I need a push in the right direction

[fumblefingers]

Lars....my 2 cents> No matter what your vocal talent is...or is not, doesn't really matter. Sing with what you have and who you are. There's plenty of "pretty" voices out there, and a few that are not... but are real> Dylan is a great example!

 

And it is very subjective, too. I happen to love Neil Young's voice, but many do not. He's been made fun of plenty. I happen to not care for Dylan's voice. Also, while Mariah Carey has been touted as exceptionally gifted vocally, her voice is like nails on a chalkboard to me. I can't listen to anything she sings. It's almost like she's trying to show off her vocal range and forgot how to sing. Like the Yngwie Malmsteen of female singers. :lol:

[Wetdog]

Practicing voice is like practicing any other instrument. Have a routine. Warm up, do scales and arpeggios, then songs. I like to practice voice with a keyboard even though I'm primarily a guitarist. If you are new(er) to the finer points of guitar playing, and I mean things like scales in every key and arpeggios up and down the neck, the names of all the notes on the fretboard etc. you may find a keyboard really helpful. For one thing you will be learning the fundamentals of keyboard. So for instance the white notes C to C are the "C" major scale (do re me fa so la ti do scale). C is the note to the left of the two black notes. White notes A to A are the "A" natural scale. Again with the white keys, every other note played together gives you the basic chords of the key of C. i.e. C E G is the C major triad. Realize also, and this is IMPORTANT, as you do this you are also training your ear(s).

 

Sing along and practice the do re me scale up and down. Then try two octaves. Then try some triads. C E G, E G B, B D F, F A C, G B D, A C E, B D F. Next, and this is challenging for me, learn to play on the keyboard the melody of the song you want to sing. Then if you really want to become more musically acute, learn the notes on the staff of music paper. Whoa, the next thing you know, you'll be reading music! It takes a lot of practice but if you do this, or even some of this, you will get better-guaranteed. You are now becoming a "musician."

 

Sound boring? In some ways it is but so is getting your stance right when learning to hit a baseball. As you learn more you'll learn how to play the other keys on the keyboard by adding sharps and flats. You will be amazed at how this will improve your musicianship, on voice, guitar, and keyboard. As a musician and a sometimes music teacher, it has always been my belief that all musicians no matter what instrument they play (remember your voice is an instrument) including percussion, or what style of music they play, should also know the fundamentals of the keyboard. It always blows my mind how after I play my piano for a while then go back to guitar, how my insight into harmony and melody has improved. B)

[flatbaroque]

Lars I liked that song the first time you posted it.Still do.

Don't overthink it as far as vocals.If you can stay in tune........that's enough.We all doubt our vocal abilities.I hate listening to myself at times...but i'm still willing to inflict my warbling on others

[jannusguy2]

And it is very subjective, too. I happen to love Neil Young's voice, but many do not. He's been made fun of plenty. I happen to not care for Dylan's voice. Also, while Mariah Carey has been touted as exceptionally gifted vocally, her voice is like nails on a chalkboard to me. I can't listen to anything she sings. It's almost like she's trying to show off her vocal range and forgot how to sing. Like the Yngwie Malmsteen of female singers. :lol:

Great comparisons! I can't stand Carey or Malmsteen.

[BluesKing777]

Hee Hee!

 

 

Try this easy one to sing......

 

 

 

 

 

 

If that don't work for you, I put in a request at Stefan Grossman Guitar Workshop for an appropriate lesson - see link - may take a while but!

 

 

http://stefangrossmansguitarworkshop.yuku.com/topic/4444/Vocals-for-Guitarists-lesson-Stefan#.VKFkS4tWAJA

 

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

[62burst]

Nice push of the reset button on the topic of singing, BK^7. The signature riff in that Skip James/Newport recording recalls the campfire scene in "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" :

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyqxV7jc7O0

 

So... when's your trip down into The Delta? ; )

[j45nick]

Hee Hee!

 

Try this easy one to sing......

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

Ever the comedian, ain't you? I'd get a hernia half a bar into this.

[j45nick]

Nice push of the reset button on the topic of singing, BK^7. The signature riff in that Skip James/Newport recording recalls the campfire scene in "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" :

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyqxV7jc7O0

 

So... when's your trip down into The Delta? ; )

 

 

That movie was great on many levels, but the soundtrack was nothing short of superb.

[BluesKing777]

Well, Lars wanted a push, he said, and Skip could be a 'shove'......

 

If you follow my other link to Stefan's GW, one of the replies to my request has a video with a simple method to find your voice range - the video is imbedded in the thread so I couldn't copy it (well on my iPadus, I couldn't).

 

If I had done a simple test like that in 1975, I would never have attempted those screaming and now embarrassing tunes in a totally wrong key for me, and even better I may NOT have attempted them at a pub in a band!

 

AND I have some of Skip's guitar down, but that vocal is classified under 'Never'.

 

PS....in the Skip video, they are probably in some kind of green room waiting to play at Newport, so the other guys are blues guys with the big guy at the front looking a lot like the Wolf.....

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

[Lars68]

Hee Hee!

 

 

Try this easy one to sing......

 

 

 

 

 

 

If that don't work for you, I put in a request at Stefan Grossman Guitar Workshop for an appropriate lesson - see link - may take a while but!

 

 

http://stefangrossmansguitarworkshop.yuku.com/topic/4444/Vocals-for-Guitarists-lesson-Stefan#.VKFkS4tWAJ

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

Thanks a lot! I'll get around to singing the song in the first link tomorrow :-)

 

I also like to share something that I found out today while practicing singing and playing. You might think I'm kidding, but I'm dead serious. I found it a lot easier to tell if my singing was in pitch if I leaned back in the sofa, pressing the guitar fairly tightly to my body while playing. It was like my body, and the guitar body pressing against me, vibrated together when I got it right. Pretty cool actually. I'm pretty skinny, which might help, not much insulation between my lungs and ribs and the back of the guitar :-)

 

Lars

[jedzep]

I think that if I could be offered the choice between being a poor singer but a skilled enough guitarist to be able to just play without needing songs with lyrics, or of being a struggling not-so-great player with a decent vocal range I'd choose the latter. Probably because most of the songs I love and grew up with are poems set to music. However, if you are one who can't grasp singing or find a style that allows you to enjoy the zillions of songs that have lyrics while you strum, and your guitar playing ain't up to snuff, you're screwed. If your singing just sucks, it's better for everyone that you know it...unless you just play alone in your living room.

 

So the question...is it more awkward to find yourself at a gathering listening to a good guitarist who can't sing a lick, or one who does the vocals justice while fumbling over the neck and strings?

[Rambler]

We may be edging toward the advice saturation limit, but I thought this (recetnly posted on Stefan Grossman's Woodshed[/url] was apt [aha--BK slikned to the same thread]. I'd like to add: it can be hard to pick out the melody note from within a chord (its in there). Try picking the melody on single strings, see how it goes. And about finding that elusive melody: Dave Bromberg once said a note can only go three ways: up, down, or stand still. So work on that, maybe first with a familiar tune and take it from there. Over to Jimmy J:

 

 

"The first thing you need to do when you want to learn a new song to sing is to find the best key for your vocal range. The best key is the one that lets you sing as high as you can without straining your voice. Kiss the sky and sing with the birds was the metaphor I was told. Kiss the sky means always try to place the highest note of a song right at, or very near, to the ceiling of your voice. Once you've established your key, then set the singing aside, and focus on how you're going to play the song on your guitar in that key. Is it a key readily approachable on your guitar? Or, if it isn't, how can you get there? Can you tune up half a step? Or maybe you could tune down a half, or whole step? Or should you use a capo and go up? The important thing to remember is that it's the guitar that needs to make the compromise for the sake of your voice, and not the other way around. As Stefan teaches, make sure you're playing the guitar. Don't let the guitar play you! Don't concern yourself much with singing until you can play the song on guitar well enough to pass Stefan's Samurai Warrior Test. You'll know you've passed when you can imagine a Samurai slicing off your head but your fingers keep playing. Meaning, once playing the guitar is second nature, that's the time to start adding in the vocal." Jimmy J at SGGW ]

[BluesKing777]

 

So the question...is it more awkward to find yourself at a gathering listening to a good guitarist who can't sing a lick, or one who does the vocals justice while fumbling over the neck and strings?

 

 

 

Heeeeeee!

 

Good point there, JZ! (I assume you don't have the old L back or you wouldn't give a rats.....)

 

 

Now another element to your question is political and another still is appearance. You know, old friend being more hopeless, or the department manager with a face like a pig beating that Gibby to death, or that stunner in the short skirt that can hardly talk let alone sing but nobody leaves.....

 

But for me, if they are getting paid, it should be an even amount of work shown in both disciplines....called professionals! All that doesn't help when the tech is wrong - I saw a great playing friend singer guitarist, but the PA sounded like torn cardboard that hurt the ears and I have never been forgiven for doing a 'runner'. But everyone stayed for the pretty singer in the same PA.......

 

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

[Rambler]

Hee Hee! Try this easy one to sing......

That one's a ballbreaker for sure. Actually, it's not so bad if you play the meldoy on the 1st string, like a slide piece, then sing it over the lick once you get it in your ear. But not with Skips falsetto. Blind Owl Wilson could sing that. Not me.

[jedzep]

I can still get my falsetto going well enough to sing Al Green but my Kristofferson baritone is going away. Lucky I can carry a tune though because my guitar playing skills don't let me get away with instrumental performances.

 

I did get the L0 back, BK, the day before Christmas. Everything, almost everything is better than wonderful, tone is dynamic for a little guitar, new X bracing is in, belly is flat, neck is straight, new bone nut replacing the orig ebony. Camel bone pins are in the mail from Aus. I got the oldest gnarliest 30's Klusons on. I just didn't remember how tiring it was to play. The action wasn't drastically lowered and the neck is thin. I'm in an adjustment stage, playing it for longer periods and regaining the comfort zone. I hope.

 

Really, I'm just glad to have it back after 6 months in the shop. A couple of nights ago my luthier flipped his Buick and was last seen running into the woods. If that had happened a week before, I may have had to gather up the pieces and driven a couple hours to get it put back together by the next nearest fixer.

 

I'm trying to get pics up, but apparently I haven't resized correctly. Well, tomorrow's another year. I might just figure it out.

[BluesKing777]

I can still get my falsetto going well enough to sing Al Green but my Kristofferson baritone is going away. Lucky I can carry a tune though because my guitar playing skills don't let me get away with instrumental performances.

 

I did get the L0 back, BK, the day before Christmas. Everything, almost everything is better than wonderful, tone is dynamic for a little guitar, new X bracing is in, belly is flat, neck is straight, new bone nut replacing the orig ebony. Camel bone pins are in the mail from Aus. I got the oldest gnarliest 30's Klusons on. I just didn't remember how tiring it was to play. The action wasn't drastically lowered and the neck is thin. I'm in an adjustment stage, playing it for longer periods and regaining the comfort zone. I hope.

 

Really, I'm just glad to have it back after 6 months in the shop. A couple of nights ago my luthier flipped his Buick and was last seen running into the woods. If that had happened a week before, I may have had to gather up the pieces and driven a couple hours to get it put back together by the next nearest fixer.

 

I'm trying to get pics up, but apparently I haven't resized correctly. Well, tomorrow's another year. I might just figure it out.

 

 

 

 

Great, it's back! We assume he had a fizzy or 2 if he was doing a runner in to the woods?

 

My L-0 has taken this long for the bone bits to break in and lose that harsh edge which I too, was a bit disappointed about at first. But then you pick the guitar up one day and out of the blue the sound has rounded out nicely - I played it for an hour or so earlier. With a thought to the OP question, I hit record it sounded so good, but......key problem, launched into a tune and realised too late that the Gibson is tuned 2 frets low!

 

Forget resizing pics for the forum - you join a host cloud free like Photobucket, I nearly put an F for the B, upload your pic into your library and copy the link, insert link in Gib Forum. Drathbun showed us a way to put the photo in direct from Photobucket instead of a link only, but it only works on a windows p.c.

 

 

 

BluesKing777.