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Is this a true 1964 J45?


Smurfbird

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https://reverb.com/item/1184743-gibson-j-45-1964-2-tone-sunburst

 

I just bought the guitar linked to above. We agreed at $2500, shipping included. Either this is among the more stellar examples of a vintage '64 piece or I've been duped by a reissue. (I'm asking for timely assistance, since I'm sure if it isn't as advertised then I have recourse.)

 

The serial number imprinted on the back of the beck is 245606, so that's a 1964. There is no stamp on the neck block inside. The adj. bridge has been switched to a solid rosewood and bone saddle.

 

According to the receipt in the case, the guitar has had $1400 worth of work done to it, which consists of a bridge and plate drop in, new bone nut, Refret with similar ??? (word is illegible). On the work receipt it's labeled a Gibson 64 J-45 and then there's a crosscut made with another pen. Then the serial number. I'm planning on calling the shop, Folkway Music in Waterloo, Ontario tomorrow, since they're closed today.

 

I'll try and take more pictures and put them up.

 

The name of the seller is different from the guy whose name is on the work receipt.

 

I've read of Fuller's having made '64 reissues, but would they use a '64 serial number and wouldn't there be a Custom Shop sticker on the back?

 

I broke my own rule about no longer buying guitars on the internet because the deal looked good.

 

I will say the guitar plays nicely and has the nut width I like. Maybe it's a psychological thing, but I can't say it feels like an old guitar. I've had good work done on my '61 LG-3 and it looks pretty good for its age but it has a different vibe than this one.

 

I'm bringing it to the local vintage shop today to get more answers. But I'd also like your opinions.

 

Thanks!

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Smurf this is weird to me... It says on the backstrip inside the guitar "J45 ADJ BROWN"

 

Yet the saddle is not adjustable...

 

It looks in pretty darn good shape. AT the very least maybe this is like Dan's where the owner replaced the bridge and saddle.

 

(for those looking for the link, you have to find it cached: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:DiK5xwniUsUJ:https://reverb.com/item/1184743-gibson-j-45-1964-2-tone-sunburst+&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)

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Smurf this is weird to me... It says on the backstrip inside the guitar "J45 ADJ BROWN"

 

Yet the saddle is not adjustable...

 

It looks in pretty darn good shape. AT the very least maybe this is like Dan's where the owner replaced the bridge and saddle.

 

(for those looking for the link, you have to find it cached: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:DiK5xwniUsUJ:https://reverb.com/item/1184743-gibson-j-45-1964-2-tone-sunburst+&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)

 

 

Sal, Smurf said that the saddle had been changed.....

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Sal,

 

The receipt I have says new bridge and plate. So I get that. But where did you cache that link? The asking price was higher in your link. I guess you saved it when you saw it come on market? Since it says 2 days ago in terms of listing.

 

I'm SO confused.

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When I tried to use the link you provided, it said that it had sold (duh - you bought it), but it didnt give the details of the item. So I googled the title of the listing, and when I saw reverb as one of the options, I moused over to it, and instead of clicking the link, I clicked on the drop down and chose the older cache'd version. Thats the link I posted here.

 

Sorry I see that you mentioned the changed bridge now. As such, and the fact that the backstrip says J45 ADJ", I think the guitar is not a reissue; it appears to be a really well kept older guitar, with the bridge replaced. It seems you got a nice old specimen, some old wood, with a nice new bridge. I bet it sounds great.

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Interesting that it says "brown" on the centerstripe, when it looks like cherry-stained b&S, and a faded cherry top. Beautiful top, no matter what you call the color.

 

In any case, it looks like a beautifully-maintained '64 to me.

 

What's the actual nut width measurement?

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The nut width is 1-11/16. Maybe a touch under.

 

Everything about the guitar is so new feeling. The headstock has zero marks, like a brand new guitar.

 

I think the other things that have me confused is that in the original ad, the seller makes note of it likely being worth $2200. He also only insured the guitar for $1000.

 

I'm on my way to the local guitar shop and I'll update here what he says.

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Blow the pic up - it actually says "J-45 ADJ. BRIDGE"

 

 

You're absolutely right. I was going on what Sal said, rather than looking for myself.

 

That relieves my mind, as I have never seen a color reference on the centerstrip.

 

In the mid-late 60's, some of these say "J-45 adj", and some say "J-45 adj bridge". Don't look for consistency in this period.

 

In the one close-up picture of the pickguard, that looks like a 1968 "boob" pickguard with the lettering worn off. Anyone else see that?

 

that is one of the better-looking faded cherry bursts I've seen.

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.

Nick - I can't offer an opinion on authenticity - I'm a lacking some knowledge. But I can say - yes, I see what's left of the "boob" logo. And I'll add that is the best looking 50 year old finish I've ever seen.

 

 

Now I really am confused. I thought the "boob" logo was unique to 1968, and that those were all screwed on. Apparently not.

 

For all our talk about poorly-fitting modern pickguards, look how different the rosette radius is from the pickguard radius at the rosette on this guitar. Looks like the pickguard radius is cut to that of the outer ring of the rosette, rather than the inner ring.

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Oops, my hand slipped on the last post. Earlier it was asked if it could be a 1964 CS J45 Reissue from Fullers. I have one of those and it's got the Gibson Custom Shop logo on the neck, plus, the serial number on the neck block inside the guitar. So the one you have is definitely not a Fullers J-45 1964 CS Reissue.

 

QM Jazzman Jeff

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What is the 1968 BOOB pick guard guys? and sorry for my reading the center strip incorrectly.

 

Nevermind Google is my friend... got it.

 

I hope this copies OK. Small image, but you get the idea. Name derivation is pretty obvious, I think.

 

 

https://tse4.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.M9960d5c681c98b4c6c288524cae36746o0&w=245&h=183&c=7&rs=1&qlt=90&o=4&pid=1.1

 

For the record (and without examining it), I'm going with this being a legitimate 1964. The pickguard is a head-scratcher, however. It may have been changed later, for some reason.

 

Anyone else ever seen a boob pickguard on a 1964?

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I brought the guitar to my local vintage shop and Ted Lawrence gave it a good look over and he said it's clear to him that an excellent buff job was done on the guitar. That it is, in fact, a 1964 Gibson J-45. He was also puzzled by the Boob image and figures someone took off the original and had this replacement put on. He said the re-fret job, the new rosewood bridge and bone nut were all of first-rate quality and that this is the best looking '64 he's even seen. It also plays like a gem. He says I got a fantastic deal and to stop worrying. So I will.

 

One thing that confuses me is how a guitar so well-maintained could ever have needed a re-fret job and other work. It looks like it was barely played.

 

 

I'd still love to hear if anyone else has experience with this model.

 

Thanks to all for chiming in.

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I brought the guitar to my local vintage shop and Ted Lawrence gave it a good look over and he said... ... That it is, in fact, a 1964 Gibson J-45. ...

 

Glad you got this all figured out.

 

She's a beauty and plays like a gem to boot.

 

Congrats on a great get. . . B)

 

 

.

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I brought the guitar to my local vintage shop and Ted Lawrence gave it a good look over and he said it's clear to him that an excellent buff job was done on the guitar. That it is, in fact, a 1964 Gibson J-45. He was also puzzled by the Boob image and figures someone took off the original and had this replacement put on. He said the re-fret job, the new rosewood bridge and bone nut were all of first-rate quality and that this is the best looking '64 he's even seen. It also plays like a gem. He says I got a fantastic deal and to stop worrying. So I will.

 

One thing that confuses me is how a guitar so well-maintained could ever have needed a re-fret job and other work. It looks like it was barely played.

 

 

I'd still love to hear if anyone else has experience with this model.

 

Thanks to all for chiming in.

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As far as an immaculate guitar needing a refret....maybe the person who had it is like me. I play my guitar all the time, don't gig with it, take great care of it (wiping it down etc...) and case it. Mine is starting to show signs of fretwear. Looks like you did very well!

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