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Gibson Traditional Craziness


Eighthnote74
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Hello all, I'm having issues getting good information about a Les Paul Traditional. I know some Traditionals have the year in the 1st 2 digits of the serial number. Some of the earlier ones still used the 1st and 5th numbers. What's making this confusing is that this Traditional has 57 classic pickups and Grover Tuners.  All the info I've seen list the 2017 Traditional as having Klusons and BurstBucker Pickups? And what's up with the Traditional "T"? Gibson has lost their minds. Could some one please give me some info on why my Traditional ? Thanks all..........

2020-06-24 14.26.15.png

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27 minutes ago, Eighthnote74 said:

Hello all, I'm having issues getting good information about a Les Paul Traditional. I know some Traditionals have the year in the 1st 2 digits of the serial number. Some of the earlier ones still used the 1st and 5th numbers. What's making this confusing is that this Traditional has 57 classic pickups and Grover Tuners.  All the info I've seen list the 2017 Traditional as having Klusons and BurstBucker Pickups? And what's up with the Traditional "T"? Gibson has lost their minds. Could some one please give me some info on why my Traditional ? Thanks all..........

2020-06-24 14.26.15.png

Nice axe. Gibson doesn't even know. If it sounds good play it.

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For a number of years, Gibson made released a new line of guitars every year, like cars. The "T" suffix was just for 2016 and 2017 if I remember rightly. In 2015 every model, including the Traditional, had the G-Force Tuners and the zero-fret nut. The following two years every model came in two versions, HP ("high performance", with G-Force tuners and zero-fret nut), and T ("traditional", with regular tuners and nut). So you could buy a Les Paul Traditional High Performance, or a Les Paul Traditional Traditional. I guess it must have seemed to make some sort of sense at the time. In 2018 and 2019 they only had one HP model, and all the other models had regular tuners and nuts and dropped the T. And then later in 2019 the new owners took over and revamped the line again into "Original Collection" and "Modern Collection", and the HP model was dropped altogether.

They now have a "Legacy Archive" that gives the specs for all their guitars going back to 2015, and you can find others on older versions of the Gibson website via the Wayback Machine.

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Thanks for the info folks. My serial number (which begins 17) would lead me to think this guitar was altered. That's all I'm trying to find out here.  Do I have a stock Traditional or did someone change it up? It's hard for me to ponder why someone would switch out BurstBuckers and Klusons for Classic 59s and Grovers. That's barely a difference at all. Usually if someone switches their tuners and pickups it's to get a completely different tone. These pickup and tuner combos are too much alike to make any sense. Someone mention that Gibson isn't much help. They were correct.

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Not sure yours is really a "Traditional", the features (if they haven't been changed) seem more in line with a Standard.  I bought a 2017 LP Standard and the Model was known as a "Les Paul Standard T 2017".  But the "T" did NOT mean Traditional.  I don't recall what it stood for, but the guitar has Grover locking tuners, Burstbucker Pro pickups, and ultra modern weight relief.  It has chrome hardware (not nickel), a Nashville bridge, and all four knobs are push/pull (coil taps, out of phase, and bypass).  It came with a pickguard, but no poker chip.  Mine was built in 2016 as a 2017 model and serial number starts with 17.

The big thing about the "Traditional" models as I recall was that they were not weight relieved at all.  So one way to tell what yours is would be to weigh it.  Mine weighs about 7.5 pounds.  A non-weight relieved model would probably be closer to 9 or 10.  Also as I recall the Traditionals said "Traditional" on the truss rod cover, but those are so easily changed it's probably meaningless.  Also I think a Traditional would have an ABR-1 bridge, nickel hardware, and no push/pulls.

Your photo is too small for me to tell which bridge it has, but I would tend to think you have a 2017 Standard and someone switched from Burstbuckers to '57 classics.  The Burstbucker Pros are very clean, bright, and trebly so a switch to '57s would have given it a more traditional LP meaty mid-range tone.

 

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1 hour ago, Twang Gang said:

Not sure yours is really a "Traditional", the features (if they haven't been changed) seem more in line with a Standard.  I bought a 2017 LP Standard and the Model was known as a "Les Paul Standard T 2017".  But the "T" did NOT mean Traditional.  I don't recall what it stood for, but the guitar has Grover locking tuners, Burstbucker Pro pickups, and ultra modern weight relief.  It has chrome hardware (not nickel), a Nashville bridge, and all four knobs are push/pull (coil taps, out of phase, and bypass).  It came with a pickguard, but no poker chip.  Mine was built in 2016 as a 2017 model and serial number starts with 17.

The big thing about the "Traditional" models as I recall was that they were not weight relieved at all.  So one way to tell what yours is would be to weigh it.  Mine weighs about 7.5 pounds.  A non-weight relieved model would probably be closer to 9 or 10.  Also as I recall the Traditionals said "Traditional" on the truss rod cover, but those are so easily changed it's probably meaningless.  Also I think a Traditional would have an ABR-1 bridge, nickel hardware, and no push/pulls.

Your photo is too small for me to tell which bridge it has, but I would tend to think you have a 2017 Standard and someone switched from Burstbuckers to '57 classics.  The Burstbucker Pros are very clean, bright, and trebly so a switch to '57s would have given it a more traditional LP meaty mid-range tone.

 

9 lbs.............

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5 hours ago, Eighthnote74 said:

I was emphasizing the pickups. Your point is well taken.

 

Ok, so if I bought that guitar with Kluson tulips on it I'd lose them the first day for a set of Grovers.  Grovers don't break, Kluson tulips do, and you only need it to happen once to hate them.  The Burstbuckers are a bit on the shrill, harsh, scritchy side, depending on what words you like to use, so I'd also put 57 Classics in it the first day, the closest they have to their own PAFs.

rct

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13 hours ago, Eighthnote74 said:

 why someone would switch out BurstBuckers and Klusons for Classic 59s and Grovers. That's barely a difference at all. t.

 

I would. I tried out a beautiful LP Standard I wanted to buy 5 years ago. I went through every combination of guitar & amp controls/EQ and could not get a usable sound out of it. This was using a decent Orange rig. I gave up and moved into the next booth and tried all over again with the Marshall. Same outcome. This took 45 or 50 minutes.

Before leaving, I picked up a different LP and tried that out. It sounded great immediately. I asked about what pickups were installed in each. The Standard had Burstbuckers and the other one had 59 Classics. 

The specs may be close, but the proof is in the sound.

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On 6/29/2020 at 3:39 AM, merciful-evans said:

 

I would. I tried out a beautiful LP Standard I wanted to buy 5 years ago. I went through every combination of guitar & amp controls/EQ and could not get a usable sound out of it. This was using a decent Orange rig. I gave up and moved into the next booth and tried all over again with the Marshall. Same outcome. This took 45 or 50 minutes.

Before leaving, I picked up a different LP and tried that out. It sounded great immediately. I asked about what pickups were installed in each. The Standard had Burstbuckers and the other one had 59 Classics. 

The specs may be close, but the proof is in the sound.

 

Yes, the proof is in the sound, but in all reality, the only apple to apples comparison is the different pups in the exact same guitar.  Granted, in your case most of the difference *should* be the pups, but there are other factors too.  FWIW, I think the 59 Classics are "better" LP pups than BBs, in my limited experience.

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