uncle fester Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 (edited) Hi all - i've had to take a little time away from the guit due to a sore arm so started working on singing pitch. I know, most of you are probably saying 'geeze, he's got perfect pitch why would he put time into that' but i have to say, regardless of how good you are, there's always room for improvement. Anyways, just starting - but what I've been doing is play a note on the guitar, and try to match it with my voice - using a guitar tuner to tell me how close I am. Getting real time feedback on how I'm doing seems to be what I need to work on at the moment, hence the tuner - but hoping doing this develops my ear. I'm not looking to be a singing virtuouso, but do want to get a little better than horrible. Anyone else have any tricks to practice? Rgds - billroy (ps - going away for the day (striper fishing with light tackle), so wont be able to catch up to comments till later / tomorrow, but thank you all for any input and will reply when i'm back) Edited June 19, 2019 by billroy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 I'm on this journey right now, and what has helped me enormously is listening back to recordings of my singing. I record on the Garageband app on my iPad, which to me is the quickest, most hassle fee way to record. When doing a song, I listen to tons of attempts, trying to find the best bits of very short snippets. When I fail, I listen for sharp or flat singing to figure out why I'm missing, then I try again. I've also come to the conclusion that if I'm uncertain about a note being off or not, it is ALWAYS off. When getting it just right, there is no uncertainty. I have one oddity yet to figure out. When I sing, I have a hard time hearing the mistakes as they happen, but when I play back the recording I pick it up right away. Don't know why that is. So my advice is to record yourself and listen and compare attempts. Good luck! Lars 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 You ever where earphones to monitor yourself when singing Lars? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidblast Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 (edited) I think what BBG says is probably what has helped me the most. A lot of signing is really down to muscle memory and breathing. Knowing where that note is before you sing it, it's not all that different from what your hand will do when forming chords. You don't even think about it, the fingers just go there. It's the same principle in singing, just voice rather than guitar. The next thing to be concerned with is breathing. When to suck that breath in, and how much you need. Too much is as bad as not enough. I practice most of the time using a set of in ear monitors right off my sound board (I use a similar setup for solo gigs). I know when I move the least bit off pitch. A quick recording also never hurts, because what you will hear real time when playing, and what you hear on a playback, is quite different This setup with headphones, or a decent set of in ear monitors IMHO makes a huge difference, and it will for sure help your confidence level which I think is a huge part of everything working well together.. (for the in ear monitors, I picked up some from the same Company that makes them for Fender for 40 bucks instead of 100 with the Fender name on them) IMHO, You can't be apologetic when you're singing, you just gotta "get there". it's your voice, OWN it. Edited June 19, 2019 by kidblast 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 6 hours ago, blindboygrunt said: You ever where earphones to monitor yourself when singing Lars? Yes, I do. I've tried all kinds of variations in volume level when recording my voice, but I'm still terrible at hearing pitch when singing. Listening back, I hear it very well and can pick out bad spots, that I often thought where okey while singing. I guess I just lack experience... Lars 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidblast Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 Lars, have ever you considered looking to take some singing lessons? Maybe you just need some techniques fixed or something along those lines. You might not find the right teacher right off, but if there's some market for that where you live, it might be worth a shot. I am mostly self taught singing wise, but I did have a few lessons along the way which did help me understand a few things I wasn't quite the right amounts of attention to prior to those sessions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoSoxBiker Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 I do the bulk of my searching for pitch while practicing, and do try to make the muscle memory scenario thing happen. I have big difficulties sometimes getting up to the correct octave. I practice beside a MIDI keyboard and play the melody line an octave higher using a basic ugly synth tone in my ear as a guide. I eventually remove the keyboard from the equation and sing away. I've done some of my better vocals by doing this while tracking, though. "Dead Flowers" is one that comes to mind. Singing a B G or higher is not an easy thing for me. it obviously does not work all that well. 😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluesKing777 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 (edited) It is way, way, way easier than learning the fully impossible - GUITAR! While the few very talented are born seemingly knowing how to do everything, the rest of us plod along our whole lives learning it. You can come up with incredibly complicated ways to practice singing on pitch but the only way is to do it for many years with fine tuning and refinement. Now, what can seem the hardest immediately can also be the easiest in the long run.... learn simple music theory. It really is the key to everything. It is incredibly easy, but like anything, can get really hard, so you don't have to become Beethoven - just learn the basics, Music for Dummies perhaps: https://www.amazon.com.au/Music-Theory-Dummies-Michael-Pilhofer/dp/1118990943/ref=asc_df_1118990943/?tag=googleshopdsk-22&linkCode=df0&hvadid=341793170132&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=18096642114680131673&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9071459&hvtargid=pla-432174309496&psc=1 After getting started on that, it is like everything to do with music - repetition. And then one fine morning, you have it. All. Easy - and you think, why didn't I do this all those years ago? Everyone goes -"Aaaah, I'm can't do it, I'm a moron, I'm too stupid, I'll never get it!" etc. Fooey! easy. And easiest in the long run for all the stuff you want to learn. So the other day, I posted this track I recorded - a simple instrumental version (link below) of Kris K's "Sunday Morning Coming Down'. All it is really is playing the music notes on a page in a book I have but adding a few simple chords now and then. But here is the crux - if you learn the music notes, you can PLAY THEM ON GUITAR to help you learn to sing them! Over and over and over until you got it, or got it a bit, doesn't matter. You can even RECORD IT and sing along! You can buy a zillion books full of it, you can play things you have never actually heard or have a copy of.....music communication! So see if you can sing the tune I did below after a few listens - lyrics on the internet everywhere if you don't know them: BluesKing777. Edited June 19, 2019 by BluesKing777 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle fester Posted June 20, 2019 Author Share Posted June 20, 2019 (edited) Thank you all, very much appreciate the input. Sounds like headphones are a definite. I do use them quite a bit to manage my volume, breathing, clarity etc... but not confident in my ability to judge pitch yet. Will keep working it. BK appreciate the tips as well, will look up the lyrics and put a little vocal down to your toon. I apologize in advance for any catastrophic murdering of it 🙂 PS - striper fishing was good, caught 3 rocks, a bunch of seaweed and was able to return a lot of bait to the ocean. Edited June 20, 2019 by billroy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidblast Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 so how do you prepare your rocks? I usually just put some sea salt on em, and grill them for like 7 days. But even then, still rocks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle fester Posted June 20, 2019 Author Share Posted June 20, 2019 2 hours ago, kidblast said: so how do you prepare your rocks? I usually just put some sea salt on em, and grill them for like 7 days. But even then, still rocks... Worcestershire sauce helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwalker201 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Headphones are my friend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 What success I've had has come from practicing with simple, ballad type songs with melodies that allow you to hit notes with separation between them. Not songs which drone, like a lot of modern country songs, repeating the same note a dozen times in each bar, or are full of flats, sharps or worse key changes. Get good hitting the basic notes. Christmas Carols, The Star Spangled Banner, etc. well known classics, Danny Boy. And if you don't have enough air to push the note, you'll miss it. In a quiet room, facing the wall, you'll hear yourself well enough. G'Luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwalker201 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 14 minutes ago, fortyearspickn said: well known classics, Danny Boy. I never heard anyone try this one in here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Just now, kwalker201 said: I never heard anyone try this one in here Big stretch that song Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle fester Posted June 20, 2019 Author Share Posted June 20, 2019 Think I'll start with 'take me out to the ballgame' - sounds horrible at the moment, but I think fits the bill as a good practice song at least to start with. The tip makes sense, I appreciate it. I'm playing it n the key of D at the moment (just because its the version I learned), might have to change that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidblast Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 just don't start scatting on us Bill, Friends don't let friends scat... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle fester Posted June 20, 2019 Author Share Posted June 20, 2019 skabee boop boop bop... too late. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwalker201 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 27 minutes ago, blindboygrunt said: Big stretch that song Be a good one for you Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidblast Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 1 hour ago, billroy said: skabee boop boop bop... too late. wellp.... I tried.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoSoxBiker Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Drones are great. Put some cans on and do a sort of humming sound to this. You will know when you're on pitch. It's kind of a weird feeling. Cello drone on E I actually bought this series and totally spaced that I had them until someone said the word "drone" above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle fester Posted June 21, 2019 Author Share Posted June 21, 2019 Wanted to thank everyone again for the input, here's what I've got going on so far (early days, but a good start). My hoped for goal is that when I sing, I'm confident I'm on key. The exercises I have started are: using a guitar tuner (first playing the notes on guitar), then matching the notes with my voice (I can almost reach the full range of low e to high e, almost, and not good either, lots of opportunity) practicing 'take me out to the ball game' and 'star spangled banner'... (ssb is a better exercise, tougher range) very humbling and big misses are obvious but I'm still developing an ear to hear all the misses. Some of it beyond my range, avoiding those at the moment on deck - PBs drone exercise. -------- I expect these to evolve, but feel these are good building blocks to start with. Again thinking if I can get my arms around these, it will help me progress down the path of singing with confidence that I am on key. If anyone thinks i'm off base or suggestions to augment i'm all ears. rgds... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 On 6/20/2019 at 5:38 PM, kwalker201 said: Be a good one for you Stu Not for all the tea in China Couldnt even if I wanted to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 If you listen to Eva Cassidy sing it, you'll be inspired enough to reconsider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnneS Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 My favorite Danny Boy arrangement ever. These guys are both from Belfast but met each other here in North Carolina. This, this is how it’s done... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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