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Bluesy69

3 Strikes Your Out, PRS Blows You Away Gibson

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Hey Guy's You listen to this story, because I think I was more than fair and patient with Gibson and their Les Paul's.

 

First and foremost I was born in 69 so I grew up in the 70's and 80's, knowing all the while once I became interested in playing music & guitars that the brands to get were either Gibson, Fender or Rickenbacker, because as some of you may know PRS didn't really get going with mass production until about 85.

 

However my older brother got me into Gibson, I just loved how they looked and sounded and I always said I'll buy my own Les Paul some day, well I am now 48 years old and I have owned various guitars over the years, but none of them with the exact specs I wanted, so I waited, then in 2017 Gibson put out their new traditional model, and I looked over the specs, and it had exactly what I wanted.

 

From the SOLID non weight relieved body, to the rosewood fingerboard, kluson tuners, burstbucker 1 & 2 pickups, neck profile & binding, body color....everything was finally exactly how I wanted it.

So of course I go to my local music store and order one, well I eagerly awaited it's arrival and once it arrived I looked it over.

 

Now something you should know about me, when I am buying something, anything that costs thousands of dollars, and it's brand new, it had better be perfect, because I don't have that kind of money to spend very often as I'm sure is the same for most of you. Plus I don't leave the guitar out of the hardshell case at any time other than when I'm playing it, and even after I play it I wipe it down and handle it with ultra care to say the least.

 

So now that you know that about me, I unbox the guitar and I open the case and I carefully look over the guitar and on top of the flame maple was a dark spot in the wood that was about the size of a dime in diameter, and then around the lower bout or cutaway where the binding goes around and separates the top finish from the back finish, it was almost as if someone came up behind the person that was applying the binding and bumped their arm, because there was like a semi circle reveal that clearly showed the paint seam, where on the rest of the guitar the seam was covered.

 

This to me looked like a major flaw so I brought it back to the store and even another customer that was leaning over checking out the guitar while I was pointing out these defects to the sales guy commented " that she was surprised that they let it leave the factory like this"....the sales guy repeated that also when he saw it.

 

Needless to say I returned it and ordered another one, it arrived, and had the exact same flaw with the binding, so again the guitar went back, I tried for a third time to order the guitar and now weeks were going by that I'm trying to get this done without this flaw, but the third one arrived with the same defect or so it was what I was calling it because that's what it looked like.

 

Finally the sales guy called Gibson to ask about this specific defect with the binding on this model, and Gibson tells him " it's not a defect, it's the traditional model and that's how they were made back in the late 50's, early 60's " So then I told the guy, " that I didn't give a rats *** if that's how they were made back then because aesthetically it looks like a defect, it looks horrible ".

 

So I returned the guitar, and went home and did some research, and it just so happens that PRS put out a guitar over a year ago called a PRS McCarty 594 and it was GORGEOUS, thicker body than any other PRS in existence, equal thickness to the Les Paul, with mahogany bound neck and body with flame maple top, two tone and two volume knobs, tone knobs are pull out coil tap, 3 way switch, rosewood fretboard, MOTHER OF PEARL INLAYS, NOT ACRYLIC, BONE NUT NOT TEKTOID, METAL jack plate NOT PLASTIC, this beast was superior to the Les Paul in everyway, even the 58/15 LT pickups were of equal sound and quality to the fat creamy PAF's of the 59 Les Paul.

 

However with the flawless 10 top which is what I wanted, it was a $4200 guitar, but guess what, I've heard enough about PRS to know for a fact that the guitar was going to arrive flawless and it did, it's PERFECT, the aesthetics, the feel, the sound, and the craftsmanship is unmatched by anything I've ever seen or owned.

 

I've even educated myself on PRS and watched countless factory tour video's, read articles and listened to Paul Reed Smith give lectures on guitar building and the whole process of it, and he's doing things Gibson has never even thought of...For example, Gibson mass produces hundreds of guitar necks a day to be fitted to their guitars.

It takes PRS 30 days to complete one neck, and most of you might think that's stupid or retarded or not productive enough for such a huge company, however the reason why they do this, is because when wood is shaved down, be it by hand or machine, the wood moves, so it has to be slowly removed, sanded leveled over and over to ensure it is always straight and always in tune...Do I know it works? Your damn right I do.

 

The PRS McCarty 594 is thee only guitar I've ever received and received it on a hot 90 degree day with 80% humidity off of a UPS truck with no AC and I took it out of the case, plugged it into my digital tuner, and it was in PERFECT TUNE, I did not have to touch one tuning key.....That has NEVER happened with any Gibson, Fender or Rickenbacker that I have bought over the years...NEVER.

 

Well that's my story, and for those of you who may work for Gibson that might read this, you are not the company you used to be in the 70's and 80's, nor do you put out the flawless craftsmanship you were once so famous for, and it's a shame, but I'm sure you could care less about one man's loss of business, but you have lost it for the remainder of my life, from now on I am a PRS fan only.....I was more than fair with your product but your quality control is lacking, even if that was how the binding was supposed to look it looked like a cosmetic defect, and aside from that the top maple had flaws and blemishes that you would have never let leave the factory 30 years ago.

Farewell Gibson.

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Sorry for your experience with Gibson. Glad you got lucky with the PRS. And trust me sir, you got lucky. Not all prs guitars are perfect. If you fool with enough of them, I think you will find that out.

 

And IMHO, when someone finds the same flaw in the same place on several guitars of the same model. Maybe it's the perception that is flawed. <_<

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Before you started this thread the following had already been noted in one of your previous efforts;

 

"Looking at all 4 posts made by the OP they (claim to) have gone to a store to buy a Standard T and didn't like it.

Bought a Standard HP and didn't like it.

Sent the latter back for an ES-335 and didn't like it.

Bought the LP mentioned in post #1 here and didn't like it."

 

Can anyone else see a pattern developing here?

 

Now yet another thread from you whose sole purpose is to say how inferior are Gibson's products and, by way of a comparison, how superior are PRS' products.

You like PRS and you don't like Gibson. That's fine. Honestly. We get it.

 

Bye! And don't bother to write!

 

Pip.

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The pattern that your missing ,is yes I had several Gibson's through the years, and they always had some cosmetic imperfection, or cheaped out part substitute such has richlite instead of rosewood, or acrylic instead of mother of pearl or weight relieved instead of solid wood or plastic jackplate instead of metal..... but what could I do this is how Gibson was making them so I had to try each of them and see for myself, but I was not satisfied with their end results.

 

So yeah it was no different with these Les Pauls, just Gibson losing ground or cutting corners again in quality.

 

 

 

 

Before you started this thread the following had already been noted in one of your previous efforts;

 

"Looking at all 4 posts made by the OP they (claim to) have gone to a store to buy a Standard T and didn't like it.

Bought a Standard HP and didn't like it.

Sent the latter back for an ES-335 and didn't like it.

Bought the LP mentioned in post #1 here and didn't like it.

 

Can anyone else see a pattern developing here?"

 

Now yet another thread from you whose sole purpose is to say how inferior are Gibson's products and, by way of a comparison, how superior are PRS' products.

You like PRS and you don't like Gibson. That's fine. Honestly. We get it.

 

Bye! And don't bother to write!

 

Pip.

 

 

 

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Sounds like you got a reasonable answer from Gibson to a question that was directly related to the actual product YOU had decided on. I can understand that you're looking for something flawless in your eyes... Maybe you could have tried a different Les Paul model, instead? (Standard, or any one of the DOZEN they are producing these days)

 

 

To come here and say "PRS blows Gibson away" is entirely subjective, especially when your complaint is your own opinion on how the company has decided to do the finishing details on this particular model line.. Sorry man this is a bit childish. If you want play the troll card, know that you're not going to get a warm reception here.

 

But regardless, If you're happy with the new PRS, that's really all that matters.

 

Do enjoy the playing, and good luck with the new axe..

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I had PRS that I didn't like. Got rid of it. I have three Les Pauls now that I love.

 

I better go over to the PRS forum and write about how much I think they suck.

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Subjective, is Right!!

 

PRS are Excellent guitars! There's no doubt about it! BUT, So are the like priced Gibson's!

Did you try the "True Historic's? Or, other Custom Shop like priced versions? Or, as has been

questioned, any other model of Gibson USA Les Paul, now available?

 

It sounds like you have found your preference, albeit based only on the one LP model, vs PRS.

That's Great! But, as great a PRS guitars are, I (personally) have never taken to them.

My dealer is a PRS dealer, as well. So, I've demo'd a bunch! As "Perfect" as they might

seem, they felt lacking (to me) in some fashion. Not even sure, what that is/was, really.

I hate the headstock shape, for one thing. Except, for the rounder, more pleasing "Santana"

model. That one, is decent! But, IF I finally find one, I truly love...I'd buy it. But,

so far, I'm still looking.

 

So, to each his/her own.

 

 

CB

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The pattern that your missing ,is yes I had several Gibson's through the years, and they always had some cosmetic imperfection, or cheaped out part substitute such has richlite instead of rosewood, or acrylic instead of mother of pearl or weight relieved instead of solid wood or plastic jackplate instead of metal..... but what could I do this is how Gibson was making them so I had to try each of them and see for myself, but I was not satisfied with their end results.

 

So yeah it was no different with these Les Pauls, just Gibson losing ground or cutting corners again in quality.

 

All four of my Gibsons are awesome. Sorry you had a bad experience. Gibson states on their website: "AA-grade flamed maple top: Beautiful top with just the right amount of flame for an authentic vintage look"

 

I do find it odd that Gibson would send you 3 different guitars, each with the exact same flaw. Are you sure the store wasn't pulling a fast one and giving you the same guitar each time? Did you check the serial numbers for each?

 

For that kind of price, I'd have bought this: http://www.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/2016/Custom/Standard-Historic-1958-Les-Paul-Standard.aspx

 

But, glad you're happy with your PRS. Sorry you had a bad run. Good luck.

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Guest Farnsbarns

The issue you describe with the binding and paint seem is on every Les Paul since the 50s (except a period in the early 90s). It's called the "smile" and it's because the binding doesn't cover the 15mm thick maple cap completely.

 

You seem to have assumed Gibson changed to acrylic inlays. Not so, always used acrylic and cellulose nitrate barring a few special models.

 

 

You're so sure of yourself but you seem to know nothing.

 

 

I think you're a troll. If not you're complaining about something you know nothing about and have chosen not to educate yourself. That's willful ignorance.

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I think you're a troll. If not you're complaining about something you know nothing about and have chosen not to educate yourself. That's willful ignorance.

 

 

These two stats sort of tell the story don't they...

 

Posts: 6

Joined: 22-February 17

 

4 posts prior to the two in this thread..

 

and the OP of this infamous flame riddled thread:

gibson-has-serious-quality-control-issues-again

 

I think I do see the pattern here..

 

safe to say, I don't think we'll miss his future contributions..

 

the PRS forum is indeed,,, the place for him..

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I bet he absolutely blows at guitar anyway.

 

 

well, Farns, in all fairness, he could be a great player, and a decent "chap"..

 

IMHO just needs to curb his enthusiasm when he's posting here.

 

 

if he dislikes Gibson products this much - which based on his contribution to the forum seems to be the case, gotta wonder why he wastes his time here at all :-k

 

on the other hand, tolls must troll...

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Guest Farnsbarns

well, Farns, in all fairness, he could be a great player, and a decent "chap"..

 

IMHO just needs to curb his enthusiasm when he's posting here.

 

 

if he dislikes Gibson products this much - which based on his contribution to the forum seems to be the case, gotta wonder why he wastes his time here at all :-k

 

on the other hand, tolls must troll...

 

And trolls must be trolled. ;)

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I bet he absolutely blows at guitar anyway.

He clearly knows feck-all about Gibson Les Pauls.

 

Richlite instead of rosewood? Nope.

Acrylic instead of MoP? Nope.

We all know that there are still solid-bodied LPs to be had in both USA- and CS models.

Plastic jack-plate instead of metal? Read up on the history of the model you idiot.

 

But it's not just the OP's knowledge of Gibson Les Pauls which stinks. Today the OP wrote;

 

...In 2017 Gibson put out their new Traditional model, and I looked over the specs, and it had exactly what I wanted....From the SOLID non weight relieved body...[...]...everything was finally exactly how I wanted it. So of course I go to my local music store and order one...

...which is a bit odd because on the 1st of March he wrote;

 

I went to my local guitar shop and tried out the Traditional model with NONE of the above listed changes, and for the first time in my life the guitar felt really heavy and the heel joint really felt like more work to get around and get those high notes...Today I found myself understanding and even accepting these changes as a better fit for me and a guy my age, so I ordered a 2017 Les Paul Standard...

At the very least he can be accused of making genuine 'mistakes'.

 

OTOH......

 

Pip.

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chances are, he never even returns to see the dust he's kicked up.

This is the first post in which he has posted anything but the opening post.

My guess (FWIW) is that he tries to start trouble and has been disappointed with the lack of folks taking the bait.

 

Pip.

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I've never actually picked up a PRS to play it. So, question for those people who have, how do they compare, dollar to dollar to a Les Paul? A $3000.00 Les Paul vs a $3000.00 PRS or whatever the top of the line is for each? Santana makes them (PRS) sound good but then again, it's Santana and he made a Les Paul sound good too.

 

So, rather than feed the troll, what's other people's opinions of them? Are they everything he's saying? I like my Gibsons a lot but I'm just curious as to how good the PRS really is? I've just never had the desire to pick one up and try them out but I'm sure others here have checked them out.

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I think its pretty much as CB said, you can go buy Gibson perfection just like what your calling perfection with PRS price wise. I just thought they always sounded generic and never cared for the pick-ups. I played a Custom 22 for a spell and the Dragons are junk, put Gibson pick-ups in -better, but to my ear it still didnt sound as good as my LP or SG. lol.. I tried. Hey but good luck.

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I bet he absolutely blows at guitar anyway.

 

Look you guy's can think what you want I didn't come in here to argue, just to relay my previous mishap with Gibson, with the hopes that similar flawed guitars don't end up in your hands, like they did mine.

 

I've owned Gibson's in the past and yes some of them were Les Paul Standards or Classics, but they all cut corners somewhere, with either weight relief, or fretboard and inlay materials...somewhere.

 

I have no hatred for Gibson, in fact it infuriates me that they don't make them like they used to. My older brother has an absolutely flawless 1984 Black Gibson SG Standard, and it is perfection itself, the build quality, the feel, the sound, it's phenomenal, and I loved playing it...when he let me.

 

However that quality is now non existent, I can say that because of my past 20 some odd years trying and buying and unfortunately returning Gibson's, their just not what they used to be, that's all.

 

Hey who knows maybe in 20 to 30 years PRS, Fender or other guitar makers will get lax in their manufacturing, I don't know.

All I'm saying is as for today PRS is taking the time and effort to do it right, and for whatever reason Gibson has stopped doing that, or at least have stopped doing it to a certain degree.

 

So I hope they change for the better for the sake of all us players, and hopefully my bad experiences with Gibson is not the majority of their customer experiences, I truly hope all of you are thrilled with whatever Gibson you may have, it just did not work out so well for me, and I mean no disrespect to current or future Gibson owners.

 

 

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This is the first post in which he has posted anything but the opening post.

My guess (FWIW) is that he tries to start trouble and has been disappointed with the lack of folks taking the bait.

 

Pip.

 

 

And, he's (no doubt), never seen YOUR Les Paul's! [biggrin] I love them all, but that (so called) "Plain top" is Killer! IMHO, as always!

 

CB

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i think maybe i "get it".

 

 

if i have 3 cupcakes, and i KNOW they're awesome, i want to share them with people i like/care about, more than i actually want to eat them. the trouble is, sometimes i catch myself finding something that is awesome for me, and i want to immediately go and tell everyone that i have found THE WAY. i know darn well i must be right, because of my personal experience. the idea that what's right for me may not be what's right for someone else just doesn't occur to me. i HAVE to make sure you can have this really awesome thing too. i never realize it when i'm doing it, only later.

maybe the o/p is doing that.

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