retrorod Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Hey retrorod-- I suppose you're right. It's the teacher in me that never wants to give up on this sort of thread. And it's incidents like these--here' date=' at school, and in the rest of the world--that remind me time and again that education is not the final answer to our problems because education only works with people who first know they need to learn something about a given issue. By the way, that is a nice set of guitars in your signature: is that one in front an ES-125? You have a nice eye for guitar finishes; that set looks nice--and looks nice togther. Ignatius [/quote'] Thanks Ignatius, for the compliment on my guitars! Lucky shot, I guess! Yes, the front left one is a '53 ES-125...all original....So grandpa sez!!....Exceptin' for the Schaller roller bridge(original rosewood bridge in the case) I have a particular attraction for the vintage tobacco bursts as well as cherry bursts! Sometimes a few natural tops find their way into my heart and collection though. As far as teaching goes...I'm all for it,as long as I have a willing participant. I love to learn and love to share! As far as Gibsones125's 'dialog' goes...I believe he is pulling everyones leg in the name of entertainment...What say you, Gibsones125??? Come on brother...give it up. That there Gibsons about as original as a 'warmed-up twice' cup of Starbucks coffee...!! Tell it to the Gruhn Man!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius Posted March 11, 2008 Share Posted March 11, 2008 Thanks Ignatius' date=' for the compliment on my guitars! Lucky shot, I guess! Yes, the front left one is a '53 ES-125...all original....So grandpa sez!!....Exceptin' for the Schaller roller bridge(original rosewood bridge in the case)[/quote'] Hey retrorod-- Any particular reason why you went with a roller bridge rather than the ABR-1 type? I'm tempted to move to an adjustable bridge on my box when it comes back from the shop because then I could do more set-up stuff on the fly. Horsing around with the rosewood bridge can take a whole afternoon just because I wanted to try a different set of strings. Or maybe while it's there, I'll just tell them to throw a new adjustable bridge on it if they have any in stock. Oh, and I forgot to say: yeah, Mr. Gruhn would take care of this thread's guitar problem in about thirty seconds, and that includes the time it would take him to get the case on the workbench and open the latches. Of course, who is Mr. Gruhn when you already know what you've got? Ignatius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deletedaccount Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 Thanks Ignatius' date=' for the compliment on my guitars! Lucky shot, I guess! Yes, the front left one is a '53 ES-125...all original....So grandpa sez!!....Exceptin' for the Schaller roller bridge(original rosewood bridge in the case) I have a particular attraction for the vintage tobacco bursts as well as cherry bursts! Sometimes a few natural tops find their way into my heart and collection though. As far as teaching goes...I'm all for it,as long as I have a willing participant. I love to learn and love to share! As far as Gibsones125's 'dialog' goes...I believe he is pulling everyones leg in the name of entertainment...What say you, Gibsones125??? Come on brother...give it up. That there Gibsons about as original as a 'warmed-up twice' cup of Starbucks coffee...!! Tell it to the Gruhn Man!! [/quote'] It is origional, I talked to the guys at gibson, they said everything on it is origional except maybe for the pickgaurd. Other than that they can't verify that it's an authentic gibson because of the metal tag at the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 It is origional' date=' I talked to the guys at gibson, they said everything on it is origional except maybe for the pickgaurd. Other than that they can't verify that it's an authentic gibson because of the metal tag at the top.[/quote'] Clearly you misunderstood them if your last sentence above is a correct report of what they said. If Gibson said that they cannot verify it is an authentic Gibson, then there is no way they can verify anything on it is original. Companies only verify equipment on their own guitars. If they don't know it is their guitar, they have just proven our point: it so clearly is not an unmodified ES-125 that they don't even recognize it. Do you understand? If you what they said in your last sentence is true, they just told you they don't even know if it an ES-125. That's actually worse news than what we have been saying. Ignatius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLiveSoundGuy Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Gibsones125 said :D . Then we said, . Then Gibsones125 said, . Then we said, :D . Then Gibsones125 said, . Then we said, . Then Gibsones125 said, . Then we said, . and then Gibsones125 said, . So I say, Smile and wave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 I guess I just want to see if he now is going to say that Gibson is wrong. Once we reach that point, then I will be sure this thread has moved through the looking glass and on into Wonderland. Ignatius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLiveSoundGuy Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 they can't verify that it's an authentic gibson because of the metal tag at the top. Now that I think about it' date=' if the above quote is true, that means GrandPa was [b']WRONG[/b] doesn't it? And if you think those tuners are from Gibson, then you and GrandPa best best put down your pipes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deletedaccount Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 Hi XXXXXX, We are unable to determine if it was a custom order since we have no existing records from that time frame. Even a custom shop model would not have a guitar case logo plate on the headstock however. Regards, XXXXXXXXX Gibson customer service service@gibson.com For schematics, repair tips, FAQs , Authorized Service Center locations and more, please visit the Gibson Customer Service website at http://www.gibson.com/Service/. For 24/7 Customer Service, call us at 1-800-4GIBSON. You can also email us anytime at service@gibson.com. AOL Instant Messenger, Yahoo! Messenger, & MSN Messenger users can now IM Gibson Customer Service at customer.service1@gibson.com! Gibson Customer Service Instant Messenger is available 9:00am-4:00pm CST Monday-Friday. To locate a Gibson Dealer in your area, please visit http://www.gibson.com/Dealers/ ***CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication is considered a private and proprietary exchange between Gibson Musical Instruments and its customers, and is intended for the eyes of the original recipient(s) only. This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. *** From: XXXXXXXX[mailto:XXXXXX@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 4:29 PM To: XXXXXXXXXX Subject: RE: 1966/1967 Gibson es-125 - Rare well, if that's the case, could it be a custom guitar? My grandpa didn't factory order it. XXXXXXXXX<XXXXXXXXX@gibson.com> wrote: Hello XXXXXXX, In Gibson’s files there is no listings of an instrument with a logo plate on the headstock as was used on the Gibson cases. Regards, XXXXXXXXXX Gibson customer service service@gibson.com For schematics, repair tips, FAQs , Authorized Service Center locations and more, please visit the Gibson Customer Service website at http://www.gibson.com/Service/. For 24/7 Customer Service, call us at 1-800-4GIBSON. You can also email us anytime at service@gibson.com. AOL Instant Messenger, Yahoo! Messenger, & MSN Messenger users can now IM Gibson Customer Service at customer.service1@gibson.com! Gibson Customer Service Instant Messenger is available 9:00am-4:00pm CST Monday-Friday. To locate a Gibson Dealer in your area, please visit http://www.gibson.com/Dealers/ ***CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication is considered a private and proprietary exchange between Gibson Musical Instruments and its customers, and is intended for the eyes of the original recipient(s) only. This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. *** From: XXXXXXXX[mailto:XXXXXX@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2008 2:53 PM To: XXXXXXXXX Subject: RE: 1966/1967 Gibson es-125 - Rare Well, evidently they put those on guitars. My grandpa didn't buy it used, never had any refinishing or repairing work done to it. It doesn't have a silkscreen logo on it and the thing is 41 years old according to your serial numbers. If the serial number on the back of this things head points to 1967 in your records then it evidently is a Gibson because it was burnt into the back of the head just like every other Gibson's from the 60's were. If you can't authenticate it as a Gibson just because of that name plate, you don't think it could be a custom guitar? My grandpa didn't custom order it, but if someone ordered a custom es-125 and it never got picked up, my grandpa coulda been the one to end up buying it. Is that a possibility? XXXXXXXX<XXXXXXXXX@gibson.com> wrote: That plate is off a case, Gibson never installed those on guitars. If he bought it that way it was definitely used. I cannot authenticate this guitar. Regards, XXXXXXXXX Gibson customer service service@gibson.com For schematics, repair tips, FAQs , Authorized Service Center locations and more, please visit the Gibson Customer Service website at http://www.gibson.com/Service/. For 24/7 Customer Service, call us at 1-800-4GIBSON. You can also email us anytime at service@gibson.com. AOL Instant Messenger, Yahoo! Messenger, & MSN Messenger users can now IM Gibson Customer Service at customer.service1@gibson.com! Gibson Customer Service Instant Messenger is available 9:00am-4:00pm CST Monday-Friday. To locate a Gibson Dealer in your area, please visit http://www.gibson.com/Dealers/ ***CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication is considered a private and proprietary exchange between Gibson Musical Instruments and its customers, and is intended for the eyes of the original recipient(s) only. This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. *** From: XXXXXXXXXX[mailto:XXXXXX@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:38 PM To: XXXXXXXXXX Subject: RE: 1966/1967 Gibson es-125 - Rare My grandpa bought the guitar brand new with that brass plate logo on it. It was bought with that finish also, and everything on it is origional, can you tell me more? XXXXXXXX<XXXXXXXX@gibson.com> wrote: Hello XXXXXXX, This serial number is consistent with 1967. I can’t confirm however that this is an authentic Gibson. The brass plate on the headstock is off of a Gibson guitar case and has been installed by someone on the head of this guitar. Regards, XXXXXXXXXX Gibson customer service service@gibson.com For schematics, repair tips, FAQs , Authorized Service Center locations and more, please visit the Gibson Customer Service website at http://www.gibson.com/Service/. For 24/7 Customer Service, call us at 1-800-4GIBSON. You can also email us anytime at service@gibson.com. AOL Instant Messenger, Yahoo! Messenger, & MSN Messenger users can now IM Gibson Customer Service at customer.service1@gibson.com! Gibson Customer Service Instant Messenger is available 9:00am-4:00pm CST Monday-Friday. To locate a Gibson Dealer in your area, please visit http://www.gibson.com/Dealers/ ***CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This communication is considered a private and proprietary exchange between Gibson Musical Instruments and its customers, and is intended for the eyes of the original recipient(s) only. This e-mail message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. *** From: XXXXXXXXXX [mailto:XXXXXX@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:34 AM To: Customer Service Subject: 1966/1967 Gibson es-125 - Rare Hey, It is a 1966/1967 Gibson es-125. It was bought brand new, by my grandpa in 1967, and it has never been modified. It was sold to man named Vick Wallace, and then my grandpa bought it back. Still no modifications. My grandpa then gave it to me two years ago as a christmas present. I think this is a rare version of an es-125 because of the information I found on the back of the metal embossed gibson logo. It says: Gibson Es-125 I - 017 1955 The serial number is burnt into the back of the headstock: 867010 I don't know what the I-017 is but I know that 1955 is the date on my grandpas other Gibson es-125. He owned two. These guitars were bought all origional, but I will send you only pictures of the one that is a bit out of the ordinary. Is this a rare model es-125? Is it a rare finish? What might be the value? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Or, to summarize both the emails from Gibson and this entire thread: This guitar has been modified so much that: a) Gibson customer service cannot verify the guitar is even a Gibson; as everyone said, the guitar is not in its original condition; c) there is no way at this time to prove anything other than that this might be an ES-125 that has been modified heavily and so has lost much of its value as a vintage guitar. Gibsones125-- I truly do not think you or your grandfather is lying. I think the bad news is this: someone sold a used guitar that had been heavily modified to your grandfather, but the seller told your grandfather it was new. Your grandfather thought he bought a new instrument, and so he probably paid too much for a guitar that shows heavy and fairly shoddy work done to make it look like something else. And where in the world did you get from those Gibson emails that they said everything was original? I don't see anywhere in that email where Gibson says anything about the guitar being original. I see "unable to authenticate" several times, though. Ignatius Oh, one more thing: don't go back to the guitar shop where the guy told you this guitar was worth $8000. The guy there is either a con man or knows almost nothing about Gibson guitars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Hey retrorod-- Any particular reason why you went with a roller bridge rather than the ABR-1 type? I'm tempted to move to an adjustable bridge on my box when it comes back from the shop because then I could do more set-up stuff on the fly. Horsing around with the rosewood bridge can take a whole afternoon just because I wanted to try a different set of strings. Or maybe while it's there, I'll just tell them to throw a new adjustable bridge on it if they have any in stock. Oh, and I forgot to say: yeah, Mr. Gruhn would take care of this thread's guitar problem in about thirty seconds, and that includes the time it would take him to get the case on the workbench and open the latches. Of course, who is Mr. Gruhn when you already know what you've got? Ignatius [/quote Hey Ignatius, This is my 3rd attempt at a reply...My internet service has been intermitant and I have lost my last two replies. First of, thanks for fighting the 'good fight'! Your point is well taken and proven by the response!! On the roller bridge. I did'nt choose that. It was what came with the guitar when I bought! Typically, more suited to a trem or bigsby-equipped guitar....it works fine for me. I was fortunate that the previous owner after several weeks....found and gave me the original rosewood bridge as well as the original Kluson tuners...Ba-bing!! The roller bridge is attached on top of a moveable wood bridge base. I simply make a mark in the top for repositioning the bridge after string changes. That way I don,t spend hours on setting the intonation again!...RRod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deletedaccount Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 Well, Ima say one more thing then im not gonna watch this topic anymore so to heck with it. I don't care what you guys say, all I wanted to do is find out more about my guitar. Ya'll can say it might not be authentic or that it's heavily modified. But, as far as my grandpa says (yes i said Grandpa Says), It's origional. And I'm gonna go with what a man i've known my entire life says over somebody who says different over a computer. After all the aggravation, thanks for helping me know more about my guitar. And I say this all because: 1)Sentimental Value 2)It's been in my family for 41 years and my Dad remembers my grandpa playing it since he was a kid, with the exact same looks as it has now. 3)If Gibson says they can't verify it's authentic that just means they can't legitamately prove it was made by them. It might have and some idiot at gibson might not have recorded it. 4)It has a great sound to it, one of the best guitars I may ever find, student model or not. Thanks for helping me learn more about my guitar and the broad ES family. (I say this without sarcasm, truthfully, no strings attached.) And who knows? there might be another one like it, it just hasnt been put out there for everyone to see yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignatius Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Ya'll can say it might not be authentic or that it's heavily modified. But' date=' as far as my grandpa says (yes i said Grandpa Says), It's origional. And I'm gonna go with what a man i've known my entire life says over somebody who says different over a computer. After all the aggravation, thanks for helping me know more about my guitar.[/quote'] So Gibsones125, just to be clear, you are choosing to believe your grandfather rather than the company you say made the guitar because when Gibson says they cannot authenticate it, they are saying that as far as they are concerned, the guitar has been changed too much to be verified as their product. You are not saying we are lying; you are saying that Gibson is lying. Simple as that. And I say this all because: 1)Sentimental Value 2)It's been in my family for 41 years and my Dad remembers my grandpa playing it since he was a kid, with the exact same looks as it has now. All that is great, Gibsones125, but that is exactly what we told you when this thread started: we were telling you to enjoy it and to appreciate it. "Original" and "authentic" are not words you get to define as "my family loves this guitar"; they are words that mean the guitar was actually the model it claims to be and is in the condition it was orginally built. As several of us said, our ES-125s have been modified as well. We were not saying your guitar was junk; we were just saying it is not all original. You don't have the right to redefine these words to fit your world. 3)If Gibson says they can't verify it's authentic that just means they can't legitamately prove it was made by them. It might have and some idiot at gibson might not have recorded it. And if you choose to believe that, then I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn as well--or perhaps you'd prefer some choice swampland in Florida. Is what you said possible? Of course, but the guitar would not look as shoddy and amateurish as does your guitar. 4)It has a great sound to it, one of the best guitars I may ever find, student model or not. This also is something we were all saying from the beginning, too, so it's not a point in your favor. However, the fact that the guitar is a student model further proves that Gibson was unlikely to make a custom model as you keep insisting. And who knows? there might be another one like it, it just hasnt been put out there for everyone to see yet. Look, I know I am beating my head against a wall here, but I have to stress this because this sort of mindset is what makes the guitar market such a mess. If you want to believe that a guitar has priceless sentimental value, that is fantastic. But sentimental value does not change the real value of a guitar--or the reality that it has been altered by someone. Instead of living in that fantasy that you own some priceless treasure, why don't you live the better truth? You own a guitar that your grandfather used to make beautiful music even though it was run through the ringer by some previous owner. That is a great story, and it is one that you will love even more when you're older. Ignatius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibson CS Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 the easy way to solve the problem ITS A JAZZ BOX WHO CARES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (playful sarcasim, dont jump my ****) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 I'm willing to bet....there isn't another one 'out there' exactly like it! It truly is....well...'one-of-a-kind' ! At any rate, enjoy it and cherish the memories that it has brought and will continue to bring you and your family for many years to come, and I mean that sincerely and not in a sarcastic way....RRod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cod Posted June 25, 2008 Share Posted June 25, 2008 My goodness!. I feel obliged to keep this thread alive. I am laughing pretty hard. I actually registered just now so that I could respond. But seriously, I just bought myself a 50's 125 on ebay for about 850$. I'm pretty excited. . Looks 'origionol' . it's certainly not worth 8000$, but I think I got a decent price. More importantly is the fun part of setting it up , flipping the strings (sorry I'm a lefty- you try and find a vintage lefty box that wasn't 'origionoly' a righty. ..... I will let you know how it goes....someday I will give it to my grandchild and (s)he can tell the world how great these guitars are, right ? as far as 125's having Gibson on the headstock- i think they were made with pearl logo inlay and silkscreen, according to bluebook i just read. My guess is that gibsones125's guitar is a gibson 125 that somebody refinished long ago, and the headstock refinish made the silkscreen 'gibson' lost for good. So some fellow took one of a gibson case and put it on top. I would guess its worth a little less than an original 50's 125 - somewhere around 650-1000$ dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobv Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 I have my grandfather's guitar, a Gretsch New Yorker archtop - learned to play on it more or less. Poppy repeatedly told me he bought it second hand at a wedding in 1939. Great story. Gretsch only made the New Yorker in 1947 and 1948. Doesn't mean I cherish the guitar any less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue rondo Posted July 25, 2008 Share Posted July 25, 2008 I had a woman call me one time to tell me she had a 200+ year old wooden icebox she wanted to sell me. She said it had been in her family for 200+ years. I thought, I had to see this. I got to her house and found a wooden bodied electric refrigerator from the 1930's. I asked her if she knew when electricity was invented. She said "Ben Franklin". I just smiled. There was nothing I could say that would convince her that her "icebox" wasn't 200 years old . . . so I left. Kind of like this thread . . . some times you just have to walk away. BTW, I'm going to an auction tomorrow where they are selling a 1962 Gibson ES 330TD with a Bigsby tailpiece. Supposedlly in excellent original condition. Anyone interested? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ighut Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 So I shouldn't be looking for the ES-125 that's missing this headstock nameplate? It's actually out of an old SG case and been rattling around in a parts drawer for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksdaddy Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I've got one of those. I super glued it to a money clip. Looks cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ighut Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I had stuck it on an old Speed Demon just for fun, but after reading all this, thought best to take it off so as to not lead anyone else down a similar fruitless search. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sangandongo Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 My granddad has a pair of shoes with that logo on it. They're original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waterndirt Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 I can't believe I just read all of that... it was kinda like crack! i just kept reading! Fun stuff guys. Way to know your gee-tars! In all honesty I'm in the market for an ES 125. Bueler? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freak show Posted March 19, 2010 Share Posted March 19, 2010 This very strange thread is two years old... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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