coltcraft Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Want to bring this baby back to near as possible original spec. Looking for original or period correct tuners, bridge, saddle and trussrod cover. Any advice would be most helpful. Thx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Pictures of what you have on it now would be helpful in figuring out the best approach, and exactly what you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Tuners would be enclosed double line three on a plate Klusons. I have some enclosed Kluson strip tuners in my parts box but do not think I have any that date that late. But they are easy enough to find on eBay. While I am not really up on my square shoulder Gibsons, I am pretty sure the bridge would be one of those really big bottom belly affairs (with huge bridge plate to match). I am also pretty sure they still had the adjustable saddle. You could try places that sell parts like Music Man Steve's site. Again, eBay is another place to look. On the TRC, I am not sure if they were putting the model on them in 1969 or not. But I would think any Gibson TRC will work. Regarding the saddle, I am not quite sure I ever ran into anybody looking for an "original." As j45nick noted, it is always easier to deal with this kind of stuff when there are some photos. Just an opinion but why bother replacing the parts that are on the guitar unless they have issues or are Quasimodo ugly. The orignal parts are long gone and there is really nothing about the period parts that makes them desirable. You can get modern tuners that look right and will work better and a belly bridge that has less mass to it. The original saddles are generally long gone by the time you get the guitar or if still there need to be replaced. Stewmac and tons of other places offer them made of various materials. But it is your guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 Pictures of what you have on it now would be helpful in figuring out the best approach, and exactly what you need. Agreed. I will try to post some pics. Thx for the reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 Tuners would be enclosed double line three on a plate Klusons. I have some enclosed Kluson strip tuners in my parts box but do not think I have any that date that late. But they are easy enough to find on eBay. While I am not really up on my square shoulder Gibsons, I am pretty sure the bridge would be one of those really big bottom belly affairs (with huge bridge plate to match). I am also pretty sure they still had the adjustable saddle. You could try places that sell parts like Music Man Steve's site. Again, eBay is another place to look. On the TRC, I am not sure if they were putting the model on them in 1969 or not. But I would think any Gibson TRC will work. Regarding the saddle, I am not quite sure I ever ran into anybody looking for an "original." As j45nick noted, it is always easier to deal with this kind of stuff when there are some photos. Just an opinion but why bother replacing the parts that are on the guitar unless they have issues or are Quasimodo ugly. The orignal parts are long gone and there is really nothing about the period parts that makes them desirable. You can get modern tuners that look right and will work better and a belly bridge that has less mass to it. The original saddles are generally long gone by the time you get the guitar or if still there need to be replaced. Stewmac and tons of other places offer them made of various materials. But it is your guitar. I have the gold single enclosed Klusons on it. They were swapped out at one time (I imagine) by the previous owner and I think they look just plain wrong. Quasimodo is about right. I like your idea of getting modern hardware on it. I just want it to look appropriate for the age and style of the guitar. The gold ones don't. I thought the originals were 3x3 enclosed Kluson strips as you said, but wasn't sure. I was hoping that they were open-back type originals. New open back vintage-look tuners may look good on it however. I'm wondering about the bridge. I have seen many photos with the bulky adjustable bridge/saddle combo. This one is of "normal" size with fixed non compensated saddle (almost Martin-like). If this is not an original bridge/saddle combo, would the massive bridge plate have been removed and replaced for a smaller one? I will try to post a few picks. Thx again for the reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 The bridge looks like a standard Gibson so it is what most folks would opt for when replacing the bulkier ADJ model. I would be willimg to bet the original bridge plate is still in there as most do not even think about it. Out of sight out of mind. It is not, however, a necessity to replace it. But with the bridge swapped you could go with the older style standard maple bridge plate if you wanted to. Gotta agree on the tuners. I am also not a fan of gold tuners and do not care for the tulp buttons. Again, you can find original 1960s Gibson three on a plate double line tuners pretty easily on eBay. Stewmac carries a repro set although I want to say they are single line versions. You might just check to see what other kind of vintage style Kluson tuners Gotoh is offering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 15, 2014 Author Share Posted November 15, 2014 The bridge looks like a standard Gibson so it is what most folks would opt for when replacing the bulkier ADJ model. I would be willimg to bet the original bridge plate is still in there as most do not even think about it. Out of sight out of mind. It is not, however, a necessity to replace it. But with the bridge swapped you could go with the older style standard maple bridge plate if you wanted to. Gotta agree on the tuners. I am also not a fan of gold tuners and do not care for the tulp buttons. Again, you can find original 1960s Gibson three on a plate double line tuners pretty easily on eBay. Stewmac carries a repro set although I want to say they are single line versions. You might just check to see what other kind of vintage style Kluson tuners Gotoh is offering. What do you think about a strip of open back tuners like these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 What do you think about a strip of open back tuners like these? They will certainly work but the originals would have been enclosed strip tuners. These start showing up on Gibsons in the late 1940s. Again, originals are plentiful and cheap but the repros will probably be a better choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 15, 2014 Author Share Posted November 15, 2014 They will certainly work but the originals would have been enclosed strip tuners. These start showing up on Gibsons in the late 1940s. Again, originals are plentiful and cheap but the repros will probably be a better choice. Ok thx Zomby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 As far as I know Gibson never used 3 screw tr-covers, but from here it looks as if there's only the upper one in for now. That'll make the switch easy - question is if you can find the type sayin' J-50. Worth a try, but a plain black with white edge will do. I believe the bridge could be the orginal. One of the first of its kind. However, , , , ehhhh got to say I have the feeling the guitar is younger than 1969 - meaning the 70's somewhere (which could mean other tuners than the mentioned). Maybe it's just me, but are you sure about year of birth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 Error - I now see there were 3-screw covers in the 70's. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyd Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 What do you think about a strip of open back tuners like these? Probably not what you want, but FWIW I put some of these on my 2008 J-50: http://forum.gibson.com/index.php?/topic/111365-ntd-new-tuners-day/page__p__1505571__fromsearch__1#entry1505571 I got the ones with the aged buttons and bell ends though. The scalloped end ones were a little long and would have covered up the serial number. No interest in being historically accurate, I just liked the way they looked. Honestly, the action on these leaves a bit to be desired though… The original tuners from my 1974 J-50 were never very good. One of them broke 20 years ago and I had replaced it with something that didn't match at all. So a couple years ago when I had some major work done, I replaced them all with Gibson vintage-style tuners. They work really well and look exactly like the originals but they have plastic knobs instead of metal. From what has been said here though, I guess the 1969 J-50 used a different style tuner. http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/PMMH010?adpos=1o1&creative=55397627521&device=c&matchtype=&network=g&gclid=CM7P_Y-6_cECFYUF7AodfCkAuA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 However, , , , ehhhh got to say I have the feeling the guitar is younger than 1969 - meaning the 70's somewhere (which could mean other tuners than the mentioned). If the pickguard is original I would not think 1970s. 1970 is when the teardrop shaped scratchplate starts showing up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 If the pickguard is original I would not think 1970s. 1970 is when the teardrop shaped scratchplate starts showing up. Yea, but they are re-introduced on the Deluxe models pretty early in the decade. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 15, 2014 Author Share Posted November 15, 2014 I triple checked the serial no. when I bought it. It's a 1969 and the pickguard is original. It is a J50 Deluxe with double tortoise shell binding and binding "rot" is in full swing. Will need to address this soon too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 15, 2014 Author Share Posted November 15, 2014 Probably not what you want, but FWIW I put some of these on my 2008 J-50: http://forum.gibson.com/index.php?/topic/111365-ntd-new-tuners-day/page__p__1505571__fromsearch__1#entry1505571 I got the ones with the aged buttons and bell ends though. The scalloped end ones were a little long and would have covered up the serial number. No interest in being historically accurate, I just liked the way they looked. Honestly, the action on these leaves a bit to be desired though… The original tuners from my 1974 J-50 were never very good. One of them broke 20 years ago and I had replaced it with something that didn't match at all. So a couple years ago when I had some major work done, I replaced them all with Gibson vintage-style tuners. They work really well and look exactly like the originals but they have plastic knobs instead of metal. From what has been said here though, I guess the 1969 J-50 used a different style tuner. http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/PMMH010?adpos=1o1&creative=55397627521&device=c&matchtype=&network=g&gclid=CM7P_Y-6_cECFYUF7AodfCkAuA Sorry Boyd. I don't like these on Gibsons for some reason. Ok for Martins (I have these on my '74 D18) though. I want to go towards a 3x strip tuner, just debating open or closed..... Thx for the input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 I triple checked the serial no. when I bought it. It's a 1969 and the pickguard is original. It is a J50 Deluxe with double tortoise shell binding and binding "rot" is in full swing. Will need to address this soon too. Okay - it must be one of the absolutely first then. Is there a Made In USA on the back of the headstock ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 15, 2014 Author Share Posted November 15, 2014 Okay - it must be one of the absolutely first then. Is there a Made In USA on the back of the headstock ? Yes lightly embossed under a fairly thick coat of nitro! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted November 15, 2014 Share Posted November 15, 2014 Yes lightly embossed under a fairly thick coat of nitro! Not to jump around your cloud, but with that square/modern label, I would check the serial # once more - http://home.provide.net/~cfh/gibson.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 16, 2014 Author Share Posted November 16, 2014 Not to jump around your cloud, but with that square/modern label, I would check the serial # once more - http://home.provide.net/~cfh/gibson.html Thx Em7. Here is the number: 603923. Thx for the input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 16, 2014 Author Share Posted November 16, 2014 The bridge looks like a standard Gibson so it is what most folks would opt for when replacing the bulkier ADJ model. I would be willimg to bet the original bridge plate is still in there as most do not even think about it. Out of sight out of mind. It is not, however, a necessity to replace it. But with the bridge swapped you could go with the older style standard maple bridge plate if you wanted to. Gotta agree on the tuners. I am also not a fan of gold tuners and do not care for the tulp buttons. Again, you can find original 1960s Gibson three on a plate double line tuners pretty easily on eBay. Stewmac carries a repro set although I want to say they are single line versions. You might just check to see what other kind of vintage style Kluson tuners Gotoh is offering. Curious to know if swapping out the massive bridge plate to s aimpler maple plate will improve the tone, especially in the trebles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Thx Em7. Here is the number: 603923. Thx for the input. Wauw, , , you are in the avantgarde - time for me to REST my case. . ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 16, 2014 Author Share Posted November 16, 2014 Wauw, , , you are in the avantgarde - time for me to REST my case. . ;-) LOL :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Not to jump around your cloud, but with that square/modern label, I would check the serial # once more - http://home.provide.net/~cfh/gibson.html I'm leaning with Em7 on this. As far as I can tell, that rectangular label did not come in until 1970. 1969 should still have had the oval orange label with "union made" on it. Likewise, the "made in USA" stamp says 1970-1975 or so. Virtually every six-digit serial number from the 1960's was replicated between 1970 and 1975. That fixed bridge looks original to me, and I don't think they came back in until the early 70's. It makes no difference for purposes of the value of the instrument, as this is a full-on Norlin-era long-scale dread no matter what. If I were the owner, I would want to pin down the year just to know. It shouldn't make him love it any less, if it's a great-sounding guitar. By the way, that crumbling tortoise binding is celluloid doing what it does, and it should be replaced before it damages the guitar, if you care for it. A close-up of the label and the back of the headstock, showing the headstock from the top to where it joins the neck, should let us pin this down pretty definitively. Edit: Posted this before I saw the serial number. That serial number, combined with the other features, probably means 1970-1972 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltcraft Posted November 16, 2014 Author Share Posted November 16, 2014 I'm leaning with Em7 on this. As far as I can tell, that rectangular label did not come in until 1970. 1969 should still have had the oval orange label with "union made" on it. Likewise, the "made in USA" stamp says 1970-1975 or so. Virtually every six-digit serial number from the 1960's was replicated between 1970 and 1975. That fixed bridge looks original to me, and I don't think they came back in until the early 70's. It makes no difference for purposes of the value of the instrument, as this is a full-on Norlin-era long-scale dread no matter what. If I were the owner, I would want to pin down the year just to know. It shouldn't make him love it any less, if it's a great-sounding guitar. By the way, that crumbling tortoise binding is celluloid doing what it does, and it should be replaced before it damages the guitar, if you care for it. A close-up of the label and the back of the headstock, showing the headstock from the top to where it joins the neck, should let us pin this down pretty definitively. I'm going strictly by the serial no. as I know little but some of vintage Gibson acoustics, but am learning thanks to you guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.