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Why dump on Les Paul Studios??


scottierocker

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I don't get it.

 

I have a late 90's black studio, and they get no love. Everyone who's looking for a Les Paul says,"no studios", or "don't buy studios".

 

It's the SAME guitar, it has every element that contributes to the sound and tone of a Standard, same wood choice, same cuts, same joints, same carved top, same fretboard, same dimensions. It just doesn't have the neck/body binding (which incidentally I like better, more "chopper"-esque).

 

It even has Trapezoid fret inlays.

 

I think these guitars get confused for Les Paul Specials (dot inlays) alot, which contributes to the bad rap. Mine plays like a champ, and I'd hold it up against ANY Les Paul out there.

 

Thoughts?

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Yeah......... I don't know......... I just don't get very exited about LP Studios because of their stripped down look with no binding.

 

But I know they're sweet guitars. I came across this one and I got it for $650 with hardshell case. And it's a MONSTER!! I hope to never, ever part with it:

 

DSC03630.jpg

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I

I have a late 90's black studio' date=' and they get no love. Everyone who's looking for a Les Paul says,"no studios"[/quote']

 

Not very often on this forum, they don't.

 

It's the SAME guitar' date=' it has every element that contributes to the sound and tone of a Standard, same wood choice, same cuts, same joints, same carved top.[/quote']

 

Well, not entirely 100% true.

 

They are, however, completely under-rated by Snobs.

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Nothing wrong with Studios. I played one last week at GC. The only thing I don't like is the rounded neck. But, that's just the neck Gibson chooses to use on Studios. They should offer it with the Slim Taper 60's neck, Maybe they'd be more popular, appealing to more people with more options on neck size.

 

Other than neck size, If you don't want to spend the big bucks, or can't afford it, the Studio is the way to go.

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.... If you don't want to spend the big bucks' date=' or can't afford it, the Studio is the way to go.[/quote']

 

Word up, I am poor!

 

Here's the thing. I have been trying to unload this guitar for a month now, so I can get an SG Standard. People have been offering $500, which may be fair in some markets (considering I've already sold the case, and it has just a few scratches), but I have upgraded the pickups to active Duncans, and it plays so well that I feel like $725 is a fair number.

 

Nobody wants it.

 

I feel like I'd be doing an injustice selling it at that $500-$600. People tell me that's what they go for, but that's B.S.

 

Specials go for that much, but Studios go for between $700 and $900 when dealing with people that have some sense. You may catch one for $650, or someone holding out hope and selling one for $1000 or $1100, but normally $700 - $900 is fair. This is a THICK, HEAVY Les Paul, with a pretty slim and fast neck. Not the newer ones that are cheaper and lighter. To me, it's worth it.

 

Someone tell me if I'm out of line?

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Don't lose any sleep over it.

Doesn't matter if it's a $1' date='000 Studio or a $5,000 R9, every Gibson Les Paul get's dumped on...[/quote']

 

That's very true.

 

I guess it really only has bearing because I'm trying to sell it, and the dummies where I live would prefer a nice Ibanez or Schecter.

 

The one's who actually like Gibsons are convinced the sound of this guitar is inferior, and that's frustrating. Gibsons are suppose to hold value, and because of ignorance that isn't holding true.

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Studios suck, I got one like 2 months ago and havent played her once... not even once!

 

Just kidding... they are fine instruments, maybe not for snobs, but they weren't meant for them anyway. They sound great and play fine, if you happen to find one that is good enough for you, like with most guitars, no matter the brand (except for fender) you will find bad and good ones.

 

I love studios, specially in black with chrome hardware and white with either chrome or gold hardware.

 

 

Oh, and I wasnt kidding about not having played mine since I got her, I have not, but that's a completely different story for a completely different thread.

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I have been here a few months now and the general feeling here is not what you posted. Some of the more senior players are huge Studio supporters. There is one for sure and a few maybes that do not care for Studio's. I have had a few in my short 46 years' date=' I have also had the higher end Gibson's. The studio was designed for one thing, a no frills looking but great studio guitar.

 

See how at home this Studio looks.

 

[img']http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/41/l_2c4f63ffc1d44a09adbc46387123f662.jpg[/img]

 

 

GAS'ing the iceman!!! Guitar Center just stocked one this week here for the first time in years. I played it for an hour....

 

Oh, Studios are Fine. The expensive details missing, but the sound still there, or mostly there.

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Word up' date=' I am poor!

 

Here's the thing. I have been trying to unload this guitar for a month now, so I can get an SG Standard. People have been offering $500, which may be fair in some markets (considering I've already sold the case, and it has just a few scratches), but I have upgraded the pickups to active Duncans, and it plays so well that I feel like $725 is a fair number.

 

Nobody wants it.

 

I feel like I'd be doing an injustice selling it at that $500-$600. People tell me that's what they go for, but that's B.S.

 

Specials go for that much, but Studios go for between $700 and $900 when dealing with people that have some sense. You may catch one for $650, or someone holding out hope and selling one for $1000 or $1100, but normally $700 - $900 is fair. This is a THICK, HEAVY Les Paul, with a pretty slim and fast neck. Not the newer ones that are cheaper and lighter. To me, it's worth it.

 

Someone tell me if I'm out of line?[/quote']

 

Gibsons are suppose to hold value' date=' and because of ignorance that isn't holding true.[/quote']

 

Here's the problem... It's not that your asking price is unreasonable because you've put some money into modifications, it's because you made modifications at all and pickups are one of the mods that will often make people shy away because they can dramatically change the sound of the guitar.

 

To *you* the guitar is worth more because you put in pickups that you like better but someone else may or may not like those active Duncans. If you're trying to sell it on Craig's List or Ebay, potential buyers have no way of knowing if they'd like the pickups or not without being able to try out your guitar first compared to a stock Studio that they can try out in a music store or by playing a friend's guitar. For all they know, they might be buying a guitar with pickups they hate and end up having to dump another $150 or more into a guitar they just paid a premium for because it has different pickups.

 

That's how it always ends up working out with any guitar that has been modified (Gibsons, Fenders, etc.). Yes, most Gibsons hold their value but only if they're collectible to begin with and unmodified (or at least if only minor mods have been performed). Studios are very nice guitars but Gibson makes and sells tons of them so they're not rare or collectible aside from limited runs they do with different finishes or gold hardware or whatever.

 

If I were you and if you still have the original pickups, I'd try putting the guitar up for sale again and advertise that the original pickups will be included with the sale of the guitar. Or, if you're handy with a soldering iron, put the original pickups back in and either sell the Duncans separately or keep them yourself for some other guitar. If you don't still have the original pups, you're probably going to have to adjust what you expect to get for the guitar or wait until the economy picks up a bit.

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I have 4 guitars that I think people rag on more then they should. First the Studio. Like many previous posters say, they are exceptional guitars that big money snobs like to rag on. Second my Melody Maker. I always hear people make fun of them when they see them. Try playing one once. Third my MIM Strat. In most of the guitar world I really believe that high end guitars are high end for a reason. But I fail to see much difference between alot of the US and Mexican ones. I modded mine out just the way I want it electronically and color wise (still want to put on a maple neck). It looks just like any US one does and sounds just like I want it to. Only paid like $175 for it with stickers all over it (ty Goo Gone), a bit dinged up on the back with the crappy original pickups. Now it's schweeet. Fourth, my Ibanez acoustic. I'm not a big acoustic player. I just dabble in it. Now I think acoustics are where the REAL snobs lie. Gibson, Martin, Taylor etc. all make superb acoustics. Granted Ibanez are a notch below. However I believe Ibanez are great value for acoustics. Though I do admit I am eyeing a Gibson acoustic.

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Studios, as the name suggests, were originally designed to be just that - studio guitars. It's not that people don't like the Studio as a player or tone machine, it's just that they don't look particularly great on stage when compared to a LP that has binding, nice exposed maple top, etc.

 

There is also the fact that many people wish to have a guitar that looks similar (or in cases of signature guitars, identical) to those of their heroes. More often than not, these heroes were playing LP's designed before the birth of the Studio - so again, it's not that it's a poor quality or inferior guitar, it's just that when people think of finally getting the LP they have in their head, it's more often than not, not a Studio.

 

Snobbery? Yes, perhaps. For good or bad, that's just the way it is.

 

By the way, +1 to what Rich said.

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Third my MIM Strat. In most of the guitar world I really believe that high end guitars are high end for a reason. But I fail to see much difference between alot of the US and Mexican ones. I modded mine out just the way I want it electronically and color wise (still want to put on a maple neck). It looks just like any US one does and sounds just like I want it to. Only paid like $175 for it with stickers all over it (ty Goo Gone)' date=' a bit dinged up on the back with the crappy original pickups. Now it's schweeet.[/quote']

 

The MIM Fenders are a great deal but they do have some issues, IMO. I own both a MIA 57 RI Strat and a MIM Standard. Here are the differences that I have a problem with:

 

- As you noted, the stock pups are terrible.

- The beveling behind the nut where the headstock starts on mine was cut sloppy as hell

- Not enough of an angle to the headstock (I ended up adding two additional string trees to stop the strings from rattling)

- Pots and switch are ultra cheap (not much of an issue really, they all break eventually)

- Fret ends are sharp

 

Now, all that said, I bought my MIM for $150 (minus even a gig bag) at a clearance sale and put the pups from my 57 RI (which I ended up replacing...) and will "eventually" get the fret ends dealt with. All in all, it's a great second Strat as a backup for my 57 RI and even a very respectable Strat all on it's own even if it looks kind of funny with all those damned string trees on it.

 

I do love the 57 though; it has a great neck, stays in tune forever (unless I use the bar, which I gave up on with all guitars) and sounds perfect *to me* with the custom pups I put in it. I also got that one at a clearance sale for $800 with a mismatched Ibanez case and that was an incredible deal. Would I pay $1500 for what they go for new now? I'd probably look for a nice Standard instead and pocket the difference.

 

IMO, the MIM Fenders are incredible deals; you get a very nice guitar for the money (much better value than anything Gibson offers) but you might have to put some work and money into them to get them up to snuff which may or may not save you much money in the long run when compared to some other model Fenders.

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Pick-ups are the same (Alnico Humbuckers) 490R & 498T' date=' and they have a carved maple top. Only difference is the binding and the inlay. [/quote']

 

The standards now have Burstbucker Pros

I think gibson purposely made the VM with the BBs and then no maple top and the studio with 490r & 498t and a maple top so you dont have a guitar with only binding as the diffrence.

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Word up' date=' I am poor!

 

Here's the thing. I have been trying to unload this guitar for a month now, so I can get an SG Standard. People have been offering $500, which may be fair in some markets (considering I've already sold the case, and it has just a few scratches), but I have upgraded the pickups to active Duncans, and it plays so well that I feel like $725 is a fair number.

 

Nobody wants it.

 

I feel like I'd be doing an injustice selling it at that $500-$600. People tell me that's what they go for, but that's B.S.

 

Specials go for that much, but Studios go for between $700 and $900 when dealing with people that have some sense. You may catch one for $650, or someone holding out hope and selling one for $1000 or $1100, but normally $700 - $900 is fair. This is a THICK, HEAVY Les Paul, with a pretty slim and fast neck. Not the newer ones that are cheaper and lighter. To me, it's worth it.

 

Someone tell me if I'm out of line?[/quote']

 

to echo what was already said... the active Duncans are most likely viewed as a downgrade on a LP.... anything non-original will do that... mods, doesn't matter if on guitars, or cars, or whatever else... usually takes away from the value... you never get your money out of mods... doesn't matter how much you think it improves the sound, since that is very subjective...

 

perhaps find a set of 490R/498T pickups if you don't have yours anymore, and pop them in... guaranteed you'll get closer to your asking price... you can then sell the Duncans by themselves on the SD forums...

 

 

cheers

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to echo what was already said... the active Duncans are most likely viewed as a downgrade on a LP.... anything non-original will do that...

 

 

cheers

 

Yeah' date=' I figured that, but I personally consider the Studio akin to the MIM Strat. It's cheaper and doesn't normally appreciate, so it's better to mod. I wouldn't mod a Standard too much for fear of jeopardizing the value, but a Studio ain't goin' nowhere.

 

You make good points though.

 

The sound [i']is[/i] subjective, but I haven't ever heard anything but good feedback after people hear it on stage!

 

Seriously though, not trying to kiss ***, but you guys know your sh*t around here. If I posted this on a local music forum or craigslist, I'd get crazy responses.

 

Probably a few offers for penis enlargement cream as well![-X

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Saturn' date=' I think you're right that Epiphone uses a maple "veneer" as opposed to the maple cap. I think it's done for appearance rather than tone. Someone please correct if wrong (don't want to mess up the specs for other readers).

 

 

[/quote']Your absolutly right about the maple veneer, but Epiphone does this for two other reasons: Cost effectiveness, and weight reduction.

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