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Jackdaniels2244

Les Paul traditional or standard?

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Depends what you like. Have you had a chance to try out a few Standards or Traditionals? I know the new Traditionals are not weight relieved and will be a little heavier. So if you want a heavier guitar, then the Traditional may be for you. My advice is to try a bunch of different guitars, go to a bunch of different shops until you find the one you like.

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You'll notice quite a difference in the neck profiles. The Trad wil be a 50s, whilst the Standard (if you're talking about a new one) would be aa slimer asymmetrical neck profile.

 

The 2012/13 standards have all the push/pull pots for coil tap whilst the Trad is just a straight ahead Lester,

 

Basically you really need to try them.

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I just bought a Trad a couple of weeks ago. The non-weight-relieved thing shouldn't be underestimated. The tone is definitely affected by that (in a good way in my opinion). But it really does feel heavier than any other LP out there. A LOT heavier. I play seated so I don't have mine hanging on my shoulder. Even still, seated, it wants to slide off my lap to the right. I'm good with it, but it really is different.

 

Bottom line, not only play them, but take your time playing them. If you're going to play standing, strap them on and see.

 

Oh yeah, and you can't really go wrong with this choice [thumbup]

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Guest Farnsbarns

Just to offer an alternative opinion....

 

Weight relief makes absolutely no audible difference what so ever. Tex is the first person I have ever heard claim the contrary outright. That includes all the true experts on this board and others as well as several highly respected luthier and numerous expert gibson dealers, not to mention highly respected professional guitarists that you will have heard of.

 

Put simply, the idea that it effects tone is hogwash. Imho

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I would play them both and watch the prices as the Traditional Pro II which is an exclusive to GC is on sale at the Guitar a thon for $1399. Frankly you can't beat it for the price its a no brainer. I imagine they will be discontinued and probably are only a few left around. Studios go for that.

 

The locking tuners work great as do the split coils and 10db boost.

 

Standards, least when I owned one in 05 had one-piece mahogany back. I don't believe this changed. The Traditional may have two or one.

 

I played a few Traditional LPs that came by here. A Mahogany Satin top and 60-RI Satin Sam Ash exclusive. I prefer the 57 and 57+ pick-ups both had for sure, the BB-3 in the bridge works great also. That said out of all of them I like that $1399. Traditional Pro II the best as it has a 50 neck, slightly better feel IMHO. Also the 57 classic neck combined with the BB-3 bridge is an amazing combination.

 

The electronics is a personal issue. I have heard complaints about coil-taps etc. I haven't had any issue at all. I also have an EE degree. IMHO the Gibson's tricked out with electronic options should definitely be considered. This is an area where Gibson has finally expanded and doing an impressive job if you ask me.

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Just to offer an alternative opinion....

 

Weight relief makes absolutely no audible difference what so ever. Tex is the first person I have ever heard claim the contrary outright. That includes all the true experts on this board and others as well as several highly respected luthier and numerous expert gibson dealers, not to mention highly respected professional guitarists that you will have heard of.

 

Put simply, the idea that it effects tone is hogwash. Imho

 

Well Farns. Maybe so. I can assure you however, that when you strum these unplugged there is a difference. I would assume that the acoustic properties would translate into something audible when plugged in. But, ok. I'm not an expert by any means. Don't claim to be. So, perhaps my assumption is erroneous. I'm sure that the pickup difference accounts for the bulk of the sonic difference plugged in. Maybe the pickups account for the entirety of the sonic difference, as it seems you're suggesting. I'm good with that too. Bottom line, these guitars do sound different.

 

And I stand by the point of my post - these things are heavy.

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Well Farns. Maybe so. I can assure you however, that when you strum these unplugged there is a difference. I would assume that the acoustic properties would translate into something audible when plugged in. But, ok. I'm not an expert by any means. Don't claim to be. So, perhaps my assumption is erroneous. I'm sure that the pickup difference accounts for the bulk of the sonic difference plugged in. Maybe the pickups account for the entirety of the sonic difference, as it seems you're suggesting. I'm good with that too. Bottom line, these guitars do sound different.

 

And I stand by the point of my post - these things are heavy.

 

There's no doubt that unplugged, the construction of a guitar makes a big difference. Plugged into an amp, the pups take over. I'm no a big proponent of tone wood theory, BUT there's one undisputable fact. Hollow bodied guitars feedback more. If the acoustics of a guitar have nothing to do with the amped signal, than why do hollow bodies cause feedback?

I'm glad I didn't know about the Trad Pro II being sold at $1,399, I would have been scheming the last few days figuring out a way to make it happen.

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Guest Farnsbarns

I will happily bet anyone £10000 that in a blind test they can't pick 30 swisscheesed LPs from 30 totally solid ones, plugged in, unplugged, whatever. You just listen, blindfolded and pick them out. Tell you what, if you can come out at 80% accurate we'll call that a win. That should be a large enough sum to make it worth anyone travelling to London for this so line up, who's first?

 

Remember though, the only way anyone found out about the swiss cheese was because a canny owner happened to watch his LP go through the X-ray at an airport. Before that, no one knew.

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Guest Farnsbarns
. Hollow bodied guitars feedback more. If the acoustics of a guitar have nothing to do with the amped signal, than why do hollow bodies cause feedback?

 

 

No one said anything about hollow bodies, were talking weight relief here, not chambering or hollow bodies, just the difference between an utterly solid lump of mahogany and a piece with a few holes machined part way through.

 

Like I said in my post above, just put your money where your mouth is.

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I will happily bet anyone £10000 that in a blind test they can't pick 30 swisscheesed LPs from 30 totally solid ones, plugged in, unplugged, whatever. You just listen, blindfolded and pick them out. Tell you what, if you can come out at 80% accurate we'll call that a win. That should be a large enough sum to make it worth anyone travelling to London for this so line up, who's first?

 

Remember though, the only way anyone found out about the swiss cheese was because a canny owner happened to watch his LP go through the X-ray at an airport. Before that, no one knew.

 

I'll throw in $10,000 for good measure. :)

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Guest Farnsbarns

I'll throw in $10,000 for good measure. :)

 

[thumbup]

 

Oh, and to answer the OP. IMO the traditional is much better value for money.

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I would come over and skip the pointless Les Paul pointy ears testing because nobody can hear that crap and the internet should be ashamed for allowing such nonsense to proliferate and we could just drink 10 grand.

 

Is that Pounds Stirling? Sterling? Or YourOhs? It's important at the airport you know.

 

rct

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Guest Farnsbarns

The Euro would likely be about as much good as Zimbabwean dollars by the time you got here ;) [flapper] . British Pounds on offer here.

 

Joking aside, if you're ever in Blighty look me up!

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Guest Farnsbarns

Well isn't that strange, both the people who claimed they could hear this huge difference have been active here since my post and neither of them want my 10 grand, or a bankrolled trip to London. I guess they must both be millionaires who don't have the time and don't want the money. That or maybe they know they wouldn't stand a chance because the difference is undetectable.

 

So, to the OP, I know it wansn't the question you asked, but... there is no difference in tone at all, I seem to have demonstrated that even those who claim it can't stand by the claim.

 

The traditional almost certainly represents better value, not that that is the be all and end all, a standard is a beautiful thing. Judge with your ears and hands, not your wallet, play loads of guitars until you find one that you really connect with but DO NOT BE DRAWN IN to these myths, they're everywhere. I always challenge those that make this claim with this bet and I am not in the least bit surprised no one has ever taken me up on it.

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Hey, people once bought "pet rocks!" If clever enough, one can "market" anything!

Alleged sound/tonal differences...anything! [tongue]:rolleyes:

 

Some people, claiming purely altruistic motives, are making millions, off scaring the crap

out of everyone, regarding the "End of the World!" Talk about "Marketing!" LOL

They did, exactly, the same thing, in the '50's! So, buy that Les Paul (whichever model)

"before it's too late!!" [flapper][biggrin]

 

CB

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As I pointed out in at least three other topics, all the Traditional 2013s I checked out including my own sound distinctively different from all the weight-relieved LPs I ever checked out including the three of my own of which the two modern weight relieved are practically the same weight as my Traditional. I also repeat here that I cannot tell if it's due to the massive body or the 50s neck since all my weight-relieved LPs have a '60s neck.

 

By the way, my Alex Lifeson LP Axcess with thinner body, fatter neck, Graph Tech LB63 piezo Floyd Rose and lots of cavities but no additional weight relief is sonically closer to the Traditional 2013 than the weight-relieved USA and Custom Shop LP Standards of mine, despite of being equipped with very different magnetic pickups. Traditional 2013 and Alex Lifeson Axcess also don't have obvious dull notes whereas the '60s neck & weight-relieved ones do.

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Well isn't that strange, both the people who claimed they could hear this huge difference have been active here since my post and neither of them want my 10 grand, or a bankrolled trip to London. I guess they must both be millionaires who don't have the time and don't want the money. That or maybe they know they wouldn't stand a chance because the difference is undetectable.

 

Well yeah, but, you know, English food sucks, so, maybe they don't drink? And it rains alot. Just trying to help you understand is all.

 

rct

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Well yeah, but, you know, English food sucks, so, maybe they don't drink? And it rains alot. Just trying to help you understand is all.

 

rct

 

Fish and chips, bangers and mash, steak and ale pie... pub food is quite good in the UK, as is the beer. Will be making a stopover in Jolly Old England on my way back from the states in December.

 

As for the OP, I haven't played a Standard, but based on the specs it is quite a different animal than the Traditional. Play a lot of both of them, as several have suggested. Happy hunting.

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Fish and chips, bangers and mash, steak and ale pie... pub food is quite good in the UK, as is the beer. Will be making a stopover in Jolly Old England on my way back from the states in December.

 

I know man, I ate English for three years whilst living in one of The Queens Colonies. It was a joke about the ill-advised perceptions of most Yanks about most things Brit.

 

rct

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Maybe I missed something. But I never said there was a huge difference because of the weight relief (or a huge difference at all - that was your word). I did however say these guitars sound different, but readily concede that the difference may be entirely related to the difference in pickups (or strings or phase of the moon or whatever you experts deem to be the case).

 

Maybe you're talking about somebody else's post. ?

 

Anyway, if you're ever in Texas...

 

 

;)

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Guest Farnsbarns
I never said there was a huge difference because of the weight relief

 

Really?

 

The non-weight-relieved thing shouldn't be underestimated. The tone is definitely affected by that (in a good way in my opinion).

 

[confused]

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