Jump to content
Gibson Brands Forums

Thoughts on 1952 Historic J-185 vs Vintage J-45


gibpicker

Recommended Posts

Looking for some opinions on a guitar purchase. I recently sold off a late 50s LG-2 - incredible guitar, but my other acoustic is an old Martin 00-17 and I've just been wanting something a little bit bigger to go along with it, and decided the Martin was the keeper of those two. I was initially dead set on a vintage J-45, but then I remembered playing an iteration of the newer J-185's a couple years back (it was before the Historic series had been introduced I believe) that was really a killer guitar. I think it might've been a TV model? I haven't been able to find one of the new J-185 Historic's to play, but they sound awesome from the sound clips I've heard. I know they are supposed to be excellent strummers, but not sure how good they are for finger picking. Also with maple back and sides are they noticeably brighter than something with mahogany? I wish I could remember all the nuances of the one I played better.

On the flip side, I feel like the J-45 is the quintessential singer songwriter guitar (I'm a folk/singer songwriter type musician who plays unaccompanied about 90% of the time), and I have a line on two different ones from the mid-late 50s, have played both, and they're both excellent guitars and relatively fairly priced given the current market. I feel like a J-45 covers both strumming and finger picking about as well as a guitar can. I alternate between both with my playing, though I'm never really a heavy strummer, mostly just strum soft with a pick or using my thumb.

Anyway, I know it all comes down to personal preference, but I think I'm most interested to hear from anyone who has played the new J-185's and what their opinion is on them as an all arounder. I know what the J-45's are, the unknown of the J-185 is what's throwing me at the moment. General encouragements to just make up my damn mind already are also more than welcome. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That is a very tough decision to make. As you mentioned, the J-45 is the quintessential  singer songwriter guitar- almost to the point anymore of being a cliché. It would definitely be the just-a-little bit-bigger brother to your 00-17. The J-185 however, would be a totally different experience; from the visual, the tone, and the playing experience- even how it sits in your lap. The maple will have your playing style searching out the areas where you can hear it shine. For me it's the b a s s  note clarity, the punch, and the "report"/bite that maple gives when combined with that tight waist and short scale. There was a time when all of that was lost on me. Either that, or the one I briefly had a few years back wasn't the one

As far as encouragement in making up your mind, you can decide what you want to have alongside that  00-17: a bigger brother (J-45), or.  .  .   a 185, which would be a "wow" level contrast when you switch out with your mahogany Martin. 

Edited by 62burst
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I never really thought of the J45 as a "quintessential" folk singer/songwriter guitar.   For me they are a quintessential all around guitar.   But as Gibsons are voiced towards the mids they are all really good strummers.   I also agree with 62burst in that while neither of the guitars will have the headroom the long scale J200 has (which is one of the reasons my wife favors them) I would expect the J185 to sound a bit more percussive with more note bloom.   

Here is something odd though.  Two of the folkies whom I admire most  are Dave Van Ronk and  session player Bruce Langhorne.  They played  very different guitars but shared one quirk.  Van Ronk is best known for playing a Guild F-50R and Langhorne for a pre-War Martin 1-21.  Both, however, preferred playing with old strings stating they could not get the sound they wanted out of new strings. 

Edited by zombywoof
Link to comment
Share on other sites

59 minutes ago, zombywoof said:

I never really thought of the J45 as a "quintessential" folk singer/songwriter guitar.   For me they are a quintessential all around guitar.   

and . . . 

I would expect the J185 to sound a bit more percussive with more note bloom.   

Yeah,  the definition of folk music does span several decades and many have stretched it’s definition.

 

Although I don’t hear much latent note bloom (like some of the folkies who might’ve been playing rosewood slothead Martins may have been hearing ) on mine, thanks to that (mini)  jumbo shape (?), it does have  excellent balance across the eq, and it throws that percussive sound out there more quickly than bigger acoustic boxes.

Edited by 62burst
Link to comment
Share on other sites

My experience with my J185 was pretty different from your strummer vs finger picker info.  Now my J185 was Koa and not maple but to me it was a great guitar for finger style but for me my J45 was what i wanted in a strummer.  Since i mostly flat pick I sold the J185.  However those early James Taylor albums make a pretty good case for the J45 as a finger style guitar don’t they?  Play both if you can.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When somebody figures out what makes a good fingerpicker please let me know.  Many though feel it comes to down string spacing and that fingerpickers need more room.  Then again, Mississippi John Hurt and Dave Van Ronk played Guilds with 1 5/8" nut and a string spacing at the bridge of somewhere around 2 1/8" to 2 2/8."  So much for that theory.  

But when I think of fingerpicking a Gibson J45/50  the guys who immediately come to mind are  Lightning Hopkins, and Jorma.  In case anybody needs to be reminded:

 Mann's Fate - Jorma Kaukonen & Jack Casady (Hot Tuna) 1969 - Bing video

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As you suggest Zombywoof, there really isn’t a set formula and since i suck at it I am not a good resource.  One thing I have always had in the back of my mind is balance and that describes the J185 to a tee.  The good thing here is how could you go wrong, j45 or J185.  Life is good!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks all for the thoughts! I ended up taking the plunge on one of the 50s J-45's. The more I thought about it, the more I realized I would keep asking myself "what if" if I'd gone with the J-185. The J-45 is what I've lusted after for quite some time. So sometime next week I'll have a beautiful late 50s J-45 in my hands! I'll follow up here once I have it. Thanks again for the posts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So very different guitars, it’s almost required to own both!  It’s more of a chore to find a stellar J-185, but when you do, they’re hard to tonally purge from your mind.  The good news is, you already know what your next guitar should be.

For me (substitute a J-50 for the J-45), they would be the last guitars standing if I were forced to thin the herd.

Oh & btw, congrats on acquiring the J-45!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pre-Congrats!    Sometimes, faced with difficult decisions,   I try to imagine myself a few years down the road asking myself  "Do you regret having made that decision?"   Sort of  adds, artificially, the element of  perspective.   20/20 Hindsight Lite !     

Don't tell my other 2 guitars - but my J-45  will be the one they pry from my cold, dead hands !   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...