'62 Reissued Epiphone Crestwood Custom tremolo bar assembly

[MetaRabbit]

I bought a 2020 Crestwood reissue from someone who removed the trembar for shipping and sent the pieces in a Zip-loc bag.  To be fair, he wrapped the trem bar itself in a paper towel to protect it.  I haven't found any support on the internet for how to assemble it (no instructions I can find and no photos detailed enough to convey an idea of what the assembly process should be).  The seller simply gave me a sequence of parts, which doesn't work very well: it's a two-dimensional description of a three-dimensional assembly. 

The parts are a screw, two white plastic washers, a nut, a spring, and a soft disc (rubber?), beside the trem bar piece itself.   The spring fits between two parts: a circular seating on the guitar body and a metal piece that clamps onto the trem base. The clamp is tightened by means of a screw.  The latter clamping piece has the other circular seating to hold the top side of the spring and this is what the dissasembled group of trem-bar parts screw into through a hole in the circular part of the clamping piece.  Together, the clamping piece and the trem-bar group act as a lever to give you vibrato ("tremolo").

I have no idea if I assembled it correctly and I worry especially about the screw falling out.  It doesn't seem like there is anything to keep the spring in place if you pull back on the trem bar (to raise the pitch).  Any suggestions?

Here's what I did:  Since the parts were for the trem bar alone, the initial problem was putting the nut onto the screw because the screw sits down inside the spring (I am guessing).  The spring is about twice as long as the screw.  You would need tiny tiny fingers (and the dexterity of an octopus) to screw the nut on while holding the spring in place.  So, instead of putting the nut on the screw and attaching it to the guitar all at once, I loosened the screw for the clamp (on the trem base) and then removed that clamp piece.  Then, I assembled the trem-bar group of parts on the clamp separately.  Having not one, but two washers, I put one between the trem bar and the screw head and one between the trem bar and the clamp. Finally, I reattached the clamp to the trem base.  I had to remove the neck pickup volume knob to get the clamping piece off and back onto the trem base. 

It was no fun trying to keep the distance between the two ends of the spring housing as small as possible at the same time as fitting the whole clamping piece + trem bar assemblage back on again.  As far as the spring housing goes--in other words, the space between the clamping piece and the seating on the guitar base--I put the rubber disc against the top/clamp circle, then inserted the spring, but now I wonder if the spring will stay inside its housing, given that I sort of assembled the whole thing blindly.

Thanks!

 

Edited July 2, 2021 by MetaRabbit
typo

[mihcmac]

Nice guitar.. Normally, just loosening the strings will take a enough tension off the tremolo will be enough to make it easier to work on.

Edited July 3, 2021 by mihcmac

[Larsongs]

Most Guitars you can turn the Trembar to the lowest position & close the case.. Even if it depresses the Trem bar a bit it usually won’t hurt anything……

I do it all the time with my 50th Anniv. 1961 Epi Casino which has the same Tremotone System…

Edited July 3, 2021 by Larsongs

[MetaRabbit]

Thanks guys.  What I am really looking for are instructions for how the term bar should be assembled.  I wish the seller had thougth to turn the bar to the lowest position, but he didn't, so now I have a 3D puzzle instead of a working trem bar.

[Larsongs]

How apart is it? Doesn’t look too complex..  if in doubt Gibson Customer Service & ask for one.. They should have it.. Good luck.. Or take it to a competent Luthier….

Edited July 9, 2021 by Larsongs

[mihcmac]

The Epiphone TREMOTONE Vibrato is a pretty basic design I doubt you will find instructions online .

The arm can be mounted using any one of the three holes depending on how much leverage you want..

 

Edited July 9, 2021 by mihcmac

[MetaRabbit]

On 7/9/2021 at 12:05 PM, Larsongs said:

How apart is it? Doesn’t look too complex..  if in doubt Gibson Customer Service & ask for one.. They should have it.. Good luck.. Or take it to a competent Luthier….

Thanks, Larssongs.  That's a good suggestion to try to get in touch with customer service as I actually didn't think about customer service and guitars as something that go together (appliances and customer service, yes, but for some reason not guitars.).  As for how complex it is, anything I can't figure out myself is by that fact "too complex".  The pieces were separate and arrived separate in a Zip-loc bag.  Beside the trem bar piece itself, the parts are a screw, two white plastic washers, a nut, a spring, and a soft rubber (?) disc.  If I put them together how I think they should go, the spring seems able to escape if I were to pull back on the tremolo too far.  Hopefully Epiphone/Gibson will be able to help.

[Larsongs]

In some Trems, Bigsby etc. once the Spring is in place you need to push the Trem all the way down to lock it in place… I’m not sure that’s the case with yours but you could ask Customer Service Tech Support at Gibson…

Good luck….

[mihcmac]

The TREMOTONE functions on a very similar principal as my Duesenberg.

The Duesenberg uses fewer screws to mount.

Edited July 13, 2021 by mihcmac

[ohmalien]

Did you ever have any luck with figuring out how the arm assembly works? I’m in the same predicament with trying to figure out how to piece it all back together.

[AndrewG]

On 7/8/2021 at 5:32 AM, MetaRabbit said:

Thanks guys.  What I am really looking for are instructions for how the term bar should be assembled.  I wish the seller had thougth to turn the bar to the lowest position, but he didn't, so now I have a 3D puzzle instead of a working trem bar.

I have a 2020 Crestwood 'reissue'. Do you have any idea why the bar the strings go through and over is machined in varying diameters? I've been puzzling over this as it looks like an attempt at intonation compensation-but that happens with the bridge saddles, so I'm a little confused as to what gives! I'm impressed with the trem system; stays in tune nicely with the GraphTech nut and saddles, and has a good positive feel.

[mihcmac]

18 hours ago, AndrewG said:

I have a 2020 Crestwood 'reissue'. Do you have any idea why the bar the strings go through and over is machined in varying diameters? I've been puzzling over this as it looks like an attempt at intonation compensation-but that happens with the bridge saddles, so I'm a little confused as to what gives! I'm impressed with the trem system; stays in tune nicely with the GraphTech nut and saddles, and has a good positive feel.

They call the tremolo on the Crestwood a Tremotone because it doesn't bend all of the strings at the same rate. The G and E string get less bend than the rest which can cause an effect on a chord, kind of like a pedal steel. Similar to a palm pedal.

Edited March 15, 2022 by mihcmac

[AndrewG]

2 hours ago, mihcmac said:

They call the tremolo on the Crestwood a Tremotone because it doesn't bend all of the strings at the same rate. The G and E string get less bend than the rest which can cause an effect on a chord, kind of like a pedal steel. Similar to a palm pedal.

Thanks for that, makes perfect sense;  all the bar diameters vary except the  G and  top  E which are the same, with the B being smallest.

[MetaRabbit]

On 2/20/2022 at 2:14 PM, ohmalien said:

Did you ever have any luck with figuring out how the arm assembly works? I’m in the same predicament with trying to figure out how to piece it all back together.

Sorry for the delay, ohmalien.  I was a virgin to forum boards when I posted my problem.  After I got responses that told me how basic and uncomplicated my problem was, I hadn't been back to this forum.  Unfortunately, I didn't figure it out and the guitar has been sitting in a case for nearly a year.  While a more well-adjusted person would have been comforted by the fact that, since it's a pretty basic design, there won't be any instructions online, I instead have decided to look into it further after not thinking about the guitar for months.  If I figure it out, I'll post the answer.

Clearly, the answer should be that there is a sequence in which the parts have to be put into place, with perhaps some parts needing to be held in place and put together simultaneously.  On the other hand, maybe Epiphone/Gibson designed it so that the spring is allowed to fall out.  Who knows at this point?

Edited May 7, 2022 by MetaRabbit

[Matt4356]

I didn't read all the answers so this may be here already but, the spring is supposed to be loose between the bottom 'cup' and the trem handle assembly.

The tension of the strings hold it in. Put it in loose, string it up, then try pulling the bar up enough for the spring to fall out. Your strings will break first. 

The screw and nut are to hold the bar on, you can move it for desired length. The washers go top and bottom of the spring.

You're over complicating it massively.

[mihcmac]