Waterslide Decal Experiment

[Dave F]

I've always like the look of the old Oahu decorations

I've seen where Alan Jackson had a custom Taylor made in that style

 

I'm getting ready to experiment on my own and try it with a waterslide decal. I did a sample print as shown below. I have an Alvarez out on loan and when I get it back, it will be the sacrificial lamb. I'll experiment with the size before printing . I'll make a couple of them and try it on a piece of finished stained wood before trying it on the guitar.

Anyone have experience with large waterslides?

 

[jedzep]

I've used many small ones, Dave, and surely the technique is the same, keeping everything wet and in motion through the positioning process.  The potential problem I see is that if you don't put a couple layers of lacquer over it, it will be super vulnerable to scratching off at the slightest contact.

[Hall]

Good Luck, Dave.   I think jedzep covered it just right.   

[dhanners623]

And from my plastic modeling days, I’d add that the surface needs to be VERY glossy and VERY smooth prior to application, otherwise you’ll get what is known as “silvering.” That’s when the decal film fails to adhere to the surface properly and light passes through the film and bounces back, giving a silvery appearance.

You might hit a hobby shop in search of a decal setting solution. They help with adherence and make the decal snuggle down.

And, yeah, you need some sort of clear gloss finish applied afterwards.

Edited July 18, 2021 by dhanners623

[QuestionMark]

I have a 1933 KayKraft arch top in my collection with the same (or substantially similar decal). Very cool.  

QM aka “ Jazzman” Jeff

[zombywoof]

I owned an early 1930s Kay Kraft Oahu "Nick Lucas" for many decades.  Thing cost $100 when new. If I recall the decorative stuff on the higher dollar guitars was stenciled  on.  I have read that furniture makers produced the stencils.  

Edited July 18, 2021 by zombywoof

[Dave F]

22 minutes ago, zombywoof said:

I owned an early 1930s Kay Kraft Oahu "Nick Lucas" for many decades.  Thing cost $100 when new. If I recall the decorative stuff on the higher dollar guitars was stenciled  on.  I have read that furniture makers produced the stencils.  

That’s what I’ve read also.  Most of the ones I’ve seen would take multi stage stencil to get all the design unless they do a little free hand. Either way that’s out of my skill level. I do believe I could make the stencil. 

[QuestionMark]

1 hour ago, zombywoof said:

I owned an early 1930s Kay Kraft Oahu "Nick Lucas" for many decades.  Thing cost $100 when new. If I recall the decorative stuff on the higher dollar guitars was stenciled  on.  I have read that furniture makers produced the stencils.  

Yep, the one I have on n my 1933 KayKraft is stenciled.   It also has the initials HKK or HK (I’m too tired to go and look if it’s two or three letters) stenciled by the design, which may or may not stand for Henry Kay Kuhrmeyer, the catalyst for the KayKraft guitars from that era and later Kay Guitars or it could stand for ? (not sure).

QM aka “ Jazzman” Jeff

Edited July 18, 2021 by QuestionMark

[Lars68]

I like the idea of personalizing guitars. I put a pinup girl, sporting a cowboy hat holding an acoustic on the back of my tele.

Hower, I think this particular decal looks a little too small on the guitar. It does not follow the edge of the lower bout. 

Lars

[zombywoof]

9 hours ago, QuestionMark said:

Yep, the one I have on n my 1933 KayKraft is stenciled.   It also has the initials HKK or HK (I’m too tired to go and look if it’s two or three letters) stenciled by the design, which may or may not stand for Henry Kay Kuhrmeyer, the catalyst for the KayKraft guitars from that era and later Kay Guitars or it could stand for ? (not sure).

QM aka “ Jazzman” Jeff

I have seen Kay Kraft/Kay guitars with the initials and also always assumed they stood for Kuhrmeyer who ran the company from the mid-1920s on.  They sure as heck have nothing to do with models as the company went with numbers sometimes followed by an A, B, or C which with Oahus designated square or factory round neck and  Kay Krafts whether the bodies were made with mahogany, maple or rosewood.

There was also, of course, decalcomania.  This is generally associated with lower priced guitars notably  Oscar Schmidts. 

[fortyearspickn]

Dave,  maybe you can make a headstock sized one for Sgt.Pepper that says  "MARTIN" to put on his new J45. 

[Dave F]

On 7/17/2021 at 10:43 AM, jedzep said:

I've used many small ones, Dave, and surely the technique is the same, keeping everything wet and in motion through the positioning process.  The potential problem I see is that if you don't put a couple layers of lacquer over it, it will be super vulnerable to scratching off at the slightest contact.

From what I'm reading the laser print does not need a finish applied. I'll check that out on the test piece of wood. If it turns out to need a lacquer finish I'll apply it to the decal before it is cut out.

20 hours ago, dhanners623 said:

And from my plastic modeling days, I’d add that the surface needs to be VERY glossy and VERY smooth prior to application, otherwise you’ll get what is known as “silvering.” That’s when the decal film fails to adhere to the surface properly and light passes through the film and bounces back, giving a silvery appearance.

You might hit a hobby shop in search of a decal setting solution. They help with adherence and make the decal snuggle down.

And, yeah, you need some sort of clear gloss finish applied afterwards.

Thanks, I'll get me some of that solution. From what I'm reading the laser print does not need a finish applied.

2 hours ago, Lars68 said:

I like the idea of personalizing guitars. I put a pinup girl, sporting a cowboy hat holding an acoustic on the back of my tele.

However, I think this particular decal looks a little too small on the guitar. It does not follow the edge of the lower bout. 

Lars

It will be sized correctly before applied. The one shown is just printed on a mylar material for checking out. The guitar I'm going to try it on is a parlor size (smaller than the one shown) and this size may be correct.

[dhanners623]

One bit of warning that I began wondering about after I posted my comment.... Most decal-setting solutions I used back in the day were ammonia-based. I have no idea if ammonia reacts with a nitro finish. Might be good to test it in a small, obscure area. Or ask a professional.

Also, if you've never visited the website of Stay Gold Guitars in New Mexico, do. They have plenty of old guitars with the decals/stenciling. Some great guitars to look at if you're in the market: https://staygoldguitars.com/

[75 Hummingbird]

Ahhh tattoos for guitars .. choose your designs carefully friends .

[E-minor7]

I kind of like it - and in a slightly parallel realm feel tempted too. But it had to be the real thing : paint and skills. Very hard to get the shadows rights, yes - but still. . 

[Dave F]

8 minutes ago, E-minor7 said:

I kind of like it - and in a slightly parallel realm feel tempted too. But it had to be the real thing : paint and skills. Very hard to get the shadows rights, yes - but still. . 

Wish I had the skills. I did purchase some light tack stencil material for a Cricut cutter (my daughter has one). I need to make some files to try it out. I think I would need two layouts to get the pattern then one for the highlights. That's on the back burner. I don't know how fine a detail I can get with the cricut.

[E-minor7]

41 minutes ago, Dave F said:

Wish I had the skills. I did purchase some light tack stencil material for a Cricut cutter (my daughter has one). I need to make some files to try it out. I think I would need two layouts to get the pattern then one for the highlights. That's on the back burner. I don't know how fine a detail I can get with the cricut.

Best of luck - look forward to the result. 

[Dave F]

Update -

I got the large (A3) Laser waterslide paper

I got my loaned out Alvarez back

Did some test prints on paper to adjust size

I tried to print on the decal paper but it kept jamming up in the printers we have at work

I took the file  and paper to FEDEX and they had no issues. Printed two sheets for $3

I need to get some acrylic spray to coated the decal. Then I'll trim it up better and test it on a piece of wood or maybe on the back of the guitar. I also have a couple "project" guitar bodies I may use.

 

 

[rbpicker]

Looking good…can’t wait to see how this turns out.  Good for you for pursuing this project.  Not for the faint of heart.

rb

[E-minor7]

29 minutes ago, rbpicker said:

Looking good…can’t wait to see how this turns out.  Good for you for pursuing this project.  Not for the faint of heart.

Copy that ^

[BigKahune]

Curious.  Interesting.

Can’t help following. 😎

 

[Dave F]

Got back to this tonight. I trimmed the decal fairly close but when I try to slide it off, it fell apart

Then I cut another one just around the outline

It slide off easier without falling apart

When I do the front, I'll still just cut the outline but get it closer to the shape.

It needs to dry for a few hours. I'll let it set overnight then check it out.

 

Edited September 11, 2021 by Dave F

[rbpicker]

Looking good Dave.  Keep the pics coming.  I love this project you’re doing.

rb

[Dave F]

When it dried it had a hazy look to it so I wet it down and took it off. 
back to he drawing board. 

[BigKahune]

I’m liked the look of it.

Too bad it dried hazy.

Is there higher quality waterslide paper?

I ask because I’ve used commercially made small waterslide decals before and they came out perfectly clear - only upon close inspection could you make out an edge.