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charlie brown

So...What IS it, about "Rush?"

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Nope, in fact I just contributed a long winded story, on your post! LOL [biggrin]

(Sorry, [blush] about that!)

 

CB

 

 

Lol,, no worries man... I thoroughly enjoyed it. Thanks.

[thumbup]

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Ok, here goes. All my opinion. In the early years Geddy's voice did not agree with me. It wasn't until Tom Sawyer & Working Man that I could listen to him in comfort.

IMHO Neil is a good drummer, not the greatest. It seems to me that in every song there is a part that he has to play as fast as he can, just to show that he can. It is at times hard for me to follow. I do appreciate the skill, but in the docu. there is a part about him studying with a drum guru that teaches him to hold the sticks differently, change the flow, his timing, etc. Then on the Time dvd, he seems to be playing the same old way. Did it not work out or does he like the old way?

As I said they've been going at it for 40 some yrs. And being 60 myself, I know my playing has changed alot over the yrs. And I'm sure their's has too, but like the Stones and all of us, we are getting older and can't do what we used to.

Geddy's voice on the Time dvd seems to be pushed pretty hard to come close to the notes. Alex has some great chops, but also a pedalboard the size of a door, loops, fxs, buttons for dry amp, wet amp, etc. You would need to be a Rocketman to figure it all out.

I know it sounds like I'm slamming them, but I'm not. I like a lot of their songs and the musicianship is fantastic. I do watch the Time dvd a lot and enjoy it, hell of a live show, and I do have a lot of their songs on my I-Pod, but am not a rabid fan. Bought the Clockwork Angels cd, was disappointed. I think, for me, it is like this with any other group or singer. There is a time in our lives when they touch a part of us that is growing or evolving and it works, but as we grow and mature things change and we go in different directions. Hope I didn't offend anyone, just my thinking.

TC

 

As far as Neil playing the "old way", maybe he wants to keep the original vibe of the songs? OR he understands that most of the fans wanna hear him play that way?

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Very well written and expressed. Thanks for posting. I do appreciate your opinions. Let me first say that I couldn't figure out Alex's setup either! His guitar is overproduced, but then again a lot of guitarists are that way. I like the cleaner distortion tones of Farewell to Kings and Hemispheres. So I completely agree with you.

 

In my opinion Neil has changed a lot though. It's subtle but it's there. He's not as "stiff" as his old days. He's still trying to become better, even at age 60. He'll be the first to admit he's not the greatest. He stated that his playing was horrible at the first Buddy Rich memorial concert. In his instructional video he says "I took this lick from so and so, and that lick from so and so." To me it's not the greatest that needs to be debated (it's like politics, no one wins that kind of debate), but rather it's the influence he had on so many young players.

 

I certainly understand your point on evolving. I listen to things now that I would have never listened before. Lately, I like listening to John Denver. He had some great abilities. The same is true for guitars for me. In my youth I would never touch an "evil" Strat. Now I love mine.

 

If your new direction takes you away from Rush that's fine. My 12 year old loves Rush (took him to the concert). Even when they lose fans they gain others. They wouldn't be offended by anything you stated here.

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Yeah, I'm enjoying hearing ALL points of view, and expressions, regarding "Rush!"

This kind of discussion is just another part of what keeps the forum going, and Great! [thumbup]

 

 

CB

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Very well written and expressed. Thanks for posting. I do appreciate your opinions. Let me first say that I couldn't figure out Alex's setup either! His guitar is overproduced, but then again a lot of guitarists are that way. I like the cleaner distortion tones of Farewell to Kings and Hemispheres. So I completely agree with you.

 

In my opinion Neil has changed a lot though. It's subtle but it's there. He's not as "stiff" as his old days. He's still trying to become better, even at age 60. He'll be the first to admit he's not the greatest. He stated that his playing was horrible at the first Buddy Rich memorial concert. In his instructional video he says "I took this lick from so and so, and that lick from so and so." To me it's not the greatest that needs to be debated (it's like politics, no one wins that kind of debate), but rather it's the influence he had on so many young players.

 

I certainly understand your point on evolving. I listen to things now that I would have never listened before. Lately, I like listening to John Denver. He had some great abilities. The same is true for guitars for me. In my youth I would never touch an "evil" Strat. Now I love mine.

 

If your new direction takes you away from Rush that's fine. My 12 year old loves Rush (took him to the concert). Even when they lose fans they gain others. They wouldn't be offended by anything you stated here.

 

My all time favorite Alex tone is from Caress Of Steel. I also love the tone he got on "Stick It Out" (he said he plugged his PRS CE24 STRAIGHT into a Peavey 5150...I like Alex with a purer sound..).

 

I don't think Neil is as concerned with playing a complicated, over-the-top drum solo as he is with trying to incorporate more of a swing into his playing (all over the last record). I think he changed when they did Signals. He became even stiffer and not as "out there". And then he changed again when he took lessons from Freddie.

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As far as Neil playing the "old way", maybe he wants to keep the original vibe of the songs? OR he understands that most of the fans wanna hear him play that way?

I understand and agree with you. The only reason I brought that up, was that in the documentry, he was talking about how studying with Freddie made him a better drummer and how the music was going to be better also. Not a slam, just an observation. And if the fans like the "old way" then a smart man will play that way. Cause we all know that putting butts in the seats is what pays the bills.

TC

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Very well written and expressed. Thanks for posting. I do appreciate your opinions. Let me first say that I couldn't figure out Alex's setup either! His guitar is overproduced, but then again a lot of guitarists are that way. I like the cleaner distortion tones of Farewell to Kings and Hemispheres. So I completely agree with you.

 

In my opinion Neil has changed a lot though. It's subtle but it's there. He's not as "stiff" as his old days. He's still trying to become better, even at age 60. He'll be the first to admit he's not the greatest. He stated that his playing was horrible at the first Buddy Rich memorial concert. In his instructional video he says "I took this lick from so and so, and that lick from so and so." To me it's not the greatest that needs to be debated (it's like politics, no one wins that kind of debate), but rather it's the influence he had on so many young players.

 

I certainly understand your point on evolving. I listen to things now that I would have never listened before. Lately, I like listening to John Denver. He had some great abilities. The same is true for guitars for me. In my youth I would never touch an "evil" Strat. Now I love mine.

 

If your new direction takes you away from Rush that's fine. My 12 year old loves Rush (took him to the concert). Even when they lose fans they gain others. They wouldn't be offended by anything you stated here.

As I said, I do like a lot of their songs and watch the dvds alot, and if I had a chance, I would love to go to a concert. just not a rabid fan and again not wanting to offend them or any one else. I also think it's cool that the living history of music is being passed on to your 12 year old [thumbup] Also like Surfpup's 3 catagories, sums up a lot of words real compactly. One other thing I like about them, is they seem to have a real good time playing and interacting with the crowd. After all, it's called "playing music not working music"

TC

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My all time favorite Alex tone is from Caress Of Steel. I also love the tone he got on "Stick It Out" (he said he plugged his PRS CE24 STRAIGHT into a Peavey 5150...I like Alex with a purer sound..).

 

I don't think Neil is as concerned with playing a complicated, over-the-top drum solo as he is with trying to incorporate more of a swing into his playing (all over the last record). I think he changed when they did Signals. He became even stiffer and not as "out there". And then he changed again when he took lessons from Freddie.

"Stick It Out" is one of my favorites, love the riffs and groove, sounds raw to me. Just a question, do you think incorporating the swing is just on the last record and he will play the older stuff as original? If I remember right, on the documentry they spoke of how hard it was for him to lose his lady & daughter so close together. I think it was 5 years before they played again. I can't imagine the pain of losing my wife of 29 years and maybe that changed many things about his playing or even if he would want to play ever again.

TC

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I was never a Rush fan although like others here I always respected them as musicians. Years ago I had a student, a drummer, who was a super Rush fan and a Peart fanatic. We had many debates about them, he saying they were the greatest rock band ever, I not so quick to anoint any band as best ever. Well last year I caught the Rush special on Palladia, Beyond the Lighted Stage and I have gained a new appreciation for them. Not only was my belief that they are great musicians confirmed but they seem like nice guys, each having an interesting story.

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I, personally, don't really care for Geddy's singing voice, and never have.

 

Heres your answer for your point of view CB. I didn't get there non-radio song's until I was into my 20's. Closer to the Heart, Fly by Night, Working Man... They all got lots of air-play back in the day but the stuff from Hemisphere's etc. didn't make since to me until I started moving away from Led Zeppelin a bit. I don't remember that "other" Rush stuff from my early teen's ether but I do admit I was a late bloomer to drug's and drinking so that may have had something to do with it.

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My all time favorite Alex tone is from Caress Of Steel. I also love the tone he got on "Stick It Out" (he said he plugged his PRS CE24 STRAIGHT into a Peavey 5150...I like Alex with a purer sound..).

 

Counterparts is one of my favorite Rush albums. Stick it Out is great. Alex's solo on Cut To The Chase is something that I've been trying to learn for a while, but wow it's tough. I love the first line where he hits a high E (that's how I knew he played it on his 24 fret PRS). It starts at 2:44.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqRx49TwP9E

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Counterparts is one of my favorite Rush albums. Stick it Out is great. Alex's solo on Cut To The Chase is something that I've been trying to learn for a while, but wow it's tough. I love the first line where he hits a high E (that's how I knew he played it on his 24 fret PRS). It starts at 2:44.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqRx49TwP9E

 

For me (and many others, so I hear, including Eddie Trunk and Mike Portnoy), Counterparts marked the return of Rush as a guitar-driven heavy rock band, which was a breath of fresh air after the texture and synth-laden period and the very funky Presto and Roll The Bones.

 

"Cut To The Chase" is a classic in my book. Great song, even better solo.

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To me, Rush is like Jimi Hendrix. Amazing, but I was over it after 7th grade. Rush is less over-exposed than Hendrix, who is painfully imitated by SO many *** guitar players, SRV being chief among them.

 

I think Rush's fanbase is so crazy about them because Rush are great players, never broke up or died, and stayed kinda consistent with the "concept album" schtick. Perhaps above all, Rush fans are fantasy/concept geeks, and Rush delivers what they want.

 

I never liked the fantasy genre, except for Conan and 2 years of D&D when I was a little kid. Again, been there, done that, over it. There was a year or two when I was into Groo, but only because I have always loved MAD mag. Horror was the closest I ever got, but only the movies, not the books.

 

I was in the audience at this year's RNRHOF induction, and Heart was *WAY* better than Rush. I'm not particularly a Heart fan, either.

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I really like Rush. Their late 70s, 80s and early 90s stuff. Like it all. Alot of people did not like it when they added keyboards in the 80s. I admit it was different, but liked it, like when VH added keyboards(Synth) in 1984.

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I think Rush's fanbase is so crazy about them because Rush are great players, never broke up or died, and stayed kinda consistent with the "concept album" schtick. Perhaps above all, Rush fans are fantasy/concept geeks, and Rush delivers what they want.

 

Interesting take. I'll be the first to admit that I'm a geek. Well, I'm no longer that high school or college geek anymore. Yep, I'm proud to say that I'm a professional geek now!! He he he. But I never got into the fantasy stuff at all. I really don't see this from Rush fans that I know, but you are probably right. Their last real concept album was Hemispheres. Clockwork Angels is a theme album but the "music themes" are not blended together like 2112 or Hemispheres. Nick Raskulinecz begged them to do a 2112-type album.

 

But you got me thinking. Why am I a huge Rush fan? I listen to all kinds of music. I love jazz, classical music, the blues, country, progressive, pretty much everything. But Rush does something for me that no other band or artist does. I really have no idea why to be honest with you. Maybe that's what it truly IS all about. Rush fans are the way they are, but they don't really know why or care to know why.

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I'm not a fantasy/concept geek. I like the concept of 2112 because I like my individualism. Otherwise, it was not so much the concepts as much as the music itself that I love. I mean, I like a lot of Neil's lyrics, especially in songs like "Freewill" (cause' I choose freewill...and that song exemplifies my view of society and how to live), "Limelight" (I like my privacy and can be very shy at times, much like Neil), "The Big Money" (do I have to explain) and "A Passage To Bangkok" (again, do I have to explain?), and I consider him to be one of the greatest lyricists, but at times, I can relate more to the lyrics of a song like "Best I Can", which were written by Geddy.

 

I'm not into fantasy, I'm not into Shakespeare (while I respect his work). Sci-Fi is interesting to me, but I wouldn't call myself a sci-fi geek. I like comics.

 

When it comes to lyrical themes, I'm more in the Zappa realm.

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Loved Rush in college in early 80's...but lost track/interest with kids and work. Don't really like their later albums.

 

Having said that, I play guitar at least 6 days a week and must admit that I crank out at least one Rush tune each time. Played earlier today...was tinkering with Limelight, In the Mood, and Closer to the Heart (even nearly mastered the lead). Was playing part of The Trees on my acoustic too.

 

I love their stuff!! Never gets old for me.

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I like the concept of 2112 because I like my individualism.

 

One of Neil's favorite themes - borrowed heavily from Ayn Rand. 2112 is very obviously an interpretation of Rand's novel Anthem. If you haven't read it, do so immediately. It is the greatest novel under 100 pages ever written. [thumbup]

 

I can relate more to the lyrics of a song like "Best I Can", which were written by Geddy.

 

Definitely on my list of favorite Rush tunes. Very straight ahead rock for them.

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Though they may be the epitome of a non-greatest-hits band, they are exactly that to me.

 

The songs that everyone who listens to classic rock radio hears is - I find - about all the Rush I need.

 

They all seem like great guys, and I loved the documentary a coupla years ago, but Geddy's banshee wail and Peart's (sometimes) pretentious lyrics never really grabbed me.

 

That said, some of their songs are definite rock anthem classics, and no one can take that away from them. As a native Clevelander, I am proud that it was here that Rush broke into popularity, "Working Man" having been discovered by a WMMS DJ.

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I'm not a fantasy/concept geek.

 

I'm not into fantasy, I'm not into Shakespeare (while I respect his work). Sci-Fi is interesting to me, but I wouldn't call myself a sci-fi geek. I like comics.

 

Maybe I'm using "fantasy" in an unorthodox & crude way, but I lump in comic books with fantasy & definitely concept.

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Maybe I'm using "fantasy" in an unorthodox & crude way, but I lump in comic books with fantasy & definitely concept.

 

Ok, then I guess I'm a fantasy/concept geek...

 

But I never read Lord Of The Rings or anything like that, so..

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I am a *big* Rush fan, have been since the 80's as a teenager. Discovered them in 1980 when 'Permanent Waves' was released, then worked backwards to discover '2112' and 'Hemispheres'. I was never a really big fan of their really early stuff beyond the songs 'Working Man' and 'Fly By Night' except as early work of a band I loved, not the music in and of itself from that period (if you know what I mean). I then followed them through 'Moving Pictures' and 'Signals'. I have to tell you, the song 'Subdivisions' was pretty impactful to me as a lover of their music and a young teenager in High School when it came out.

 

Anyway, lost track of them a bit in the early 90's, wasn't a fan of the 'Presto' and 'Roll the Bones' period. Then a few years ago I rediscovered them, and loved 'Snakes and Arrows' and 'Vapor Trails'.

 

Saw them on the recent Time Machine tour and was blown away. They were incredible IMHO, best concert I've ever seen, and I've seen a few.

 

Having said all of this, I'm having a really hard time pinning down why I love their music so much. It continues to connect to me, I grew up with it in my formative years and those 80's albums in particular will always be something I love. That music is a part of me, and I just can't say that about any other band in the way I can Rush. I highly respect their musicianship, their ability to not take themselves too seriously, and their ability to remake themselves and evolve.

 

I have no idea how else to say it except this, their music fits into my need for beauty like a puzzle piece. For some its artwork, for some its cars, for me its always been music. I love and respect many bands and artists, but none of them have felt as 'right' as Rush's music has for me personally.

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All three are great musicians individually, but put the three of them together and you get the greatest Band ever. Complex melodies, rythyms and some of the most unique lyrics I can ever imagine. Add to that, Neil's awesome drum techniques, Alex's stand out leads and Geddie's fast finger bass playing, foot work with the Bass Pedals, and ever developing keyboard.

Who could ask for anything more from a three piece band?

Their friendship on and off the stage really helps the overall picture. The personal adversities Neil has been through and still be able to perform.

I've been a fan since the early 70's, seen them several times in concert, own many of their albums. I do like the older stuff better, and I did shy away a little when they got a little too pop, but they have come back better through all of the changes and are still going strong. Not many bands can say that with the semi-original members (Neil was the best thing that happened to them after their debut album) for that many years.

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Perhaps above all, Rush fans are fantasy/concept geeks, and Rush delivers what they want.

 

I never liked the fantasy genre, except for Conan and 2 years of D&D when I was a little kid. Again, been there, done that, over it. There was a year or two when I was into Groo, but only because I have always loved MAD mag. Horror was the closest I ever got, but only the movies, not the books.

 

 

My ex was nuts for Rush and he is a big D&D, fantasy geek. I was told just yesterday how great they are and when I said, "meh" he said, "most of their fans are male." I think that may be true. I haven't ever heard a girl mention Rush or play Rush. [blink]

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