and I've played with a few monsters. He is head and shoulders above even the best of those guys. he's got an incredible work ethic, with an ear that just defies human limits. Today his band is about to break out and go national.

 

so to the point.. he had the tools, and he had the guidance, and had parents who put up with the constant cacophony of noise that came out of our house as well as the frequent visits by the local PD due to one neighbor who just hated everything under the sun and would log disturbing the peace complaints at like 5:00 pm on a Thursday afternoon..

 

I would do it all over again given the chance.

 

Yup! Always buy better gear than you need..

[charlie brown]

Great Story, Kidblast! Love to hear things like this!

 

CB

[Izzy]

 

My other sister - the middle child - has 3 boys and she is a wonderful mother. She's very smart. Her boys are grown and they're great people. She told me once that she made one of her sons buy his own guitar - for some reason or another that she regrets - and now she says it's the stupidest thing she ever did. The guy's a great guitar player. And his mom just abandoned him when he needed an instrument. Now he will always associate his mom with preventing him from pursuing what he wanted. A great mom making the biggest mistake of her motherhood.

 

Every family is different. But when I hear what my sister did I just hang my head.

 

Keep in mind that when you pay for something yourself, you're more inclined to prove to yourself that it was worth the buy. My mom bought me a Casio at 10 and I was like...meh, even though I love to play piano and got on the Petrof all the time.

I bought me a very nice Korg last year and let me tell you, there are times I DO NOT want to play it but, after spending time with the 6 strings, I MAKE myself do atleast a song or two or scales for dexterity because I don't want to think that I wasted the cash.

 

Perhaps this mom's mistake is what gave the kid the push to prove that he needed that guitar and the expence was justified.

 

My ex, the first boy I ever loved, has rich parents. His parents made him pay for his own college and he is SO greateful for it. It made him self-reliant and mature. My other ex has rich parents and they payed for everything. He goofed off in college, made terrible grades and got a poo degree. He is not a go-getter. He's a teen traped in the body of a thirty-something-year-old. My mom didn't pay for my school and it sure made me more disciplined.

 

Not saying this goes for everyone, but it does apply to some.

[Greybeard]

Keep in mind that when you pay for something yourself, you're more inclined to prove to yourself that it was worth the buy. My mom bought me a Casio at 10 and I was like...meh, even though I love to play piano and got on the Petrof all the time.

I bought me a very nice Korg last year and let me tell you, there are times I DO NOT want to play it but, after spending time with the 6 strings, I MAKE myself do atleast a song or two or scales for dexterity because I don't want to think that I wasted the cash.

 

Perhaps this mom's mistake is what gave the kid the push to prove that he needed that guitar and the expence was justified.

 

My ex, the first boy I ever loved, has rich parents. His parents made him pay for his own college and he is SO greateful for it. It made him self-reliant and mature. My other ex has rich parents and they payed for everything. He goofed off in college, made terrible grades and got a poo degree. He is not a go-getter. He's a teen traped in the body of a thirty-something-year-old. My mom didn't pay for my school and it sure made me more disciplined.

 

Not saying this goes for everyone, but it does apply to some.

 

 

Just a couple of thoughts to pass along here...when you buy something nice for yourself you have already put in a lot of effort to earn it doing whatever you had to do to buy it. That is a form of self-discipline.

 

When you pay for your own education it also involves self-discipline because that is a long term project in self improvement that you have to stick with until the end. So, perhaps your first ex with rich parents already had a quality of self-discipline when he started his education and the work it took to achieve that goal proved to himself that he could take on big things in his life and succeed. The second ex may never have had it in the first place and going to school on his parents money only postponed the fact that he didn't have the discipline to apply himself to the opportunity that was presented to him.

 

The old saying that you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink comes to mind here. The moral of the story is that when you really want something, you are most likely going to do what you have to do to get it. Work, study, practice are all self driven things that lead someone to success.

 

You can probably look back on your youth and remember which of your friends made good grades all the way through school. It takes discipline to work that hard to consistently succeed at a young age. Some people have that quality about them at a very early age and parents do often wonder where that comes from. Its pretty hard to give someone self-discipline. But when you see your kids put in the work, study, or practice it takes to accomplish high levels of achievement, you do your darndest to help them in whatever ways you can. Sometimes it takes self-discipline on the parents part to back off and let them succeed on their own when you are confident that they can do it without you.