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The Rhone

498T or Classic 57

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Hello one and all,

 

I've just joined this forum, I've recently got a Les Paul Studio with a 498t on the bridge, I quite liked the tone, it had less gain then I'm used to. So I got an Iron Gear Steamhammer, which has not bowled me over. SO was considering to get a Classic 57 to help warm up the sound.

 

What are your thoughts. I play mainly Metal fused with Space Rock, so not out and out metal, but imagine a Motorhead, Hawkwind, Mastodon & Ozric Tentacles fusion.

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Hello Rhone, and welcome here.

 

'57 Classic and the slightly hotter '57 Classic Plus should give you a rounder tone than a 498T does, though I have to say that I like all of them in the bridge position. However, the differences are clearly notable but not that huge. It strongly depends on the guitar, too.

 

What really knocked me out recently were the Dirty Fingers+ in both neck and bridge positions of an Explorer. They provide lots of output level and a great, balanced tone, clean as well as distorted. Did you ever try a Les Paul guitar featuring these? The 500T is a great pickup, too, although I don't have much experience with it.

 

I have one 496R in the neck position and love it. All in all I have to say that I'm really excited about all of my pickups featuring ceramic magnets.

 

By the way, the aftermarket Gibson Dirty Fingers come four-conductor wired. I basically prefer covered pickups, but I think I never before liked it more to make an exception... [rolleyes]

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Hello one and all,

 

I've just joined this forum, I've recently got a Les Paul Studio with a 498t on the bridge, I quite liked the tone, it had less gain then I'm used to. So I got an Iron Gear Steamhammer, which has not bowled me over. SO was considering to get a Classic 57 to help warm up the sound.

 

What are your thoughts. I play mainly Metal fused with Space Rock, so not out and out metal, but imagine a Motorhead, Hawkwind, Mastodon & Ozric Tentacles fusion.

I don't think the 57 classic is what you are lookin' for-

much less gain than you are used to,

I have no idea what to recommend to ya- those bands aren't my territory, but, I'd look into what those guys are using. you might find your tone in a pedal

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it's comparable. I have two LPs, one has the JB the other the 498t.

 

the JB carries more top end bite IMX.

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Thank you for all your help.

 

I have a Dirty Fingers in one of my Gibbo V's and a 500T in the other and I like em.

 

When I first got the Studio I felt a little surprise in the drop in gain of the 498t but was impressed the the warmness, so I may go back to that.

 

I am interested in the 57's because Mastodon have used them and I do find their sound fascinating.

 

I have tried SD JB's but not in Gibsons, not a fan really.

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Mastodon, yeah they sound great, did not know they where using 57´s.

I recently did a swap, i had 490/498 and now i have 57 Classic/Angus Young Signature.

For me it works much better, i am a huge metal fan but i like to have versatile pickups. Now with my new combo

i have exactly the sound i wanted in my les Paul. And for everything with more gain i use a Boss MT-2.

Its sometimes tricky to find the sound you are seeking with this pedal but you can use it for many styles of music.

I personaly like the Angus Young much more than the 498. And i love the 57 tone.

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57's kick butt. Today I was just playing a Derek Trucks sig SG, which I believe has those pups stock. I slammed a suhr riot into an old V4 at a local music store with that sg. I got massive rawk tones out of em. Sounded really great with/without dirt. But I like 57s better than most other Gibby humbucker pickups. I've always felt pickups (at least the bridges) like Bursts were too bright, the 498 was too thin, and Dirtys were too harsh. 57s are where its at.

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I was thinking I need to go the 490 route rather than 57's? I just recently purchased a 2013 Les Paul traditional, and I'm not sure if the previous owner played with the wiring or not but couple of things I noticed. I had 57's that I put in a cheap Epiphone riviera years ago, and I remember the output difference was intense compared to the cheap Epiphone pickups. The sticker on the bottom of the Epi pickups actually said made by Sanyo (the tv&home stereo company). Anyhow I remember the 57's I had sounded hot enough to get some great gain tones. So prior to this Les Paul traditional I was playing Gretsch guitars with real deal TV Jones pickups through my setup which is a vintage Fender Bandmaster and an Xotic SL drive (sometimes various delay or reverbs). But just going only through my overdrive pedal, the Gretsch guitars ,(who's t.v. jones pickups on paper say they are lower output than classic 57's),screamed when I played through my overdrive. I get this Les paul and I'm thinking big hum bucker power, but no. The SL drive with the gain cranked playing the Gretsch gave me more of that saturated distortion sound and when I play through the same set up with my Les Paul the gain actually sounds much weaker, and the pedal sounds more like a light overdrive pedal? Shouldn't the 57, and 57 plus in my traditional be ripping my head off ?compared to t.v. jones filtertrons which are hum buckers as well but has much lower output?

I said that the original owner might have done something because when you dial back the tone control you barely notice anything. You don't get that tone is all the way off muddy sound your supposed to. In fact its barely noticeable at all as if you didn't even have a tone control like the guitar was wired just to the volumes,which it isn't. Everything looks ok. under the hood I'm pretty sure. I checked the pickups and they do have Gibson 57 labels on the bottom along with the traditional silver braided wiring so they are real 57's.

 

I'm just puzzled that the hum buckers of a les paul are creating less overdrive through my overdrive pedal than a filtertron equipt Gretsch that has less output?

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It kind of depends on your playing style. I like the 498T because I tend to play lots of full chords with lots of distortion, so a little extra treble tends to help the notes stay a wee bit more defined. The 498 is asymmetrically wound, which has the effect of making it ever-so-slightly less humbucking, which can add a bit of brightness at the expense of a slight decrease in hum cancelling. The Alnico V magnet also tends to add a bit of treble.

 

I've never really tried 57 classics, but I understand they're a fairly accurate reproduction of the 'average' PAF, which I understand has less treble, more bass, and lower overall output.

 

The best PAF knockoffs I've ever used are the no-name pickups that came in my Orville. They have a certain upper-mid range that I find the average PAF clone lacks. I replaced them with a 490/498 pair, but I'm going to keep them for something else (unlike the other pickups in my spares bin, which will probably be rewound into 490/498 clones).

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If you're after gain the 500t is great! It's hot but not so hot its muddy. They sound great in mahogany with either a rosewood or a ebony fretboard.

I have 57s in one of my pauls and they are great pickups but I don't think they're any hotter than a 498t. Both need an overdrive to really push the front of my Blackstar or a JCM 800. The 500t drove the amp better. I'm kinda old school. I use my 57 classic and plus set thru a MXR badass od into my Blackstar with moderate gain on the od and the amp (halfway). This seems to make the amp more open and musical to me. If you dime the amp and hit it with an od and a hot pickup it compresses too much and loses that open woodiness I like. That's what I like about the 500t its only like 11.2 k or so. Its got that EVH type of paf vibe but with a ceramic. It gets hot but it doesn't get too dark.

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IMHO the classic 57 is still the best thing around. It is one of those pickups I never regret putting in and once I put them in, I never give a thought about taking them out again. There are certainly some others out there that I have liked the tone of, (the Bare Knuckle Stormy Monday's, SD Pearly Gates and Seth Lover models), their versatility never ceases to amaze.

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I was thinking I need to go the 490 route rather than 57's? I just recently purchased a 2013 Les Paul traditional, and I'm not sure if the previous owner played with the wiring or not but couple of things I noticed. I had 57's that I put in a cheap Epiphone riviera years ago, and I remember the output difference was intense compared to the cheap Epiphone pickups. The sticker on the bottom of the Epi pickups actually said made by Sanyo (the tv&home stereo company). Anyhow I remember the 57's I had sounded hot enough to get some great gain tones. So prior to this Les Paul traditional I was playing Gretsch guitars with real deal TV Jones pickups through my setup which is a vintage Fender Bandmaster and an Xotic SL drive (sometimes various delay or reverbs). But just going only through my overdrive pedal, the Gretsch guitars ,(who's t.v. jones pickups on paper say they are lower output than classic 57's),screamed when I played through my overdrive. I get this Les paul and I'm thinking big hum bucker power, but no. The SL drive with the gain cranked playing the Gretsch gave me more of that saturated distortion sound and when I play through the same set up with my Les Paul the gain actually sounds much weaker, and the pedal sounds more like a light overdrive pedal? Shouldn't the 57, and 57 plus in my traditional be ripping my head off ?compared to t.v. jones filtertrons which are hum buckers as well but has much lower output?

I said that the original owner might have done something because when you dial back the tone control you barely notice anything. You don't get that tone is all the way off muddy sound your supposed to. In fact its barely noticeable at all as if you didn't even have a tone control like the guitar was wired just to the volumes,which it isn't. Everything looks ok. under the hood I'm pretty sure. I checked the pickups and they do have Gibson 57 labels on the bottom along with the traditional silver braided wiring so they are real 57's.

 

I'm just puzzled that the hum buckers of a les paul are creating less overdrive through my overdrive pedal than a filtertron equipt Gretsch that has less output?

 

I have a 2012 Traditional and found a very similar thing to what you are describing. I liked the original 57's as they were very versatile up and until I needed the creamy gain tone, then they just wouldnt go there for me and Im playing through a marshall dsl. So I was disappointed. But I was even more disappointed when I put in a set of Aldrich pups and didnt find that big of an improvement, if at all in the gain dept. Very disappointing. Ive heard other traditionals with 57's that are able to get there but mine wont/cant. Im turning to a pedal, something I never had to consider with my wolfgang.

 

If anyone has any helpful hints or suggestions I would appreciate it.

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I would also maybe suggest looking elsewhere than 57 Classics, purely down to the sounds from the bands you're describing. If you want your guitar to always sound kind of like you want every time you plug in, look at pickups designed more for your sound. Don't go as heavy as you have, look for something in between so that you can get the lighter tones when you want them, but they'll stay tight when you go full out.

 

That being said you probably could get close with 57's and some pedal magic, but if you are looking to have a guitar that always sounds great with certain kinds of gain, look at pickups designed for that.

 

Maybe check out Bare Knuckle Pickups? https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/pickups.php?cat=humbuckers

Tim has always been a great help to me when I've been stuck.

 

 

(Just adding in, I do love 57 Classics, I have a 57 Classic and Classic Plus in one of my SGs and they're great, but they work well for what I'm looking for.)

 

Cheers!

Ryan

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hi

i am happy with my 498t with distorsion because i have some really good harmonics and feedback > harmonics !! really good

 

in the clean sound, it's really not good :(

 

but i only have an Epiphone

 

i don't have a les paul axcess: a dream :))

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