DGalloway Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 My mom passed away several years ago. I have her old Gibson acoustic guitar. She always told me it was a J-45. It has the scroll banner and is a natural finish which could mean it is a J-50. I can't find any trace of a serial number in it. Any help as to what I have and it's worth would be greatly appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 You have a gorgeous 40's era Banner J50, worth somewhere in the 5K zone, at least. The back of the peghead has the look of overspray, but photos can lie. Maybe you can see a hint of a number printed inside up on the neck block, but prob not after all this time. What a sweet gift, and hopefully sweet memory. If you don't already play, it's time to start! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grog Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 I just recently read the book “Kalamazoo Gals” by John Thomas. It’s all about the banner guitars & the gals that built them during WWII. He went into the guitars pretty extensively. You may be able to contact the author for info……. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 Yep, and likely to chime in here soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 (edited) You have a 1942-1943 J50. Only thing that looks to be non-original are the tuners. There will be a FON on the neck block which if you can make out will confirm the year built. I do own one. This site will help you sort things out. BannerGibsons.com Edited January 12, 2022 by zombywoof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanvillRob Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, DGalloway said: My mom passed away several years ago. I have her old Gibson acoustic guitar. She always told me it was a J-45. It has the scroll banner and is a natural finish which could mean it is a J-50. I can't find any trace of a serial number in it. Any help as to what I have and it's worth would be greatly appreciated. Beautiful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 Gorgeous! I believe it's a refinished Banner J-45 (J-50s all had multiple purflings on the top and back). Is there a number stamped on the neck block (inside, where the neck comes into the body)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Grog said: I just recently read the book “Kalamazoo Gals” by John Thomas. It’s all about the banner guitars & the gals that built them during WWII. He went into the guitars pretty extensively. You may be able to contact the author for info……. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, jt said: I believe it's a refinished Banner J-45 (J-50s all had multiple purflings on the top and back). I agree with that assessment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 What you have there is not a newly found sonet of Alexander Dumas - but it's something in that direction. Whether you pass it on or keep the treasure - Congratulations Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimt Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 Cool. I like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGalloway Posted January 13, 2022 Author Share Posted January 13, 2022 4 hours ago, jt said: Gorgeous! I believe it's a refinished Banner J-45 (J-50s all had multiple purflings on the top and back). Is there a number stamped on the neck block (inside, where the neck comes into the body)? None that can be read. My Mom had it since the late 50's or early 60's. If it was refinished, she wasn't aware of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGalloway Posted January 13, 2022 Author Share Posted January 13, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 Such wonderful instrument to inherit from your mom - Enjoy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 5 hours ago, jt said: Gorgeous! I believe it's a refinished Banner J-45 (J-50s all had multiple purflings on the top and back). Is there a number stamped on the neck block (inside, where the neck comes into the body)? I just went and checked and yup mine has multi-ply top and back binding. So should the FON be illegible would the combination of the 7- ply rosette and single ply top binding narrow down the build date? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhanners623 Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 What a legacy for your mother to leave you. What kind of music did she play? As jedzep said, if you don’t already play, learn. That guitar needs to sing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 7 hours ago, zombywoof said: I just went and checked and yup mine has multi-ply top and back binding. So should the FON be illegible would the combination of the 7- ply rosette and single ply top binding narrow down the build date? The fancy rosette and single ply binding point to 1943. IMHO, we can't make much of the absence of an FON. Sometimes they fade to oblivion and I'm convinced that sometimes the Gals simply forgot to stamp a number on the neck block. So, my best guess: a refinished 1943 J-45. Cool guitar! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 8 hours ago, DGalloway said: None that can be read. My Mom had it since the late 50's or early 60's. If it was refinished, she wasn't aware of it. Thanks! It's a very cool guitar. Thank you for sharing it with us. Here's a short read about the women who built your guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 (edited) If that's refinished, someone did an awesome job. I have a '36 L00 rescue that was abused with palm sanders in an ag & tech college luthier class, but I was still able to detect minor signs that it had a burst (under bridge, interior overspray, etc), not daring to sand anymore at the heel joint. What does the back look like, DG? Dave Edited January 13, 2022 by jedzep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 Unless it is really professionally done, a refinish leaves open pores in the wood, particularly in mahogany. This is what you see on the back of the headstock of this guitar. Carefully-lighted photos of the back, sides, and top would probably show if this is a refinish or not. If it is a refinish, it is probably a very old refinish. At some point, the original open back tuners were replaced with slightly newer closed-back Klusons of a style that came in in the late 1940s and early 1950s. ZW may have a better idea of the date of the tuners. This is a nice instrument, but only a first-hand inspection inside and out by someone really knowledgeable might pin it down more definitively. JT's assessment is the most rational in the absence of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 2 hours ago, jt said: The fancy rosette and single ply binding point to 1943. IMHO, we can't make much of the absence of an FON. Sometimes they fade to oblivion and I'm convinced that sometimes the Gals simply forgot to stamp a number on the neck block. So, my best guess: a refinished 1943 J-45. Cool guitar! If you go back far enough myself and I am sure others who owned Banner J50s believed they were re-finished J45s because sources such as the Fabulous Flat-Top book stated the model was not introduced until 1947. I did not know about mine until I signed up with UMGF and you clued me into what I had. I then recall waiting as patiently as I could for your book to come out. While I have a couple of guitar books people gave me. to this day the only two I have gone out and bought were yours and Neil Harpe's "Stella Book." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGalloway Posted January 13, 2022 Author Share Posted January 13, 2022 It was in fantastic condition until a guy asked to borrow it at a bluegrass festival and his belt buckle scratched the back all up, and an inebriated uncle provided the pick scratches across the front. We went to a lot of bluegrass festivals in the 60's and early 70's. Had Bill Monroe and Ralph Stanley over to our home, at different times, for a meal. Great memories. I believe my Brother-in-law, John Farley, changed the tuners for her in the late 70's to early 80's as the originals had worn out. Site isn't letting me post the back picture due to size, I'll try and get resolution down so I can share it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGalloway Posted January 13, 2022 Author Share Posted January 13, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 3 hours ago, j45nick said: Unless it is really professionally done, a refinish leaves open pores in the wood, particularly in mahogany. This is what you see on the back of the headstock of this guitar. Carefully-lighted photos of the back, sides, and top would probably show if this is a refinish or not. If it is a refinish, it is probably a very old refinish. At some point, the original open back tuners were replaced with slightly newer closed-back Klusons of a style that came in in the late 1940s and early 1950s. ZW may have a better idea of the date of the tuners. This is a nice instrument, but only a first-hand inspection inside and out by someone really knowledgeable might pin it down more definitively. JT's assessment is the most rational in the absence of that. Well stated. To clarify, I think that only the top may have been refinished, subject to 2 caveats: 1. Gibson being Gibson, never say never. It's certainly more than possible that Gibson produced a natural topped J-45 circa 1943. 2. I certainly cannot conclude anything definitively from photos. And, again, thanks for sharing your cool guitar with us, OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 2 hours ago, zombywoof said: If you go back far enough myself and I am sure others who owned Banner J50s believed they were re-finished J45s because sources such as the Fabulous Flat-Top book stated the model was not introduced until 1947. I did not know about mine until I signed up with UMGF and you clued me into what I had. I then recall waiting as patiently as I could for your book to come out. While I have a couple of guitar books people gave me. to this day the only two I have gone out and bought were yours and Neil Harpe's "Stella Book." Thank you, kind sir! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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