SpookyFox Posted November 19, 2019 Posted November 19, 2019 Hello, Just picked up an Epi Les Paul Standard in a stunning translucent green. While I haven't been able to get any solid hits from online dating sources, from what I've read online, it was built in 2000 in the Saein, Korea factory. What raised an eyebrow was the sloppy, unmatched serial number and lack of any Epiphone or "Limited" Edition logos on the back of the headstock. Is this common for this factory/time period? Should I be worried this might be a fake? Any help would be most appreciated! Thanks!
mihcmac Posted November 19, 2019 Posted November 19, 2019 Not likely to be a fake, it is a Les Paul Standard Translucent , we recently decoded the SN from some Korean builds from this era. A lot of the builds from 2000 to 2004 SN code style was undocumented. I = Saein, Korea 02 = 2002 0 = no month indicated 8809 = 8809th guitar built that year This could be it
RobinTheHood Posted November 20, 2019 Posted November 20, 2019 To me, the serial number font looks wrong. The style is more similar to the current Qingdaos than a Korean Epiphone. And I've never seen an Saein "I" that tall or in that font. If I only saw the serial and nothing else, I'd call it a fake. However, the rest of the headstock looks 100% legit. Even the crooked tuners, which was indicative of the Korean quality control of that era.
SpookyFox Posted November 20, 2019 Author Posted November 20, 2019 Might the control wiring be indicative of anything? Someone told me to check and see if it was solid wood (vs. MDF), which it appears to be, but I was a little surprised to see the mini pots when I took the cover plate off.
mihcmac Posted November 20, 2019 Posted November 20, 2019 8 hours ago, SpookyFox said: Might the control wiring be indicative of anything? Someone told me to check and see if it was solid wood (vs. MDF), which it appears to be, but I was a little surprised to see the mini pots when I took the cover plate off. I saw a few posts and images on the web talking about the use of mini pots on some Korean builds, it seem its not that uncommon, where you would expect full size. But as long as the mini's are 500k they will work same as full size. When both are on 10 there is no difference but when you taper down to Zero, the full size will be smoother. Epiphone normally uses 500k full size audio taper with a short shaft, where Gibson frequently use long shaft because their tops run thicker and have an adjustment nut on both sides of the top. There is another post in here about an Epiphone Lucille that used the same type of serial number your Standard uses. At first I thought it was fake as the SN didn't checkout in the databases. The Lucille checked out to be real and we found more Lucille's with the same type of SN. We even compared it to a true fake Lucille which had several differences including a 2005 Qingdao China SN that checked out, but was fake. SN's are not a good way of telling because the faker is copying real SN's. Epiphone Bridges and Stopbars are normally marked "Epiphone" on the bottom. During the 4 year span of 2000 to 2004 some of the Korean Manufacturers stoped counting how many per month they were producing and started counting Guitars per year, not needing to track what month anymore. Which is kind of a western concept. So this not well documented new system just lists Factory, Year and Lot or how many total. Your LP shows 8,809 so getting close to needing another digit. So your actual build number would be 08809 using up all of the available digits in your SN. I0208809 I = Saein, Korea 02 = 2002 no month 08809 = 8809th guitar built that year I have found several irreproachable Korean built Epiphones that use this serial number type and the Guitar Dater Project kicks them all out...
SpookyFox Posted November 21, 2019 Author Posted November 21, 2019 Thanks for all of your replies. I know we’re not exactly taking high-end guitars here, but I find it reassuring to know. It’s a beautiful guitar and I like it more and more as I get to know it. Thanks again for taking the time to reply and share your knowledge and experience, it has been much appreciated!
mihcmac Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 52 minutes ago, SpookyFox said: Thanks for all of your replies. I know we’re not exactly taking high-end guitars here, but I find it reassuring to know. It’s a beautiful guitar and I like it more and more as I get to know it. Thanks again for taking the time to reply and share your knowledge and experience, it has been much appreciated! Your Les Paul Standard Translucent isn't a low end guitar its at least the same class or higher than a Custom. Of coarse compared the Gibson version you might have to add a 0 to what you paid for the Epiphone.. Sometimes doing research is the best use of my time. 🙂 My 56 Les Paul Standard Pro..
RobinTheHood Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 The translucents were Standards with cool paint jobs. The main difference from a custom being that it has a maple or alder cap rather than being all mahogany. Not a high end guitar in the grand scheme of things, but not exactly low end either. I classify them as mid grade. Affordable, but well constructed. As for the potentiometers, Epiphone did use mini pots in the 1990s. I have a few guitars with them. But I think they went to full size by 2000. I have a 2001 Saein LP Standard that i can check this afternoon. I'm pretty sure it has full size pots though.
RobinTheHood Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 I just took a closer look at your control cavity and I can tell you that it shouldn't look like that. Epiphone didn't drill out secondary cavities to accommodate the mini pots. It should also have quick connect wiring, I believe. I'll post pics of my serial and control cavity tonight.
SpookyFox Posted November 21, 2019 Author Posted November 21, 2019 Awesome looking 56'! What kind of vibrato do you have on there? I had one in Chicago Blue for a while (had to sell it to help with medical expenses). Loved the neck on that thing.
SpookyFox Posted November 21, 2019 Author Posted November 21, 2019 Every time I'm ready to accept the fact that it's a genuine Epiphone! 😉 I've been in touch with Gibson/Epiphone and they had me send in several photos of the guitar, inside and out. I'll be very interesting in what they have to say.
RobinTheHood Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 1 hour ago, SpookyFox said: Every time I'm ready to accept the fact that it's a genuine Epiphone! 😉 I've been in touch with Gibson/Epiphone and they had me send in several photos of the guitar, inside and out. I'll be very interesting in what they have to say. Well, it's weird because the front of the headstock looks correct, and thats usually an area that is always wrong in some way. Plus, it has the correct Epiphone tuners, which counterfeiters don't typically replicate. Even the pickup leads look right. That, and the fact that counterfeits weren't very common until a few years later with the move to Qingdao. They still existed, but usually with higher end stuff like the zakk wyldes and customs. Usually, identifying a fake is a lot more cut and dry than this. I hope Epiphone has some answers for you.
SpookyFox Posted November 22, 2019 Author Posted November 22, 2019 Epiphone wasn’t much help. They said it “appears” to be authentic and sent a link for the current Plus Top Pro line. There may be some odd things on there but I’m calling it authentic. I’ll probably upgrade pickups and wiring someday but for now I’m just going to enjoy it. Thanks again for all your help and input!
mihcmac Posted November 22, 2019 Posted November 22, 2019 On 11/21/2019 at 4:28 AM, SpookyFox said: Awesome looking 56'! What kind of vibrato do you have on there? I had one in Chicago Blue for a while (had to sell it to help with medical expenses). Loved the neck on that thing. Its a Duesenberg Les Trem II that has about twice the range of a B5 and just bolts on in place of the Stopbar.. I have had lots of of tremolo's but the Les Trem II is my favorite and its a non-destructive tremolo.
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