Yet another Lifeson Axcess question

[yazdog8]

I've done a bunch of reading on issues with the Lifeson Axcess in this forum. I purchased mine in July (ebony model) and have been really happy with the instrument so far.

 

I did however notice something odd last night when I was using the Piezo (Life O Sound) output. I had the regular output feeding into a Hi Tone JP30 and the Piezo output going to a Fishman Loudbox. When both inputs were active, there was a noticeable hum, especially to the Hi Tone. When I unplugged the output on the LifeOSound/Piezo, the hum stopped.

 

Has anyone experienced this before? I'm going to try a new 9V tonight to see if maybe that will help but otherwise I'm stumped.

[capmaster]

Hello Yazdog, and welcome here.

 

As a hybrid guitar addict, I use lots of them. Like with all the others featuring only one stereo jack each, I just use the "Regular" output of my Alex Lifeson Les Paul Axcess, for mono and stereo applications as well.

 

In my band setup, there are two separate amps. Here's the problem with any hybrid guitar, not just the Alex Lifeson Axcess: Connecting them to two amps will create a ground loop with the guitar or in my case already the TRS/2 TS split cable as junction.

 

My acoustic guitar amp is a double-insulated model and thus features a ground lift switch I use as a ground loop breaker.

 

In case your acoustic guitar amp doesn't have a ground lift switch, you will have to use a DI box between guitar and one of the amps.

 

Please leave all the line connectors alone. Trying to break ground loops via power supply path may be lethal.

[yazdog8]

Capmaster,

 

Thanks for your reply! It makes a lot of sense, thanks. A couple of quick questions in this vein:

 

1) Do you recommend any DI boxes for this purpose?

2) Would going wireless take care of the ground loop problem?

3) What is your stereo setup?

 

I appreciate it! This is the first time I've had a hybrid and the nuances are numerous!

 

 

-YD

[capmaster]

Capmaster,

 

Thanks for your reply! It makes a lot of sense, thanks. A couple of quick questions in this vein:

 

1) Do you recommend any DI boxes for this purpose?

2) Would going wireless take care of the ground loop problem?

3) What is your stereo setup?

 

I appreciate it! This is the first time I've had a hybrid and the nuances are numerous!

 

 

-YD

You're welcome, mate.

 

I have to say that salespeople never told me about the ground loop problem, but I know it well for decades and asked no questions about that. However, I'm wondering why not all the manufacturers of acoustic amps build them according to double-insulation regulations which allow for building-in a ground lift switch.

 

Now to your questions:

 

1) No special recommendations here. Since I feed signals to recorders featuring phantom power, I only use active ones and don't have experiences with passives. A quality product by Radial or Jenson Transformers should do. The phantom powered models I use are BSS AR-133 and Radial PRO48.

 

2) Going wireless will be of help, of course. You will have to use two transmitters. I don't know of any stereo model, and a stereo receiver would call for a DI box then.

 

3) For magnetic pickup signals, I use a Behringer V-Amp Pro into a Behringer A500 stereo power amplifier driving two Marshall 1912 cabinets with a 1980's ElectroVoice EVM 12 L each. The piezo tones go into a Schertler JAM 150 amp which has a ground lift switch.

[capmaster]

It's crazy... I found just one product exactly matching your need, and I couldn't find a source for it in the USA:

 

http://www.palmer-germany.com/pro/en/PLI-01-Line-Isolation-Box-1-Channel-PLI01.htm

[capmaster]

The ARTcessories CleanBOX II offers two channels while you just need one. It also will cause a significant insertion loss - I know it in person:

 

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/CleanBoxII

[yazdog8]

Thanks! I'll try to find one.

 

Would this work as well?

 

http://www.radialeng.com/prodi.php

 

It's crazy... I found just one product exactly matching your need, and I couldn't find a source for it in the USA:

 

http://www.palmer-germany.com/pro/en/PLI-01-Line-Isolation-Box-1-Channel-PLI01.htm

[capmaster]

Thanks! I'll try to find one.

 

Would this work as well?

 

http://www.radialeng.com/prodi.php

It will put out a low-Z signal and thus decrease level along with impedance. OK, that's what most DI boxes do, but there seem to be only very few with an 1:1 audio transformer in them...

 

You would need about 26 dB of makeup gain when using this one. This is a hell of a lot... :(

[capmaster]

May I ask what setup you are using? If your acoustic amp provides phantom power, you could use an active DI box which puts out full signal voltage and provides attenuation if needed, like a Radial PRO48. It's a nice unit.

[yazdog8]

May I ask what setup you are using? If your acoustic amp provides phantom power, you could use an active DI box which puts out full signal voltage and provides attenuation if needed, like a Radial PRO48. It's a nice unit.

 

 

So right now the acoustic amp is a Fishman Loudbox Mini. No phantom power. http://www.fishman.com/product/loudbox-mini

The electric amp is a Hi Tone JP 30 and in front of that are various stomp boxes.

[capmaster]

So right now the acoustic amp is a Fishman Loudbox Mini. No phantom power. http://www.fishman.com/product/loudbox-mini

The electric amp is a Hi Tone JP 30 and in front of that are various stomp boxes.

Sorry, my fault, forgot to reread your post #1... Please apologize.

 

However, I just searched the Palmer homepage and found this:

 

http://www.palmer-germany.com/pro/en/Dealer-Search.htm

 

Until today I didn't even know that Palmer is a German manufacturer.

[yazdog8]

I emailed them to see if they sold the items you recommended in the US. Waiting to hear back.

 

Thanks for the help, I appreciate it!

 

Sorry, my fault, forgot to reread your post #1... Please apologize.

 

However, I just searched the Palmer homepage and found this:

 

http://www.palmer-germany.com/pro/en/Dealer-Search.htm

 

Until today I didn't even know that Palmer is a German manufacturer.

[capmaster]

Just researched Thomann's user reviews on the Palmer PLI-01. The one rated most helpful was a top rating written by a hybrid guitar player using it between piezo output and amp.

 

Here's a quote of the single English review on the Thomann website, also rating five out of five stars:

 

"This little box from Palmer does what you would expect and does it very well! I have used it in a couple of different positions in my signal chain: after my effects and between my master amp and its slave where I had previously noticed noise being introduced, my signal is now crystal clear and with no noticable side effects (volume loss etc). I'll be purchasing a couple more in the near future."

 

Hope this helps.

[yazdog8]

Just researched Thomann's user reviews on the Palmer PLI-01. The one rated most helpful was a top rating written by a hybrid guitar player using it between piezo output and amp.

 

Here's a quote of the single English review on the Thomann website, also rating five out of five stars:

 

"This little box from Palmer does what you would expect and does it very well! I have used it in a couple of different positions in my signal chain: after my effects and between my master amp and its slave where I had previously noticed noise being introduced, my signal is now crystal clear and with no noticable side effects (volume loss etc). I'll be purchasing a couple more in the near future."

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

It does! Hopefully they respond with some information on how to buy in the states.

 

Thanks for the help!