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charlie brown

Joe Walsh, on today's music

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If it's a forced choice question... agree or disagree... then I disagree. Some of what he says is accurate regarding quality in the music "industry" but the idea that there are not good bands out there in clubs and in recording studios is BS. Additionally there was plenty of sh!tty music in his era too - some of which was getting huge airplay and record sales. Seems to me that Joe needs to get out more. I could suggest some good bands for him to go and see.

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This was a small part of a longer segment, of "Live at Daryl's House," featuring Joe Walsh.

 

 

Agree, or disagree?

 

 

CB

 

We have been shepherded away from face-to-face culture sharing. Right now we're typing to SkyNet, for example.

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If it's a forced choice question... agree or disagree... then I disagree. Some of what he says is accurate regarding quality in the music "industry" but the idea that there are not good bands out there in clubs and in recording studios is BS. Additionally there was plenty of sh!tty music in his era too - some of which was getting huge airplay and record sales. Seems to me that Joe needs to get out more. I could suggest some good bands for him to go and see.

 

 

OK... [biggrin] For Example?

 

CB

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I don't share his opinion. He comes across as bitter to me.

 

Times change and so the role(s) of music along with them. And the tastes and listening environments follow closely.

 

I hate headphones, earbuds and trying to *listen* to music while surrounded by distractions. But that's how music gets it time these days. It seems to me that people want music so they have a soundtrack for their lives. They aren't really focused on the music, it's just there for background ambiance.

 

A few minutes ago a I heard Eminence Front on the TeeVee. Surprise! Eminence Front is the theme for a GMC ad spot featuring fancy autos sought after by people in fancy clothes. See what I mean? Nobody even pays attention any more! Even the suits at the agency apparently don't know what that tune is about. I'm still laughing.

 

I'm not ready for Depends, but I am ready to let the generations that are following make their own choices about the music for their time.

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OK... [biggrin] For Example?

 

CB

 

Really, CB? There have been many fine new bands posted here in the last 5 years. Have you been paying no attention at all? D@amn kids... get off my lawn! [lol]

 

Now if you wanna talk about the lack of "industry" and mainstream radio support for those bands, I would totally agree. But good rock and roll is out there. You just have to put forth a little effort to find it.

 

As for a recommendation for Joe, I think he might dig The Temperance Movement as much as I do, so I'd start there...

 

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Rival Sons are pretty awesome too (also been posted here many times)

 

 

I'm insanely fond of Mount Carmel too - I've posted them here quite a bit

 

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Grace Potter seems to get it done with out drum machines too... :rolleyes:

 

 

And Graveyard just released their fourth excellent album

 

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And assuming Joe can live with a little um... satan... it's hard to beat Ghost musically - heavy and yet so melodic.

 

 

This one's just for you CB....

 

 

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I don't know that Joe is being "bitter." :-k I think he's just stating a fact. And, it is up to the current generation,

and those to come, to make and appreciate their own music. But, like in a lot of areas, these days...not just music,

I feel sad, that so many (too often) don't appreciate the difference(s). And, consequently, don't seem to care, either!

 

But, this is coming from an "old geezer," that lived in the 50's, 60's and early 70's Rock & Roll era. When everything

was "analog" (even if some was "overdubbed), and more "face to face," with real instruments, as opposed to Pro Tools, and

samples/plug in's. Even a lot of the younger musicians seem to "wish" for "the good old days," musically. And, I don't

think that is all just patronizing their elders (meaning it, or not), at all. I often hear..."Why can't OUR music, be like

your's was??!"...more often, than I can tell you. I just say: "It CAN be, IF they want it to, badly enough!"

 

So, although I can truly relate to Joe's point, I know there are good/great bands, still around. I'm not sure, they are appreciated,

as much as they should be??? But, who knows? [biggrin]

 

Cheers,

 

CB

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Well, I agree, there are good/great bands, out there. It's just a shame, that one has to actually search out, and/or

unwittingly stumble upon, the great ones, all too often. But, "C'est La Vie!" [biggrin]

 

ALL Rock & Roll, is derivative, from all music that came before. Some, more obvious, than other's.

And, Surfpup...my "For Example" was not so much a challenge, as wanting some of your personal choices,

more to see what you, and other's feel is "Great!" Which, of course, will put my own choices/preferences

in perspective. It's all Good! [thumbup]

 

CB

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I often hear..."Why can't OUR music, be like your's was??!"...more often, than I can tell you. I just say: "It CAN be, IF they want it to, badly enough!"... So, although I can truly relate to Joe's point, I know there are good/great bands, still around. I'm not sure, they are appreciated, as much as they should be??? But, who knows? [biggrin]

 

Now that's more like it. [thumbup] I would say that there may never again be an explosion of music and the consciousness of it in mainstream culture like the one in which you lived (and performed). But I would say I think the changes are in the audience and the delivery systems not so much in the musicians.

 

There are still young people out there thirsty for authentic, visceral music. And quality young musicians are still out there, getting inspired and inspiring others - they just have different opportunities before them. Are they going to break it big by playing Woodstock and scoring a huge "record deal"? Probably not. But they can upload stuff to YouTube all day. How many great bands in the 60s remained obscure because no one was listening? The audience may be smaller, but it may also be more discerning. Not such a bad thing, IMO. Maybe I'm being overly optimistic, but that's my vibe and I'm sticking with it. [biggrin]

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Well heck Surfpup, friend of mine suggested Ghost just yesterday. He saw them give an acoustic performance of part of their new album a few days ago. They threw the whole thing onto youtube with links to itunes and the like, pretty neat.

 

To the point though

 

Feels like he's reading from the same worn out book as everyone else I've heard pose this question.

 

Over the past few years I've become increasingly sick of this sort of discourse, as it seems to be borne not of an exploration of today's music but rather a refusal to really dive in more deeply than would allow confirmation bias to survive. Everyone seems to get up in arms when the culture of their preference has faded (even slightly.. in this case), and then suddenly we're caught in the eternal loop of these folk denigrating the younger generation of art, people, politics, anything. It's not productive, and to me it just seems bitter and close-minded.

 

Every generation has had these discussions, within every artistic community. But somehow the sky never really falls does it?

 

I tie this sort of thing in with that classic discussion of the youth... Which has been around since time immemorial... I mean, hell Socrates died over 2400 years ago and yet we still quote him in "The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise." Sort of thing ain't new

 

... and judging from the performances I've seen from the younger among musicians... I can't really say he's living in a reality.

 

As far as distribution goes he's not necessarily wrong, we're in a transitional period that seems to spell the decline of record companies (which were, of course Walsh's primary means of distribution, income, and musical purchases).

 

It's an honest truth that I can at this moment download 13 different releases of Megadeth's Killing Is My Business... and Business Is Good (2 taken from vinyl, 11 from CDs) in 4 different file types, and this truth isn't going away. Musicians are both increasingly independent of record companies, and more accountable to their audience. I have friends who have put out albums using pages like bandcamp, under the model that you name your price (as I recall Radiohead did a similar donation based system once or twice, though their income probably wasn't indicative of... most people's). If people want it, they can get it. You not only need to get their interest, but their investment (both perhaps moreso than ever before).

 

The times they are a changin' after all, it's up to the artists to adapt. Louis CK (yeah yeah, comedian, not a musician, but it's relevant) offers his most recent stand-up special for any price between $1 and $85 you choose, in part because he knows you can just find it elsewhere (he's spoken about it in interviews I've seen, but for the life of me I can't remember which ones).

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You can't really judge the state of music by top 40 radio. You can judge the state of pop music, sure, but pop music has been generally crap with some bright spots (and those'd be the ones that you remember) for decades. People like their music like they like their food... McDonald's style. And it's hardly a new phenomenon - hyper-processing was big in the 80s, too, lest people forget. People get their hands on new technology and go nuts with it. There will be a "course correction" eventually and things will cycle back and forth ad infinitum. Why do you think the grunge acts of the 90s rejected as much processing as their producers (who were arguably still stuck in the 80s then and still are today) would let them?

 

What happened when Nirvana recorded In Utero with Steve Albini, who is pretty much synonymous with a lack of digital manipulation and processing? The label called it unreleasable. It was too raw. Too unprocessed. It needed polish! Louder vocals! Digital effects! It was not glittery and polished like Nevermind was, and Nevermind sold big time. Remember that the outlaw country movement of the late 60s was a reaction to a perceived level of craptitude on Nashville's part. It was felt that Nashville had polished and softened the medium.

 

The best musicians are always playing at places like the Entry or the Triple Rock to small crowds, and most of them will fade away to all but a select few. Given that the vast majority of new-ish bands I listen to pride themselves on a lack of processing in their music, I'm going to call crap without waffles on Joe's conclusions. It's the same old song every generation sings about the generations that follow it. It's all just noise. It's too loud. Made by talentless hacks. Congratulations: you've become your parents.

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I've become my parents, huh...Well GOOD! My parents were awesome! [thumbup] And, not at all close minded. [biggrin]

 

I love the kind discussion, that topics like this generate. It's good!! And, an nice diversion, from "is my Les Paul

'Real, or Fake?'" [flapper][biggrin]

 

 

CB

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I've become my parents, huh...Well GOOD! My parents were awesome! [thumbup] And, not at all close minded. [biggrin]

 

I love the kind discussion, that topics like this generate. they're some great bands out ther a It's good!! And, an nice diversion, from "is my Les Paul

'Real, or Fake?'" [flapper][biggrin]

 

 

CB

Agree [thumbup] they're some great bands out there, b and the way they make some records.

 

70--60's music still rules industry but joe is right about the music being made today

 

4H

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He is right that the record company doesn't pay for a years studio time in an English countryside, where musicians can trip out, and put out masterpiece anthems, big enough to endure 50 years of scrutiny.

 

Nowadays without that investment, we do it ourselves, in our own homes, at our leisure, tripping when possible. Plenty of mistakes are kept in my recordings. But I am all about spontaneous music, notes jotted down could be refined to perfection, but aren't.

 

Retro. In relevance, we went back to 1968, 1959 with almost all of our equipment. The recordings are done using digital interfaces. Somewhat of a hybrid?

 

Yeah the dream job of getting high all year, face planted in your favorite crack, waiting for Kashmir to evolve into something magnificent, are gone. As are most of those musicians who overindulged. Not sure what to be thankful for, fewer needless deaths or less financial support. Would Joe survive his next big endorsement? Its questionable.

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And don't forget there was plenty of crappy music made in the 60s and 70s! The "industry" then hawked more than its share of schlock too. Nostalgia tends to paint over that bit.

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Think this clip has been posted before....I hear what he's saying, but....

 

Swings, roundabouts and "will the big bands ever come back?" No.

 

There's still plenty of 30 and 40 year-old music on the radio and nostalgia is bigger than ever these days - so many 'tribute' bands and acts.

 

OTOH new music is much more in the hands of the people/artists now, despite the manufactured TV boy bands etc.

 

And there really is more live music out there now than ever before, too.

 

Joe Walsh is one of the luckiest ones. Times change. The tide ebbs and flows.

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I didn't have the stamina to see through even this short video of an old mans rant. It's his view from a more "inside perspective" fair enough. I for my part as a very interested Music consumer get more and more engaged in the music "output" year by year. Last year was an amazing year, and this year sounds great so far, here are some of the best I have listened to in 2015 (but probably not many of these on Joe Walsh list):

 

Enslaved

Arcane

While She Sleeps

Ghost

Periphery

Mark Lanegan

Cancer Bats

J.D McPherson

Balthazar

Courtney Barnett

Turbowolf

Agnostic Front

We Are Harlot

Dynfari

JH

KONTINUUM

Posion Idea

Klone

Leprous

Slaves

Lamb of GOd

Pardise Lost

Refused

Blurred Vision

Royal Thunder

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local boys from round my way doing just fine for themselves playing their 'virtual instruments that don't exist'

 

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I'd agree with Joe for the most part. He doesn't seem bitter to me; just disappointed, as I am, with the current "state of the industry" and certain lack in much of today's music.

 

Yes I believe there are good bands out there still. You DO have to hunt for them, though.

 

I quit listening to conventional radio years ago- NOTHING but BS. Never did like top 40 radio- although it was all around me in the late 60s early 70s. Philly's WMMR started as sort of an underground station back in the late 60s early 70s. NOW you can tune in EVERY day and hear the same "Classic Rock" songs AT THE SAME FRIGGIN TIME. (I think Styx has the 2:30PM slot...LOL)

 

Theres a local station out of Philly- WXPN, that showcases new music on a consistent basis. I've made a concentrated effort to listen over the past two weeks, to see what I might be missing. Judging by what they're playing, I ain't missing much. I like a lot of the instrumentation; for example they had a song on by Daws on my way in to work this A.M. Pretty good guitar work, just O.K. lyrics. Yesterday and the day before that I repeatedly heard just OK instrumentation, lyrics that could have been written by a typical 10 year old.

 

These are ALL JUST MY OPINIONS. I've said it once and probably a hundred times; I grew up listening to Allman Brothers; Emerson, Lake and Palmer; Yes; Hendrix; Pink floyd; Neil Young; CSNY; Hot Tuna; Traffic; Alan Parsons; Paul Butterfield; The Who, Santana; Janis Joplin and on and on. Not every one of their songs were stellar, but by and large, they were musicians and more often than not, put thought into lyrics and composition.

 

If I can find something near that in a contemporary band, I'd be VERY happy. And seriously, if anyone can point me in that sort of direction, please do so!

 

I love Joe Walsh- was introduced to him when he was with the James Gang. Again, my opinion, but even his more "poppy" songs had a charm and witticism, satire, that I liked. But his more serious songs were what drew me to him and keep me a fan.

 

Thanks Bent Olav Olsen for the list- it will give me something to peruse!

 

Brian

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