stevegarside Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 Hi all - new forum member here I have a new Gibson j-185 ('Original', 2020 model). It looks fabulous, has a great neck and is super-comfortable - but I'm a bit underwhelmed with its acoustic tone. It seems so 'stiff' and lacking in resonance. All I hear and sense are the strings, rather than the body of the guitar. It's sounds like a laminate rather than a 3 grand plus instrument. To some extent I know this might be a function of the maple back and sides, but still I did expect more. Anyone else have the same experience? Did the tone improve noticeably over time with this guitar? Also, I wondered if removing the under-saddle pickup might improve the resonance and tone - and noticed someone else (Jinder) had posted on this, mentioning the big improvement he had on a not-dissimilar maple SJ00. Anyone else had a similar experience? I am never going to gig the guitar so I am not bothered about losing the PU, other than in affecting possible resale value. I'd appreciate any views on the J-185 - and whether anyone thinks removing the pickup is a good idea/utterly crazy. Cheers, Steven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucebubs Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 Have you tried DR Sunbeam round core strings? They really lifted my much cheaper laminate Epiphone EJ-200, might be worth a shot, take care installing round-core strings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegarside Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 Hi - thanks Brucebubs for the reply and the suggestion. I am a fan of Sunbeams, though haven't tried them on it yet so will add to the list of possible remedies. I like 'warm and mellow' strings, especially Thomastik Plectrums. These are on it at the moment and have helped the tone a bit. Just feels like the top isn't vibrating enough, hence why I thought about the pickup removal. It might just be a question of wait and see - and move it on in 12 months or so if doesn't win me round. Cheers, Steven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul14 Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 1 hour ago, stevegarside said: Hi - thanks Brucebubs for the reply and the suggestion. I am a fan of Sunbeams, though haven't tried them on it yet so will add to the list of possible remedies. I like 'warm and mellow' strings, especially Thomastik Plectrums. These are on it at the moment and have helped the tone a bit. Just feels like the top isn't vibrating enough, hence why I thought about the pickup removal. It might just be a question of wait and see - and move it on in 12 months or so if doesn't win me round. Cheers, Steven I agree with “wait & see” figure out if you even want the guitar first. Sounds to me like you’re having a hard time bonding with it. I’ve had that with a few guitars in the past, & ended up either returning them, or selling them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegarside Posted March 24, 2021 Author Share Posted March 24, 2021 Sensible advice I think Paul - thanks mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 (edited) 9 hours ago, stevegarside said: I have a new Gibson j-185 ('Original', 2020 model). It looks fabulous, has a great neck and is super-comfortable - but I'm a bit underwhelmed with its acoustic tone. It seems so 'stiff' and lacking in resonance. All I hear and sense are the strings, rather than the body of the guitar. That's a pretty accurate description of my experience with the few J-185s I've tried. Have yet to meet one that lives up to the intriguing look of this icon. Something tells me it's thought to be a snappy live strummer. Edited March 24, 2021 by E-minor7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 Welcome Steven - I have a 2012 J-185 with a Fishman Elipse Aura soundhole pickup. It’s a rather massive thing, mounted on the left side of the soundhole. Regardless of the extra baggage, this guitar has sounded full & rich since day one. J-185s tend to be that way - they either sound really good or they don’t, and you typically will know it immediately. Every guitar I’ve ever owned that I hoped would open up never did to any significant extent. I’d like to be hopeful here, but I think you’d be better served by real world experience. My guess is that what you’re hearing from the instrument now will not change dramatically. You want a guitar that makes you swoon right out of the gate. The J-185 example you have seems far from that ideal, so minimal tweaks will probably not be enough to bridge the gap. By all means experiment with strings, because it’s super easy & they can make a big difference. But if that doesn’t result in anything that moves the needle more than a little bit, return the guitar if you have that option, and look for another. It may take time, but a good one is well worth the hunt, and they do exist. Out of the thirty guitars I own, my J-185 would be the one to remain with me on that proverbial desert island. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 (edited) As has been said it can take time for a guitar to realize it is no longer a tree. But while you can nuance sound by putzing with strings and such there is nothing I have found you can do easily to change a guitar's voice. And while nobody likes this answer, even though guitars will "loosen/open up" to some extent with playing and the passage of time, a new guitar with an anemic low end will become an old guitar with an anemic low end. Edited March 24, 2021 by zombywoof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
75 Hummingbird Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 Zomby ...you have a poetic way with words . This is perhaps why a person should play the guitar before they buy the guitar . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul14 Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 3 hours ago, 75 Hummingbird said: Zomby ...you have a poetic way with words . This is perhaps why a person should play the guitar before they buy the guitar . That’s not always possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, 75 Hummingbird said: Zomby ...you have a poetic way with words . This is perhaps why a person should play the guitar before they buy the guitar . Obviously always the best policy but as of late it sure has not gotten any easier to get up close and personal with a guitar. What gets me is something I have read on this forum and others - that the store had three of this or that model in and the salesman tells the potential buyer that the one they would be getting what was the best of the bunch. Makes you wonder what they told the next person who called - that unfortunately they would only be getting second best. Edited March 25, 2021 by zombywoof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J185cat Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 I owned a 2005 Koa b/s J185 for a number of years. Took the guitar a good 3-4 years to open up. And by that I mean the sound was not as compressed sounding, little more sustain and notes just seemed to be more dimensional. What did not change appreciably was volume, bass and general tone. It was better sounding guitar but not a “different” guitar. I really thought the guitar had a beautiful tone but just not suited to me so I sold it. The right person would love that guitar I believe. Also I removed the UST from two J45’s and thought there was small increase in volume and note clarity that made the move worthwhile to me. Once again, same guitar just somewhat improved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinder Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 I have seen an improvement in every guitar that I’ve removed the undersaddle pickup from...which is all of my acoustics! I use soundhole pickups, which to my ear sound a ton better than USTs. 185s are incredibly balanced guitars-this is often mistaken for a sterile tone compared to something big and boomy like a D35 or SJ200, but get it on a mic or in a mix and that tone is unbeatable. I have a Dove from 1995 which, compared with my gigantosaurus-toned Maple AJ, sounds a little neutral and undynamic. In the studio though, every producer and session client picks the Dove when they hear it on mic-it’s so balanced and wonderful in a mix. I would give the 185 time and try some different strings. They’re normally superb instruments...yours may be a duffer of course, but I’ve never met a bad one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J185cat Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 Jinder I think you nailed it with regards to the J185. Beautiful guitars but not for everyone. Peace all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jalex Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 When I first got my J-185 I felt the same way. Great body shape, so comfortable to hold and play but lacking in the tone department. Took a couple of years to really open up and now it's my favorite acoustic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonard McCoy Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 (edited) @stevegarside, I would not change anything about the guitar. If you don't gel with it for whatever reason, it is better to return it while you still can. There is no shame in that. The J-185 and its Everly brother have a distinct sound that I would best describe as balanced, with a perfect blend of brightness and punchy mids, a singer/songwriter's kind of guitar that doesn't drown you out while singing. While many would argue that this model is the perfect strummer, I like to do all sorts of fingerstyle playing on it as well. These guitars are very comfortable to hold and to play even for big guys; they are basically a J-200 shrunk down to the perfect dimensions and to just the right sound and sound output. The model is also highly sought after by vintage collectors. Edited March 28, 2021 by Leonard McCoy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegarside Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 Thanks to everyone for the replies and the advice. Very much appreciated. I am just going to give it time rather than rush it back. It's just so damned comfortable and pretty to give up on it. That narrow waist, coupled with the wide lower bout is wonderful. And Jalex's comments have convinced me there could be real rewards in patience. I don't mind the fairly weak low bottom either, as I like mid-range punchy. (My favourite guitar is a Martin all-solid Ovangkol which is extremely well-balanced. A fabulous strummer). It's the stiffness that bothers me, so I think I'm minded to follow Jinder who has had such a success with removing under saddle pick ups. As I've resolved to live with it for 18 months at least, I might as well give it a few tweaks! All the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbpark Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) In my experience removing the pickup MIGHT elect a SLIGHT improvement in tone, but I highly doubt it will elect a world-changing difference that will all of a sudden made this guitar sound magical. If it sounds dead, flat and like a cheap laminate guitar there's probably nothing you're going to do that will change it so much that you'll turn it into something completely different than what it already is. Better to part ways with it and put that money toward a guitar you can't put down and just want to play all the time. I've been through this exact dilemma. I've owned two SJ200's. One was magical, the other one sounded like a cheap, plywood guitar. Sometimes it's just luck of the draw and some sound amazing, some sound like turds while most sounds decent. With all that said I've taken every stock pickup system out of every Gibson acoustic I've owned that came with a stock UST pickup. Edited March 30, 2021 by sbpark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwlsky Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 On 3/30/2021 at 12:17 AM, stevegarside said: As I've resolved to live with it for 18 months at least, I might as well give it a few tweaks! Stevegarside, how's the tone of your J185 going? Has it improved in the last 9 months? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jchabalk Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 I just read through this thread thanks to the recent post above. What gauge strings are you running on the guitar? I'd recommend trying out a set of .013 / mediums if you haven't already. Made a world of difference on my J-45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 (edited) Hi, The pickup element under the saddle is flexible. You can just remove the saddle, slip the element down into the guitar, and replace the saddle. This should give you an idea of how the guitar sounds without the pickup. I did this with my J45, but found that I liked the sound better with the pickup in place. Oops, sorry, I didn't realize this was an older post. Edited January 5, 2022 by Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwlsky Posted January 6, 2022 Share Posted January 6, 2022 I purchased my J-185 used and the previous owner removed the UST and put in a K&K ultra pure mini. I have no comparison of how it sounded with the UST, but with the current set up, the unplugged sound is fantastic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jalex Posted January 14, 2022 Share Posted January 14, 2022 On 1/6/2022 at 10:25 AM, Kwlsky said: I purchased my J-185 used and the previous owner removed the UST and put in a K&K ultra pure mini. I have no comparison of how it sounded with the UST, but with the current set up, the unplugged sound is fantastic. I have the K&K in mine also, no complaints with the unplugged tone either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.