rct Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 The new Tone Master amps are digital reproductions of the originals. A digital solid state Twin and Deluxe. Half the weight, that makes them interesting for sure. rct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, rct said: The new Tone Master amps are digital reproductions of the originals. A digital solid state Twin and Deluxe. Half the weight, that makes them interesting for sure. rct So the Tone Master Twin Reverb has a 200 watt digital power amp switchable from 85 watts down to 1 watt. The Tone Master Deluxe Reverb has a 100 watt digital power amp switchable from 22 watts down to 0.2 watt. Delivered to Jensen N-12K speakers with lightweight neodymium magnets.. Seems like it takes a lot of power to reproduce the sound of a digitally sampled vintage tube amp.. Edited November 4, 2019 by mihcmac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 As has always been the case with SS Amps (or whatever you want to call them) vs. Tube Amps... OffsetGuitarForum has had long discussions on these.. Some think they're great some don't. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 Not sure about those new Fender SS amps... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 The early SS amps were producing their own SS sound which created unharmonic distortion, where a tube amp creates harmonic distortion through sympathetic vibration of the chassis and tubes. The Tone Master, like playing a CD on a stereo, would be reproducing a digitally sampled tube sound while using algorithms to interpret drive and other things. Some of the first digital recordings started around 64bit but clipped the analog signal when compared to tape. So 64 went to 128 to 256 an so on until enough head room was reached to make clipping imperceptible, but some people with the ear for it , still prefer analog recording on tape. Perhaps this could provide a tube sound free of the snap, crackle and pop of old tubes... I hope its better than my last modeling amp.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 Any of the 3 amps mentioned is good, I think you'd have to A/B for the sound you prefer. I know digital modelling has come on lots (I have a Roland Micro-Cube, you might want to check the Cube series out) but I still prefer valves for a guitar signal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 (edited) Everyone seems to love their Champs.. Ian, being in the UK, went with a tube powered Cornell Traveller 5. The Tone Master amps are something completely different, just a processor producing a digital model of a Twin or Deluxe. They may be junk, but I do have local Fender dealer that if one comes in I will try it. But a light weight version of a Deluxe might be interesting, mine weighs a ton. I run on battery power a lot of the time of the time using my Micro Cubes.. Edited November 7, 2019 by mihcmac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 21 hours ago, jdgm said: Any of the 3 amps mentioned is good, I think you'd have to A/B for the sound you prefer. I know digital modelling has come on lots (I have a Roland Micro-Cube, you might want to check the Cube series out) but I still prefer valves for a guitar signal. 1973/1974? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 3 hours ago, badbluesplayer said: 1973/1974? I should know, I did look it up. Got to be about then...can't get Vibrochamp.org at the moment. Let me ask you BTW - is there any way I can get more bass out of it? I changed the speaker which helped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 18 hours ago, jdgm said: I should know, I did look it up. Got to be about then...can't get Vibrochamp.org at the moment. Let me ask you BTW - is there any way I can get more bass out of it? I changed the speaker which helped. Maybe an EQ Pedal? Some Cut on Mids & Highs. Some Boost on Bass... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 (edited) 21 hours ago, jdgm said: I should know, I did look it up. Got to be about then...can't get Vibrochamp.org at the moment. Let me ask you BTW - is there any way I can get more bass out of it? I changed the speaker which helped. You might try setting the Bass to 10 and treble to 0 and then gradually increase the treble to get some clarity.. 3 hours ago, Larsongs said: Maybe an EQ Pedal? Some Cut on Mids & Highs. Some Boost on Bass... Good idea or even any pedal with some tone control might help.. Edited November 8, 2019 by mihcmac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 3 hours ago, mihcmac said: You might try setting the Bass to 10 and treble to 0 and then gradually increase the treble to get some clarity.. Good idea or even any pedal with some tone control might help.. 4 hours ago, Larsongs said: Maybe an EQ Pedal? Some Cut on Mids & Highs. Some Boost on Bass... Yes the Boss GE-7 does a very good job I also use a reverb pedal on a spring setting....I always wanted a Princeton, or the Rivera-designed Champ II which is "extremely louder". Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love my Vibrochamp. I know some people manage to fit in a 10" speaker but I think you have to enlarge the cut-out....when you compare it to a modern small amp, they seem to have (proportionately) a lot more bass. I wondered if there were any wiring mods; I did have it wired "blackface" but eventually got it put back to stock. Wasn't Randall Smith's original Boogie a modded Fender Champ with a larger speaker which he showed to Santana, who said "This thing really boogies" or some such. ....? Small amps - general observation; mass-produced quality is high but you do get what you pay for. There has been a move back to simplicity; and digital modelling continues to evolve and improve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 (edited) If your speaker has plug on connectors you could try connecting a low watt 10" instrument speaker with some alligator clip jumpers to see what it sounds like, or connect to a small cabinet, but have your internal speaker unplugged while testing. I think Champs use 4 ohms it may be marked on the back of your speaker.. I have seen people install slightly larger speakers without enlarging the hole, just centering on the hole as close as possible, this way would help prevent undo damage to your classic amp.. A good part of the sound comes out the back anyway.. You may get more bottom out of a 10 but using more power it may not be quite as loud. or Try an upgraded 8" with more bottom end.. or How to improve your amps tone with preamp tube swaps.... on Reverb Edited November 9, 2019 by mihcmac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, jdgm said: Yes the Boss GE-7 does a very good job I also use a reverb pedal on a spring setting....I always wanted a Princeton, or the Rivera-designed Champ II which is "extremely louder". Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love my Vibrochamp. I know some people manage to fit in a 10" speaker but I think you have to enlarge the cut-out....when you compare it to a modern small amp, they seem to have (proportionately) a lot more bass. I wondered if there were any wiring mods; I did have it wired "blackface" but eventually got it put back to stock. Wasn't Randall Smith's original Boogie a modded Fender Champ with a larger speaker which he showed to Santana, who said "This thing really boogies" or some such. ....? Small amps - general observation; mass-produced quality is high but you do get what you pay for. There has been a move back to simplicity; and digital modelling continues to evolve and improve. I think Mesa Boogie started modding Princetons or Princeton Reverbs. Anyway, if you want more bass, try increasing the value of the coupling cap out of the second gain stage. In the pic below, that's the 0.02 uf cap on the board where the wire from pin 6 of the tube way over on the right hits the board - the wire that says 200v on it - about 1/3 of the way over from the right hand side of the board. That's the cap that runs between where the 100k resistor splits off and where the wire labeled "X" splits off. Try raising the value of that cap to 0.047, or just tack on another 0.022 cap in parallel with the existing 0.022 (to raise the effective value to 0.044), and see if that helps. That will deliver more low end to the power tube. You might be able to raise it all the way to 0.1, but it might start farting out. 👍 Edited November 9, 2019 by badbluesplayer 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Many thanks bbp, I copy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 On November 8, 2019 at 10:12 AM, mihcmac said: You might try setting the Bass to 10 and treble to 0 and then gradually increase the treble to get some clarity.. Good idea or even any pedal with some tone control might help.. Yes, most important, take your time dialing in the Volume, Bass & Treble Settings on your Amp with your Guitar... You gotta find the Sweet Spot.... Also, Have you tried any other Tubes than the Stock ones that came with the Amp? Many times with quality Tubes all your problems disappear.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 (edited) On 11/9/2019 at 10:11 AM, Larsongs said: Yes, most important, take your time dialing in the Volume, Bass & Treble Settings on your Amp with your Guitar... You gotta find the Sweet Spot.... Also, Have you tried any other Tubes than the Stock ones that came with the Amp? Many times with quality Tubes all your problems disappear.. All very true, after doing research on the net and trying used and new tube amps, I was leaning towards a Blues Jr. But found used Jr's were starting to make "snap crackle and pop" noises, leading me to focus on a new one or newer. While searching reviews the MP Stage Right 15w kept popping up, anyway a new 15w tube amp delivered for $249 seemed to be worth the risk. As it turned out, it was and being a P90 player the very low line noise is impressive.. One of most recommended non tube amps is the Roland Blues Cube Hot 30w. The only thing that could be taken as a criticism is that they are loud. Edited February 7, 2020 by mihcmac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Californiaman Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 Like my Gibson GA-5. Suits my needs and takes pedals well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted February 8, 2020 Share Posted February 8, 2020 On 2/7/2020 at 8:20 AM, Californiaman said: Like my Gibson GA-5. Suits my needs and takes pedals well. Those were great amps and simple. There is a Mojotone GA-5 style kit available. But I'm sure nothing has the class of the original. I was looking at Mojotone for a tube chassis that could replace my Deluxe 900 chassis when I saw the GA-5 kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryUK Posted February 9, 2020 Share Posted February 9, 2020 I use a Yamaha THR 10. Its loud, has built in effects and sounds great. I also have a Blackstar HT5R. Great combo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mihcmac Posted February 10, 2020 Share Posted February 10, 2020 19 hours ago, LarryUK said: I use a Yamaha THR 10. Its loud, has built in effects and sounds great. I also have a Blackstar HT5R. Great combo. Do you use them together, I like the sound from multiple amps... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryUK Posted February 10, 2020 Share Posted February 10, 2020 6 hours ago, mihcmac said: Do you use them together, I like the sound from multiple amps... I use a Radial Bigshot ab/y pedal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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