meanstreak Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 I have heard that you can use sunlight to darken the top of a guitar. Has anyone actually done this? I have a guitar with tan lines where I removed the pick guard and some stickers the previous owner put on. I'd like to try to get it all back to even again. Also, if it dies work, does it need to be in direct sunlight or can I leave it near this glass block window? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted July 10, 2014 Share Posted July 10, 2014 Never direct sunlight, but if you hang a blonde guitar on a wall in a normally bright room it will slowly and evenly amber. Not enough light would ever pass through the blockto do any harm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Never direct sunlight, but if you hang a blonde guitar on a wall in a normally bright room it will slowly and evenly amber. Not enough light would ever pass through the blockto do any harm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Guy Posted July 11, 2014 Share Posted July 11, 2014 Personally I'd NEVER EVER leave a guitar in direct sunlight. But leaving it out on a stand during the day in "normal" natural light conditions definitely speeds up the top's darkening process anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubee Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I don't get the never ever putting a guitar in direct sunlight. Direct sunlight won't hurt a guitar but high heat will. Not an issue if you are talking conditions that you personally could tolerate, e.g. playing a guitar in direct sun on a reasonable summer day. If it gets hot to the touch its too hot for the guitar, just like it is for you. I did age an HD-35 with a new bright top by laying it on a picnic table in direct sunlight on a 70F day with a nice breeze. I sat there reading a book and did a few runs for about 30 minutes each. It made a dramatic difference in the tops appearance. Getting the 'tan line' to completely merge in color with the rest of the top will be your big challenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I don't get the never ever putting a guitar in direct sunlight. Direct sunlight won't hurt a guitar but high heat will. Not an issue if you are talking conditions that you personally could tolerate, e.g. playing a guitar in direct sun on a reasonable summer day. If it gets hot to the touch its too hot for the guitar, just like it is for you. I did age an HD-35 with a new bright top by laying it on a picnic table in direct sunlight on a 70F day with a nice breeze. I sat there reading a book and did a few runs for about 30 minutes each. It made a dramatic difference in the tops appearance. Getting the 'tan line' to completely merge in color with the rest of the top will be your big challenge. The very thing about sunlight is its spectral content. The Earth's atmosphere lets pass radio frequencies and everything from infrared (IR) to near ultraviolet (UV). IR means heat including all of its consequences like drying out and warping, and UV means deterioration and decomposition of most substances, and in many cases oxidation through oxygene. Behind a closed window, there's next to now UV left but practically all the IR. Glass eats up far more than 99% of the UV. Outdoors with a nice breeze, you will get all the UV with a certain attenuation of IR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I had my acoustic barytone sun-bathing last year - as a project. It was so anemic from birth, it made me run out of blood myself. And the guitar actually got a vague tone warmer by August. This year it's the Firebird, which is too pale for my taste too - they are both natural blondes. The robust German built Lakewood barytone was placed in direct sun behind an open window and didn't suffer. Of course it mustn't overheat, but I believe summer is a bit calmer here than many other places in the world. On particular hot days it was removed. The F-bird isn't lying under direct sun-rays, but is standing up in the sofa near by 24/7. Not sure how far we are at this point - the proces is gearless and obviously hard to follow. Let's see where its at in mid September. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyd Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I got my 2008 J-50 about 6 months ago and the top was really very white. I have used direct outdoor sunlight to age it, being careful to limit exposure and not allow it to get too hot. I don't see or hear any damage to the guitar as a result of this, so I can't agree with the people saying not to use direct sunlight. I think capmaster is right - there is almost no UV in the light that comes through a window. It would surely take a long time to have any significant effect. I sat there reading a book and did a few runs for about 30 minutes each. It made a dramatic difference in the tops appearance. You're saying that an hour or two in direct sunlight made a dramatic difference in the color of the guitar? Wow, it must have a very different finish than my J-50. Or maybe a new guitar where the finish hasn't completely cured behaves differently? I have exposed my J-50 to more than 100 hours of direct mid-day sun and would say that the color change is subtle, not "dramatic". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 MeanStreak, I would embrace the shading differences on your guitar - if it is a high end one - as part of its character. Having seen the damage direct sunlight does on various materials from dashboards to fences to my face, I would never use it on a good guitar. You don't know what it will do to the different materials. If you must - put some sunblock on the section you don't want to get sunburned and maybe it will even out :). I've removed the pg on a 64 LG1 and am certain there will always be a subtle difference. But - I think it adds mojo. If I wanted an evenly colored top - I'd get a J45TV which is shipped with the PG in the case, not glued on. G'Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 This is getting interesting - I have to add that the open window in front of my barytone guitar was the upper one (for aircondition). Which means the top took its hue through glass. Well, , , according to capm. it might have gone darker with 'un-filtered' sun-contact. What do I know - he's probably right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phelonious Ponk Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 People who put stickers on guitars should be shot on sight. With that said, as it darkens the tan lines might become subtler, but it's all going to darken together unless you mask off everything but the guard and sticker spots, so I doubt you'll ever get rid of it altogether. P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubee Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 [[You're saying that an hour or two in direct sunlight made a dramatic difference in the color of the guitar? Wow, it must have a very different finish than my J-50. Or maybe a new guitar where the finish hasn't completely cured behaves differently? I have exposed my J-50 to more than 100 hours of direct mid-day sun and would say that the color change is subtle, not "dramatic".]] I was there for a week and sat with it several times so maybe 10 'outings'? It was a 1989 HD-35 that was about a year old and real white. It started to turn that week and continued to become 'vintage looking' after I left. I touched the top while sunning it to make sure it didn't get too hot. I find the thought that guitars must avoid direct sunlight to be downright astonishing and plainly not true. I've played nitro finished guitars for over 40 years in sunlight with never a problem...and I'm talking outdoor sunlight. I keep my guitars from getting overheated but have never even thought about sunlight other than "hey, it's a nice day!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 People who put stickers on guitars should be shot on sight. With that said, as it darkens the tan lines might become subtler, but it's all going to darken together unless you mask off everything but the guard and sticker spots, so I doubt you'll ever get rid of it altogether. P Not to digress - but cases too. Well, maybe not shot. Horse whipped? I have the remaining discoloration and chemical alteration on my SJ200's original case from the original owner - nothing will take it off. I agree - based on limited experience with a couple of tops - the tan lines will blur over time - making for a nice look. If you like seeing tan lines. On guitars, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hall Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Put it under a sodium vapor lamp. It'll bloom in two weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I'd imagine that newer nitro-cell finishes have different UV deflective qualities than ol' timey padding lacquers. Better or worse at protecting the wood? Don't know, but I'm particularly overprotective of my elderlies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aster1 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I don't get the never ever putting a guitar in direct sunlight. Direct sunlight won't hurt a guitar but high heat will. Not an issue if you are talking conditions that you personally could tolerate, e.g. playing a guitar in direct sun on a reasonable summer day. If it gets hot to the touch its too hot for the guitar, just like it is for you. I did age an HD-35 with a new bright top by laying it on a picnic table in direct sunlight on a 70F day with a nice breeze. I sat there reading a book and did a few runs for about 30 minutes each. It made a dramatic difference in the tops appearance. Getting the 'tan line' to completely merge in color with the rest of the top will be your big challenge. I would have to presume that the UV & near UV in sunlight can yellow or fog the nitro clear lacquer or speed up the craze effect or spider cracks. Don't how long or how much it would take. Just indirect light still has enough near UV to darken the wood & bindings though. I do remember reading on the new Ric clear coat finish that it is a UV stabilized version of Conversion Varnish that hold up well. All my newer Rics have great finishes to them. Thanks John Hall!! Aster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 After cooking hundreds of frozen pizzas in the oven, I still have trouble getting them just right. No way I'd try to cook my Gibsons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 After cooking hundreds of frozen pizzas in the oven, I still have trouble getting them just right. No way I'd try to cook my Gibsons. lol. well said. I've been reading this thread and wondering what you're all on . :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyd Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 After cooking hundreds of frozen pizzas in the oven, I still have trouble getting them just right. No way I'd try to cook my Gibsons. I agree; don't put your Gibson in the oven. Stop eating those frozen pizzas also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nodehopper Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Wouldn't this technique also yellow the white binding on sides and fretboard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Wouldn't this technique also yellow the white binding on sides and fretboard? Yes...the desired 'vintage' vibe. I have to admit to purposely darkening both tuner buttons and saddles too with weak tea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Wouldn't this technique also yellow the white binding on sides and fretboard? An important question as it concerns the lacquer factor as a contributor to the overall top hue. And who on earth can tell what is what in which percentages on a sun-tanned spruce top. Well, a look on the bindings might provide some king of abstract clue, , , but still. . My take is that the blank blonde wood darkens sooner than the nitro bends towards yellow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L8_4thesh0w Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 An important question as it concerns the lacquer factor as a contributor to the overall top hue. And who on earth can tell what is what in which percentages on a sun-tanned spruce top. Well, a look on the bindings might provide some king of abstract clue, , , but still. . My take is that the blank blonde wood darkens sooner than the nitro bends towards yellow. I question several of the scenarios offered, the first of which is the "through glass" idea. It could be that European and US glass differ in composition, but I have watched the books on my bookshelves gradually fade from years of sunlight through the windows. UV light is what removes the color from things, except for our skin where the effect is the opposite. Wood by itself actually begins to turn gray over time. I think it may be the finish which is doing the actual darkening, but I'm no expert so don't take this as factually correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted July 13, 2014 Share Posted July 13, 2014 I question several of the scenarios offered, the first of which is the "through glass" idea. It could be that European and US glass differ in composition, but I have watched the books on my bookshelves gradually fade from years of sunlight through the windows. UV light is what removes the color from things, except for our skin where the effect is the opposite. Wood by itself actually begins to turn gray over time. I think it may be the finish which is doing the actual darkening, but I'm no expert so don't take this as factually correct. Books, magazines and posters have always suffered in store-windows etc. in this part of the world. They are typically seen with the black and cyan (blue) as the surviving colour* where magenta (dark-red) and yellow are the vulnerable faders. But print-ink (or what you call it) is not natural spruce wood. And wouldn't furniture in fx oak or spruce get warmer over time. My speakers - which I had since May 1973, hehehe - still have their original oak-light-brown. But they must have gone more vintage heavy or full over the years. *I know some wouldn't define black as a colour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajay Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 I heard a horror story of a guy trying to age the tone and look of his Gibson. Maybe on here. He lived in New Mexico, and left it sit in direct sunlight with no humidification. Apparently the top bowed, braces popped loose, and he basically totaled his guitar. I have a 12 year old Ajay, and the bindings are getting a cool darker look just living in the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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